2023 Phoenix Suns Offseason

[Hoop Head]

Read cbafaq.com and let me know what you think. I seriously doubt that the local radio guys have spent much quality time with it.

Its not just local radio, ESPN+ wrote it in their off-season guide for the Suns that was posted the night we were eliminated.

 

[clyde2tw]

RealGM Forums

RealGM Forums

forums.realgm.com

Came across this very informative piece on our cap situation ( Post#1089 » by Ghost of Kleine »). It seems our contracts for CP3, Shamet, Payne are very attractive trading assets to teams that need cap space.

 

[Carolinacacti]

So JJ knows something about contracts, he did all three of those.

 

[Germz249]

RealGM Forums

RealGM Forums

forums.realgm.com

Came across this very informative piece on our cap situation ( Post#1089 » by Ghost of Kleine »). It seems our contracts for CP3, Shamet, Payne are very attractive trading assets to teams that need cap space.

Lets cash in and make some trades.

 

[Folster]

RealGM Forums

RealGM Forums

forums.realgm.com

Came across this very informative piece on our cap situation ( Post#1089 » by Ghost of Kleine »). It seems our contracts for CP3, Shamet, Payne are very attractive trading assets to teams that need cap space.

That Dave King breakdown was really good. Thanks for sharing.

I think he deserves traffic to his site for it.

Phoenix Suns offseason outlook, Part 2: New CBA challenges could lead to quick action around the NBA Draft

Breaking down the salary cap and Phoenix Suns spending/trading power under the new CBA

www.brightsideofthesun.com

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Idk how I feel about Scoot. I mean I’d love to draft him but our window is pretty much next year.

As much as he’s a pick for the future, he would be a plus to this team. With book and of he wouldn’t have a lot of pressure and he’s have a lot of space to operate. A dude like that that can get his own shot is something we are really missing.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah, the Nuggets have built around three players they drafted (Jokic, Porter and Murray) and Aaron Gordon has been with them for three seasons. This is one of the reasons I wanted the Suns to keep building around their young core players before the trade for Durant. Sometimes it takes awhile for a young team to peak.

It’s not that simple. Jokic is better than Booker. Murray is better than bridges. And Ayton/porter are a wash with a lean towards Ayton. And Gordon would bully the crap outta cam Johnson. That team would have still needed another star from somewhere.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Well I would never take Sabonis. Nobody will ever convince me Ayton isn't more talented, because he is.

Sabonis was total garbage in the playoffs this year, of course so was Ayton.

But one played hard. The other played dumb and lazy . . . when he played.

The talent differential is in Ayton’s favor. Unfortunately he only taps 45-65% of that potential which makes him unreliable and a bad teammate. Sabonis gives you 110% every night.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It’s not that simple. Jokic is better than Booker. Murray is better than bridges. And Ayton/porter are a wash with a lean towards Ayton. And Gordon would bully the crap outta cam Johnson. That team would have still needed another star from somewhere.

Jokic is better than Booker. Murray might be the better offensive weapon but Bridges is a better all around player than him or anyone else on Denver's roster. I'd give the edge to Denver on the Gordon/CamJ matchup but I don't believe we necessarily HAD to have another star. Another solid rotation piece would have given us a chance assuming we kept one of Saric or Crowder. The weakness was always going to be which Chris Paul showed up every night.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Gambo said today Nurse may still be a candidate and he might have been wrong to count him out.

He also said there is zero chance Suns will pay Chris Paul 30 million this year. Said they will either trade him or cut him for the 15 million. They would then offer him the min if he still wanted to play for us.

Oh please bring nurse

 

[AzStevenCal]

Oh please bring nurse

I think Philadelphia wants him and that's probably a much more attractive job than Phoenix.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Jokic is better than Booker. Murray might be the better offensive weapon but Bridges is a better all around player than him or anyone else on Denver's roster. I'd give the edge to Denver on the Gordon/CamJ matchup but I don't believe we necessarily HAD to have another star. Another solid rotation piece would have given us a chance assuming we kept one of Saric or Crowder. The weakness was always going to be which Chris Paul showed up every night.

I don’t believe a single team in the league would trade murray, a guy who can lead a team, a high level playoff team, in any given night, for bridges straight up.

And when you say another solid rotation piece, what are you talking? An Eric Gordon? That wouldn’t have pushed us over the top with crowders absence and Paul’s current state of ability.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think Philadelphia wants him and that's probably a much more attractive job than Phoenix.

I think that’s a toss up. They might have more depth but our stars are better. I think everyone has seen the best of embiid and it’s not good enough. Harden is a neutral player at best. Maxey has nice upside. KD is likely still considered better, or at least even, than embiid and book is better than harden or maxey at this point.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I don’t believe a single team in the league would trade murray, a guy who can lead a team, a high level playoff team, in any given night, for bridges straight up.

And when you say another solid rotation piece, what are you talking? An Eric Gordon? That wouldn’t have pushed us over the top with crowders absence and Paul’s current state of ability.

And I disagree. I believe just about every team in the league would jump at that deal. Bridges had an offseason on defense and efficiency, for whatever reason, but even still he comes out on top if you compare their stats and advanced stats from this season. He also doesn't have anything like Murray's disappearing act on his resume nor any injury history.

Well if by over the top you're talking about being legitimate favorites to win it all, I don't think anything would have done that unless you're talking about adding a star to the roster we had or trading just picks for KD. I'd wager against our slightly upgraded previous roster winning it all but I do believe it had a better chance than the post trade roster.

 

[Mainstreet]

Jokic is better than Booker. Murray might be the better offensive weapon but Bridges is a better all around player than him or anyone else on Denver's roster. I'd give the edge to Denver on the Gordon/CamJ matchup but I don't believe we necessarily HAD to have another star. Another solid rotation piece would have given us a chance assuming we kept one of Saric or Crowder. The weakness was always going to be which Chris Paul showed up every night.

Also, the Suns were loaded to make other trades without compromising their core with Saric and Crowder as expiring contracts if they were not locked into trading for Durant.

Charlotte bought out Reggie Jackson so he could have probably been easily had for a 2nd round pick. There were rotation power forwards that were available as well as we have seen. Two more rotation players would have given the Suns an incredible boost without trading Cam Johnson or Mikal Bridges.

Then this summer, the Suns could have further strengthened their team by trading Ayton if they so desired.

 

[Cheesebeef]

And I disagree. I believe just about every team in the league would jump at that deal. Bridges had an offseason on defense and efficiency, for whatever reason, but even still he comes out on top if you compare their stats and advanced stats from this season. He also doesn't have anything like Murray's disappearing act on his resume nor any injury history.

Well if by over the top you're talking about being legitimate favorites to win it all, I don't think anything would have done that unless you're talking about adding a star to the roster we had or trading just picks for KD. I'd wager against our slightly upgraded previous roster winning it all but I do believe it had a better chance than the post trade roster.

You think every team in the league jumps at a Bridges for Murray deal? Based on what? Wait… he doesn’t have anything like Murray’s “disappearing act” on his resume? First, what is this disappearing act for Murray you’re talking about when the last two times he’s been healthy in the playoffs, he’s been electric and led his team to the Conference Finals and likely Finals this season. AND Bridges ABSOLUTELY has had PATHETIC embarassing disappearing act EVERY year in the playoffs where he completely no-showed against the Bucks, Dallas and then shot a humiliating 27% in the last 3.5 games of a pathetic 4 game sweep this year.

I mean, there’s bad arguments and then there’s terrible arguments and then there’s the above.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I think that’s a toss up. They might have more depth but our stars are better. I think everyone has seen the best of embiid and it’s not good enough. Harden is a neutral player at best. Maxey has nice upside. KD is likely still considered better, or at least even, than embiid and book is better than harden or maxey at this point.

They have a lot more depth. I'd give our stars a very slight edge. Our biggest advantage is that Joel wears out late in games because he can never work out enough to stay in shape.

But they have a stable franchise, Morey is probably more attractive than JJ and we have an untested owner in place. They have a better fan base and a slightly better future draft situation, we have a dry climate and great golfing opportunities. I'd choose Phoenix but rumors I've read suggest Nurse will choose Philadelphia.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

And I disagree. I believe just about every team in the league would jump at that deal. Bridges had an offseason on defense and efficiency, for whatever reason, but even still he comes out on top if you compare their stats and advanced stats from this season. He also doesn't have anything like Murray's disappearing act on his resume nor any injury history.

Well if by over the top you're talking about being legitimate favorites to win it all, I don't think anything would have done that unless you're talking about adding a star to the roster we had or trading just picks for KD. I'd wager against our slightly upgraded previous roster winning it all but I do believe it had a better chance than the post trade roster.

I don’t believe the pre-trade roster finishes the season any differently than we did. I like building around book and kd for a shot at a championship more than building around the 50 and fade team the pre-trade roster has become with Paul’s decline and Ayton’s regression in the playoffs.

And I love how you raise Murray’s disappearance and ignore the fact that bridges has consistently gone El foldo in the playoffs. At least you own up to the fact that his greatest asset (defense) declined and his efficiency (probably his second best attribute) sunk. I like bridges, but he’s almost the opposite of Durant. Can’t elevate a team and gets worse in the postseason. And cam Johnson is what he is, an already in his prime years nice shooter that’s oft-injured but is nothing more than a nice starter/sixth man. I like em both but neither was going to step up next to book to help lead to a championship. Hence the need for another star.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Also, the Suns were loaded to make other trades without compromising their core with Saric and Crowder as expiring contracts if they were not locked into trading for Durant.

Charlotte bought out Reggie Jackson so he could have probably been easily had for a 2nd round pick. There were rotation power forwards that were available as well as we have seen. Two more rotation players would have given the Suns an incredible boost without trading Cam Johnson or Mikal Bridges.

Then this summer, the Suns could have further strengthened their team by trading Ayton if they so desired.

Wait, we traded saric for bazley. What do you think you could’ve gotten for him? And we dumped crowder as a throw in when no one really bit on him. There was smoke in hachimura but that was conjecture at best. And you seem to refuse to acknowledge that Reggie Jackson flat out sucked this year. That team could only get better around the fringe which wasn’t going to be enough and to jump back into being a contender they’d have had to give up Bridges, at a minimum, to get an impact player.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

They have a lot more depth. I'd give our stars a very slight edge. Our biggest advantage is that Joel wears out late in games because he can never work out enough to stay in shape.

But they have a stable franchise, Morey is probably more attractive than JJ and we have an untested owner in place. They have a better fan base and a slightly better future draft situation, we have a dry climate and great golfing opportunities. I'd choose Phoenix but rumors I've read suggest Nurse will choose Philadelphia.

Philly has a better fan base? Now I’ve heard everything. I’ve never heard any pundit say anything other than the suns enjoy one of the best fanbases in the nba. We throw parades for being runners up. Think Philly does that? No. They spit in the team for that. Cmon man, it feels like you’re starting to make things up to support your arguments. First bridges doesn’t disappear and now the fan base thing. You have legitimate arguments to the point you don’t need to do that.

 

[Mainstreet]

And I disagree. I believe just about every team in the league would jump at that deal. Bridges had an offseason on defense and efficiency, for whatever reason, but even still he comes out on top if you compare their stats and advanced stats from this season. He also doesn't have anything like Murray's disappearing act on his resume nor any injury history.

Well if by over the top you're talking about being legitimate favorites to win it all, I don't think anything would have done that unless you're talking about adding a star to the roster we had or trading just picks for KD. I'd wager against our slightly upgraded previous roster winning it all but I do believe it had a better chance than the post trade roster.

I don't understand why there is a discussion about trading Bridges for Murray.

The Suns should have kept their core together and added quality depth at the trade deadline. The Suns would have been so deep.

Maybe they wouldn't have won it on, less Paul and Ayton, but I think they had a better chance than with Durant this past season.

Then the Suns would have been loaded for bear this summer with assets to use.

Btw, Saric was traded to save money. Add a draft pick to Crowder or Saric (expiring contracts) if need be and the Suns add a rotation player.

 

[SirStefan32]

Philly has a better fan base? Now I’ve heard everything. I’ve never heard any pundit say anything other than the suns enjoy one of the best fanbases in the nba. We throw parades for being runners up. Think Philly does that? No. They spit in the team for that. Cmon man, it feels like you’re starting to make things up to support your arguments. First bridges doesn’t disappear and now the fan base thing. You have legitimate arguments to the point you don’t need to do that.

Yeah, as a Pennsylvania resident, I can confirm that our fans are awful and beyond toxic.

 

[SirStefan32]

I don't understand why there is a discussion about trading Bridges for Murray.

The Suns should have kept their core together and added quality depth at the trade deadline. The Suns would have been so deep.

Maybe they wouldn't have won it on, less Paul and Ayton, but I think they had a better chance than with Durant this past season.

Then the Suns would have been loaded for bear this summer with assets to use.

I just don't think it would have mattered. Booker would have been doubled non-stop and the result would have been the same, if not worse.
As another poster pointed out earlier in the thread, the Suns had to have a second star to go anywhere. I love Bridges- easily my favorite player in the league, but he is not a legitimate second option, CP3 was good enough to do this job reasonably well two years ago, but he fell off the cliff rapidly. Without a second star, this team was way too easy to stop. No amount of depth was going to change that.

 

[Covert Rain]

And I disagree. I believe just about every team in the league would jump at that deal. Bridges had an offseason on defense and efficiency, for whatever reason, but even still he comes out on top if you compare their stats and advanced stats from this season. He also doesn't have anything like Murray's disappearing act on his resume nor any injury history.

Well if by over the top you're talking about being legitimate favorites to win it all, I don't think anything would have done that unless you're talking about adding a star to the roster we had or trading just picks for KD. I'd wager against our slightly upgraded previous roster winning it all but I do believe it had a better chance than the post trade roster.

No way. Murray was considered an up and coming potential superstar no matter who he was playing around. Unlike Bridges, it didn't take Murray playing on a depleted team to showcase offense either. If teams pick Bridges over Murray it's only because of injury history. Bridges has done the great Houdini 2 years running in the playoffs. Not to mention that despite his offensive output resulted in how many post season wins this year? Some would view that as empty stats. Straight up? No question, IMO, it's Murray for most provided he is healthy. I am not convinced Murray can stay healthy though which is why I wouldn't begrudge a team picking Bridges for that reason.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I don't understand why there is a discussion about trading Bridges for Murray.

The Suns should have kept their core together and added quality depth at the trade deadline. The Suns would have been so deep.

Maybe they wouldn't have won it on, less Paul and Ayton, but I think they had a better chance than with Durant this past season.

Then the Suns would have been loaded for bear this summer with assets to use.

Btw, Saric was traded to save money. Add a draft pick to Crowder or Saric (expiring contracts) if need be and the Suns add a rotation player.

Lol. No one is actually talking about trading them. We were comparing them and using a fictional trade as an argument for comparison purposes.

And again, you ain’t adding any depth that moves the needle without trading bridges. But for the sake of this conversation, I’ll bite. Who got traded that would’ve pushed us over the nuggets with no Paul and a disappearing Ayton? And what would we have had to give up to get him?