2023 Phoenix Suns Offseason

[Phrazbit]

Yep. Paul was hurt again. Even no trade same result. Then Cam J would have been your long term PF. What a disaster that would have been. The regression of this team was also proof in the pudding.

We would have had lots of moveable parts and all of our picks. When Cam Johnson played this year we were a reeeeally good team.

I don't see the disaster.

 

[Yuma]

There is absolutely zero reason to think we wouldn't have been able to resign Cam. Nothing in the CBA prevents it and even with an extended Cam our cap figure would be lower than it is now after the trade.

All I am saying is go back and look at the articles on major news sites in AZ all saying it was going to be near impossible. Was there a chance? Sure, if his agent lets him sign way below market value. ANYTHING is possible. Is it probable? Most likely no.

 

[Phrazbit]

All I am saying is go back and look at the articles on major news sites in AZ all saying it was going to be near impossible. Was there a chance? Sure, if his agent lets him sign way below market value. ANYTHING is possible. Is it probable? Most likely no.

I need you to show me that. I never read that anywhere.

IMO, it was an absolute lock that if we didn't trade Cam we were extending him.

 

[Covert Rain]

We would have had lots of moveable parts and all of our picks. When Cam Johnson played this year we were a reeeeally good team.

I don't see the disaster.

Check the areas we were struggling in. The team couldn’t rebound. Giving up a ton of second chance points. Giving up a on of points off of turnovers. With Ayton regressing we needed a legit PF presence. You would have committed to that front court. That says disaster to me. I don’t care about “good teams”. I care about building a title team.

 

[Yuma]

We would have had lots of moveable parts and all of our picks. When Cam Johnson played this year we were a reeeeally good team.

I don't see the disaster.

It's funny. People bitch that JJ doesn't know how to pick guys in the draft. Also gives away picks too early and doesn't value them. Would that have changed? No. Obviously they used them to get KD.

 

[Yuma]

I need you to show me that. I never read that anywhere.

IMO, it was an absolute lock that if we didn't trade Cam we were extending him.

Geez. Anyone on the board can tell you that. I am not going back to do the work for you.

 

[Hoop Head]

Way to be hypocritical. I am responding to the SAME THING that has been said a million times. So, it’s OK to repeat the same stuff over and over as long as it’s your view but not OK to respond to it.

Uh..OK.

What you're doing is making assumptions and passing them off as facts, show me where I'm doing that, please because I didn't intend to. Yes, some of my beliefs have been peppered in to comments but unlike you I'm not flat out saying something wasn't or was going to happen.

@Mainstreet said we were in a better position before the trade, having just been in the finals. It's a fact we were in the finals, right? Ok. Some wanted to see that team grow and you take exception to the belief that team was going to improve and jumped on him for it, saying it wasn't going to happen. How do you know? Where's your crystal ball? You're making assumptions. That's fine but we've been through this 800 billion times.

Rather than let his comment go though you felt the need to just say "Nope, I can see the future and that team was done!" with no real evidence to back it up. Say what you want but we just came up short with KD and the Suns massively underachieve this postseason. Hang your hat on 2 wins against Denver because the team we had swept them. Yes, they improved since then, so did we. We were injury plagued the first half of this season.

We could have resigned Cam. All the talk of not resigning him was under a different owner and budget. Durant is making twice what Mikal is, which Cam probably wouldn't have received had he stayed here. Lesser role, lesser pay. He became the #2 in Brooklyn which is why a higher number is now discussed as what it'll cost to retain him. Still, if the Suns could pay Durant then they could Mikal and Cam. Saying otherwise flies in the face of what Ishbia has said about spending .

 

[Phrazbit]

Check the areas we were struggling in. The team couldn’t rebound. Giving up a ton of second chance points. Giving up a on of points off of turnovers. With Ayton regressing we needed a legit PF presence. You would have committed to that front court. That says disaster to me.

We were a better team than what we ended up with... and again, the roster wouldn't be set in stone. That team would have a bounty of moveable parts.

 

[Phrazbit]

Geez. Anyone on the board can tell you that. I am not going back to do the work for you.

You made the claim.

There was no way we were going to let him walk.

Ishbia has shown that he is willing to spend.

Zero... absolutely zero chance we would have let Cam walk for nothing.

 

[Yuma]

What you're doing is making assumptions and passing them off as facts, show me where I'm doing that, please because I didn't intend to. Yes, some of my beliefs have been peppered in to comments but unlike you I'm not flat out saying something wasn't or was going to happen.

@Mainstreet said we were in a better position before the trade, having just been in the finals. It's a fact we were in the finals, right? Ok. Some wanted to see that team grow and you take exception to the belief that team was going to improve and jumped on him for it, saying it wasn't going to happen. How do you know? Where's your crystal ball? You're making assumptions. That's fine but we've been through this 800 billion times.

Rather than let his comment go though you felt the need to just say "Nope, I can see the future and that team was done!" with no real evidence to back it up. Say what you want but we just KD come up short and the Suns massively underachieve this postseason. Hang your hat on 2 wins against Denver because the team we had swept them. Yes, they improved since then, so did we. We were injury plagued the first half of this season.

We could have resigned Cam. All the talk of not resigning him was under a different owner and budget. Durant is making twice what Mikal is, which Cam probably wouldn't have received had he stayed here. Lesser role, lesser pay. He became the #2 in Brooklyn which is why a higher number is now discussed as what it'll cost to retain him. Still, if the Suns could pay Durant then they could Mikal and Cam. Saying otherwise flies in the face of what Ishbia has said about spending .

Just do a search on AZCentral.com, and Arizona Sports web site. There were SEVERAL articles on the difficulty of resigning Cam Johnson.

 

[Yuma]

You made the claim.

There was no way we were going to let him walk.

Ishbia has shown that he is willing to spend.

Zero... absolutely zero chance we would have let Cam walk for nothing.

I'm sorry. You are wrong. Ishbia TRADED him. He let him walk! That's a FACT!

 

[Phrazbit]

Just do a search on AZCentral.com, and Arizona Sports web site. There were SEVERAL articles on the difficulty of resigning Cam Johnson.

I just looked.

Nothing. I can find nothing that claims we were going to have to let Cam walk.

We had his rights and the salary, even after an extension would be less than what we are paying for the team now.

 

[Hoop Head]

Geez. Anyone on the board can tell you that. I am not going back to do the work for you.

Do the work for him? You're making the claim, it's your responsibility to back it up and if you won't then it wasn't worth claiming as fact.

 

[Phrazbit]

I'm sorry. You are wrong. Ishbia TRADED him. He let him walk! That's a FACT!

Trade isn't letting him walk.

 

[Covert Rain]

What you're doing is making assumptions and passing them off as facts, show me where I'm doing that, please because I didn't intend to. Yes, some of my beliefs have been peppered in to comments but unlike you I'm not flat out saying something wasn't or was going to happen.

@Mainstreet said we were in a better position before the trade, having just been in the finals. It's a fact we were in the finals, right? Ok. Some wanted to see that team grow and you take exception to the belief that team was going to improve and jumped on him for it, saying it wasn't going to happen. How do you know? Where's your crystal ball? You're making assumptions. That's fine but we've been through this 800 billion times.

Rather than let his comment go though you felt the need to just say "Nope, I can see the future and that team was done!" with no real evidence to back it up. Say what you want but we just KD come up short and the Suns massively underachieve this postseason. Hang your hat on 2 wins against Denver because the team we had swept them. Yes, they improved since then, so did we. We were injury plagued the first half of this season.

We could have resigned Cam. All the talk of not resigning him was under a different owner and budget. Durant is making twice what Mikal is, which Cam probably wouldn't have received had he stayed here. Lesser role, lesser pay. He became the #2 in Brooklyn which is why a higher number is now discussed as what it'll cost to retain him. Still, if the Suns could pay Durant then they could Mikal and Cam. Saying otherwise flies in the face of what Ishbia has said about spending .

Dear lord and you say I am repeating with speculation. I won’t even bother. Been there done that. Suns playoff record is proof and FACT. Their regression is FACT. Where they were at with the CAP is Fact. I will not indulge you being hypocritical any further. If you don’t want a repeat response, then you should tell people not to repeat the same take.

 

[Mainstreet]

It's a moot point obviously. Not saying you are wrong. Just, IDK how we were going forward with CP3 and Booker as our two stars. No matter what back up we had.

The Suns could have built on their core of Booker, Bridges, Cam Johnson, Ayton (unless traded) plus all their draft picks.

They could have even waived and stretched Paul.

However, we can agree, what is gone is gone.

 

[Yuma]

Trade isn't letting him walk.

So obviously Ishbia did not resign him. Ishbia traded him.

 

[Germz249]

They also regressed after the finals appearance and showed signs of the same issues last season prior to the trade. That also isn’t a coincidence.

Did they really? I know we didn’t win a ring but they had the best record and was favored to win it all. I get we got bounced but during the regular season and how we were doing I thought we were on the up. I thought it was this year where we started to go down.

 

[Covert Rain]

Just do a search on AZCentral.com, and Arizona Sports web site. There were SEVERAL articles on the difficulty of resigning Cam Johnson.

If I recall correctly the Suns were willing to resign him in the 66 Million dollar range. Sarver said he was willing to pay the luxury tax. He didn’t say he was willing to continue to grow the salary unfettered. They were saying that Cam J was going to cost the Suns upwards of 90 Million which drove speculation the Suns were not going to do it. I do recall that type of speculation that it put the Suns in a tough position.

 

[Yuma]

If I recall correctly the Suns were willing to resign him in the 66 Million dollar range. Sarver said he was willing to pay the luxury tax. He didn’t say he was willing to continue to grow the salary unfettered. They were saying that Cam J was going to cost the Suns upwards of 90 Million which drove speculation the Suns were not going to do it. I do recall that type of speculation that it put the Suns in a tough position.

His side turned down $66 to $72 million extension. There was a lot of conjecture the Suns would be unable to resign him. Like I said, it really doesn't matter because Ishbia traded him.

 

[Raindog]

Something to consider with the Durant trade was how many more seasons of fading out in the playoffs were the Suns willing to take? I know that they fizzled again after the trade, but that is kind of immaterial. It's obvious that the Durant trade was made (for good or bad) in an attempt to evince another disappointing ending to the season. And I am relatively certain that standing pat with the same roster would have had the same result.

Now I am not saying the deal they made for Durant is above criticism. Trading all the draft choices, for example, seems on the face of it potentially egregious. But I get why Ishbia felt like they had to do something to shake things up. The team as it had been configured was never going to win, and seemed destined to only get further from that objective over time. Whether that was due to Paul hitting the wall, Monty's post season incompetence, Ayton's disappearing act, or some combination of all three (most likely), continuing with the same roster was a failing proposition.

And I don't believe little bits of tinkering, like trading for some extra supporting bench help or something similar that I see people suggesting would have made a bit of difference. Any deal they made that would have actually improved the team would have had to be for top tier talent... and that meant at a minimum, moving Bridges because he was the only piece they have that could potentially bring a difference maker in return. And for a real difference maker, that likely meant moving Johnson, as well. So it really is academic to lament losing one or both of them, in my mind.

Again, I'm not wholesale defending the trade they ended up making because they probably did give up too much with the included draft picks. But I really don't see any way they could have avoided trading Bridges and/or Johnson and actually improved their championship chances.

 

[Hoop Head]

Dear lord and you say I am repeating with speculation. I won’t even bother. Been there done that. Suns playoff record is proof and FACT. Their regression is FACT. Where they were at with the CAP is Fact. I will not indulge you being hypocritical any further. If you don’t want a repeat response, then you should tell people not to repeat the same take.

64 wins, franchise record, is regressing? One bad playoff run, in the teams second postseason run, isn't regressing, sorry but that's ridiculous. According to you they had all sorts of luck to get to the finals so I guess they just didn't get lucky again and were eliminated in the second round, by an inferior team, but I'd guess if they were lucky the year before and exceeded expectations then second round seems about right, right? But this years team didnt regress? Lol now that's funny. About what I expect from the guy who continually brings up "highest scoring duo this postseason" which they're barely holding onto, BTW. Denver's duo is scoring like 1-2 ppg less a game. I'm sure Jamal and Jokic are jealous of that though. Who are you trying to convince, yourself or someone else? Because no one else is buying.

 

[Covert Rain]

Did they really? I know we didn’t win a ring but they had the best record and was favored to win it all. I get we got bounced but during the regular season and how we were doing I thought we were on the up. I thought it was this year where we started to go down.

In the playoffs? Absolutely they regressed. Also, last season before the KD trade I think we were a few games over .500 and regressing in many areas I believe? I could be wrong. It’s all a blur.

 

[Covert Rain]

64 wins, franchise record, is regressing? One bad playoff run, in the teams second postseason run, isn't regressing, sorry but that's ridiculous. According to you they had all sorts of luck to get to the finals so I guess they just didn't get lucky again and were eliminated in the second round, by an inferior team, but I'd guess if they were lucky the year before and exceeded expectations then second round seems about right, right? But this years team didnt regress? Lol now that's funny. About what I expect from the guy who continually brings up "highest scoring duo this postseason" which they're barely holding onto, BTW. Denver's duo is scoring like 1-2 ppg less a game. I'm sure Jamal and Jokic are jealous of that though. Who are you trying to convince, yourself or someone else? Because no one else is buying.

HILARIOUS. Who are you convincing? It’s the same crowd repeating the same thing. You don’t win a title in the regular season last time I checked. Got bounced by an inferior team in the Mavs last time I checked. We were a few games over .500 before the trade If I recall (I could be wrong about that) and the team was regressing in several areas.

But yeah….the team was headed in the right direction. LOL.

Again, you don’t want the same response don’t repeat the same take the complain about someone repeating. It’s hypocritical.

 

[Mainstreet]

His side turned down $66 to $72 million extension. There was a lot of conjecture the Suns would be unable to resign him.

Conjecture is simply that. I can't see Ishbia not matching an offer for Cam Johnson as a RFA.

Also, let's not forget Cam Johnson could have been signed and traded... maybe for a point guard?

Let's hope the Suns can restock their roster by trading/waiving/stretching Chris Paul. The Suns don't even have a first round pick.

The Suns are almost forced to trade Ayton to restock their roster.