2018-19 Season | Point Guard Discussion

[hcsilla]

He's the 2nd best player on the team with the 2nd best record in the league so I have to think they are going to try and keep him.

Their 2nd best player is Middleton and every time I watch the Bucks I always get the impression of Brogdon being a more useful and effective player than Bledsoe despite the advanced stats saying otherwise.

 

[Hoop Head]

What is it with teams giving up on their players from the 2017 draft already? Philly wants to move Fultz, the Lakers have been rumored to move Ball at various times, the Knicks want to ditch French Frank, Dallas wants to move Smith Jr, and a good amount of Suns fans want Jackson moved. I don't know if there's anything to support Jackson has been shopped but it wouldn't surprise me to learn he's been thrown out there a couple times, similar to Ball, in deals that would be a bit too favorable for us. These players aren't even halfway into their sophomore seasons right now. The instant gratification of the league has stepped up a notch. I know Utah fans have complained about Mitchell a good bit also, but I don't think they've explored any trades. Just wait until high school players are allowed to enter the league again in 2022.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Their 2nd best player is Middleton and every time I watch the Bucks I always get the impression of Brogdon being a more useful and effective player than Bledsoe despite the advanced stat saying otherwise.

I don't think so, at least not this season. When I've watched them play, Bledsoe has appeared to be their best player not named Giannis. And looking at stats, the advantage again goes to Eric. Middleton outscores him by 1.6 per game but Eric has a clear advantage in stats including PER, TS%, WS and VORP.

 

[Hoop Head]

Bledsoe in Milwaukee is weird. I don't know if I'd say he's their 2nd best player or not but that's mainly because the gap between Giannis and everyone else on the Bucks is huge. Middleton, Bledsoe, Brogdan, and even Brook Lopez has looked really good there. Middleton is the only one whose skillset doesn't get in Giannis' way though. Bledsoe needs to drive to be efficient and that clogs the lane. Brogdan does the same except he doesn't attack like Bledsoe does. Middleton is a shooter and that opens things up for Giannis more. Lopez's game has moved farther from the basket and he tends to stay clear of the paint more than Bledsoe does also. It doesn't really matter who #2 is because that team will only go as far as Giannis takes them. I don't think any of the other starters impact the game enough to help them win a decent amount on their own.

 

[BC867]

I visited with my older son, daughter-in-law and grandson. 'Didn't want her to spend the day in the kitchen so we went out for, of all things, a Chinese lunch.

In the evening we toured some of the spectacular house displays where they live in Goodyear. And planned our visit to McCormick Railroad Park in Scottsdale in February to celebrate a couple of birthdays -- my grandson's and mine.

To the whole ASFN gang, a very Merry Christmas and a great 2019.

 

[Errntknght]

Their 2nd best player is Middleton and every time I watch the Bucks I always get the impression of Brogdon being a more useful and effective player than Bledsoe despite the advanced stats saying otherwise.

Other years perhaps but Middleton is not even up to average for SFs in offensive effeciency this year. FG% is off 5 pctage pts and TO are up... Both Bled and Brogdan have got their off eff well above average this year.

 

[Mainstreet]

Their 2nd best player is Middleton and every time I watch the Bucks I always get the impression of Brogdon being a more useful and effective player than Bledsoe despite the advanced stats saying otherwise.

This would have been my first reaction as well. I guess the stats do not support it.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

The Pelicans are now in 14th place in the West and sliding...If they trade AD by necessity, any chance Jrue Holiday could be had?

 

[elindholm]

The Pelicans are now in 14th place in the West and sliding...If they trade AD by necessity, any chance Jrue Holiday could be had?

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

I remember that. I was in favor of bringing him in eventually (as in around now), but worried about it messing up our draft position if we brought him in at the time. Seems like a no-brainer now if possible.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

His age is fine. His game would be great for this team. Don't think we could get him.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

We have enough young pieces on the roster already. If we don't have to give up too much to make it happen than I am all for it. Holiday likely has at least 4-5 good seasons left in him (only 28 so could be more) and he is locked in for the next 2 years after this. It could really jump start this team into winning games.

 

[SirStefan32]

The Pelicans are now in 14th place in the West and sliding...If they trade AD by necessity, any chance Jrue Holiday could be had?

As I watched the game against the Mavs, I was thinking the same thing. Holiday would be a PERFECT point guard for this team. Trading for Holiday could be tricky, as he makes around 26M if I remember correctly. With Ariza, Chandler, Arthur, and Rivers bought out, the Suns are thin on contracts, unless someone is willing to take Anderson. Jackson, Bender, Daniels combine for about $14M. Warren would likely need to be included due to his 11.7M contract. I think the Suns would have to send close to $20M back, and I don't see how they can get it done. I am not sure if a draft pick counts as "salary."
Basically, I'd offer our pick, Bucks pick, JJ, Bender and Daniels as expiring contracts, and I am guessing that Warren would need to be included. They can also wait until the offseason and do a sigh and trade involving Oubre. Or hell, they might take Anderson with enough picks?

 

[SirStefan32]

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

I think I objected to his contract, but honestly, I did not realize how good he was. I still think he is overpaid, but he is an ideal fit next to Booker. He can facilitate, shoot, and defend. Outside of Booker and Ayton, I'd trade anything for that kid. If we could also keep Warren, that would be great, but he shouldn't be off the table.

Holiday is one of the best defenders in the league, and probably THE best defender at his position. If Suns could acquire him, and Bridges develops as expected, they could have the best defensive PG and the best defensive SF in the NBA.

 

[Hoop Head]

I mentioned Holiday before but was told he didn't fit the timeline.

I remember that but I remember his salary being more of an issue than his age. He's making over $25 million a year and I believe he has 3 seasons after this one on his deal.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I remember that but I remember his salary being more of an issue than his age. He's making over $25 million a year and I believe he has 3 seasons after this one on his deal.

Last season is a player option so it may very well be 2 more seasons and then he opts out looking for a last payday.

 

[JCSunsfan]

As I watched the game against the Mavs, I was thinking the same thing. Holiday would be a PERFECT point guard for this team. Trading for Holiday could be tricky, as he makes around 26M if I remember correctly. With Ariza, Chandler, Arthur, and Rivers bought out, the Suns are thin on contracts, unless someone is willing to take Anderson. Jackson, Bender, Daniels combine for about $14M. Warren would likely need to be included due to his 11.7M contract. I think the Suns would have to send close to $20M back, and I don't see how they can get it done. I am not sure if a draft pick counts as "salary."
Basically, I'd offer our pick, Bucks pick, JJ, Bender and Daniels as expiring contracts, and I am guessing that Warren would need to be included. They can also wait until the offseason and do a sigh and trade involving Oubre. Or hell, they might take Anderson with enough picks?

Anderson's deal is two years shorter. Maybe Anderson, Jackson, Okobo, and a couple lightly protected first rounders. If I was them though, I hang to the Brow and Jrue.

 

[elindholm]

As I watched the game against the Mavs, I was thinking the same thing. Holiday would be a PERFECT point guard for this team. Trading for Holiday could be tricky, as he makes around 26M if I remember correctly. With Ariza, Chandler, Arthur, and Rivers bought out, the Suns are thin on contracts, unless someone is willing to take Anderson. Jackson, Bender, Daniels combine for about $14M. Warren would likely need to be included due to his 11.7M contract. I think the Suns would have to send close to $20M back, and I don't see how they can get it done. I am not sure if a draft pick counts as "salary."
Basically, I'd offer our pick, Bucks pick, JJ, Bender and Daniels as expiring contracts, and I am guessing that Warren would need to be included. They can also wait until the offseason and do a sigh and trade involving Oubre. Or hell, they might take Anderson with enough picks?

Well, better Holiday than Wall, anyway.

I think you're right that Warren would have to be included, and maybe also Jackson. The Pelicans are fine for salary structure because most of their contracts are expiring. So the only way they trade Holiday is if they're doing a full-scale blow-up. Otherwise, they ride this year out and retool over the summer. Davis is still a draw, so they'll be competitive for free agents.

I wouldn't balk at trading Jackson. He has one of the lowest basketball IQs I've ever seen, and that's not likely to get dramatically better. It seems like he makes at least one jaw-dropping fundamental error every game. I believe he'll be able to slow things down and maybe improve as a shooter, but I don't see him ever getting to the point where fans won't cringe every time he touches the ball, gritting their teeth in preparation for the next blunder.

I think that Warren, Jackson, the MIL pick, and one of Okobo/Melton would probably get it done if the Pelicans decide to go in that direction. But that may be an overpayment from the Suns' standpoint.

 

[SirStefan32]

Anderson's deal is two years shorter. Maybe Anderson, Jackson, Okobo, and a couple lightly protected first rounders. If I was them though, I hang to the Brow and Jrue.

Yeah, but if Davis is off to LA, might as well start fresh. I suppose it would depend on what they get back from the Lakers.

 

[SirStefan32]

Well, better Holiday than Wall, anyway.

I think you're right that Warren would have to be included, and maybe also Jackson. The Pelicans are fine for salary structure because most of their contracts are expiring. So the only way they trade Holiday is if they're doing a full-scale blow-up. Otherwise, they ride this year out and retool over the summer. Davis is still a draw, so they'll be competitive for free agents.

I wouldn't balk at trading Jackson. He has one of the lowest basketball IQs I've ever seen, and that's not likely to get dramatically better. It seems like he makes at least one jaw-dropping fundamental error every game. I believe he'll be able to slow things down and maybe improve as a shooter, but I don't see him ever getting to the point where fans won't cringe every time he touches the ball, gritting their teeth in preparation for the next blunder.

I think that Warren, Jackson, the MIL pick, and one of Okobo/Melton would probably get it done if the Pelicans decide to go in that direction. But that may be an overpayment from the Suns' standpoint.

Definitely better than Wall!

I agree that the pelicans only trade Jrew if they decide to completely blow it up. Depending on what they get for Davis, they might be better off retooling.

As for Jackson, I agree. I am pretty much done with him, especially if we can keep Oubre.

 

[hcsilla]

I don't think so, at least not this season. When I've watched them play, Bledsoe has appeared to be their best player not named Giannis. And looking at stats, the advantage again goes to Eric. Middleton outscores him by 1.6 per game but Eric has a clear advantage in stats including PER, TS%, WS and VORP.

Yes, Middleton has a down season while Bledsoe having a suprisingly effective one.

I still think that Middleton is a better and more useful overall player but we will find out soon which one will be considered more valuable by the market when their new contracts will be handed out.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yes, Middleton has a down season while Bledsoe having a suprisingly effective one.

I still think that Middleton is a better and more useful overall player but we will find out soon which one will be considered more valuable by the market when their new contracts will be handed out.

Well, I think Middleton will likely have the better market but I was solely speaking about their performance this season. They need Middleton at his best more than they need Eric but Khris just hasn't been what they expected so I don't know which one they'd prioritize.

 

[Mainstreet]

Holiday will be 29 this summer not that I consider age to be a big factor. I'm more concerned about the Suns keeping their young talent and financial flexibility. I'm hoping a more reasonable option might be available like perhaps a player like Dinwiddie or Rubio. The Suns need more than just one player.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Holiday will be 29 this summer not that I consider age to be a big factor. I'm more concerned about the Suns keeping their young talent and financial flexibility. I'm hoping a more reasonable option might be available like perhaps a player like Dinwiddie or Rubio. The Suns need more than just one player.

We should just stop talking about Dinwiddie at this point now that he signed his extension.

 

[Mainstreet]

We should just stop talking about Dinwiddie at this point now that he signed his extension.

I'm not saying the Nets will trade Dinwiddie but when he was extended, he became a more valuable trade asset.

The Nets will likely continue their current path but it's not impossible they cash in an asset(s) to improve their team. A young player and a first round pick might get their attention.