All aboard! The Shaq bandwagon departs this station in roughly 8-10 hours....

[D-Dogg]

Its a desperation move, because your team KNEW that they had no chance of winning the title, standing pat. Maybe "technically" that's not a desperation move. I feel that the Suns came to that same realization.

Again, the Lakers got the best of that trade.

I do have concerns about the coach and this team though.

Nick, that's not a desperation move...it is a move to make a decent-to-good team into a championship contender.

You had a championship contender, with worries about if it would make it, and took away a KEY component for a declining used to be great center who is NOTORIOUS for not putting in the work to be better. That's what the whole shaq/kobe feuds were about. He is a lazy, lazy, lazy man and Kobe couldn't stand it. He could have been the GOAT, but he didn't care. Now, he is old and beatdown, and he can't lean on his talent. You need to integrate him into a RUNNING system, with a coach who is also NOTORIOUS for sticking with his system.

Can you not understand how Laker fans are freaking giddy at this point? We just improved to title contention level, and you guys put in a desperation move that is 95% likely to fail.

 

[Big D]

This is the anti-Barkley trade. Suns go from legit title contender to Western Conf also-ran once this thing goes through. Shaq is a shell of his former self. He's broken down, old, out of shape and pretty much worthless at this point in his career unless you need a big off the bench to get you a couple easy dunks a game and use up 6 fouls. I think this is a terrible trade for the Suns. Maybe it will work out, who knows, but I just can't see any scenario playing out in which it does. Just when I thought this team couldn't possibly frustrate me anymore than they have already... we trade for freaking Shaq.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Great point. oh, and what have Kobe and Bynum already mastered (and I bet Kobe and Pau will soon?) The high pick and roll.

I hate to biglaugh all in this thread, but this is a Lakerfans dream. Now when we beat the suns, there is ADDED satisfaction of beating the dude who bolted because he wanted more money.

The problem with that, is that After Bynum gets past Amare, (if we are going to take that assumption) he'll still have Shaq to contend with. Now if Bynum becomes the passer that you guys think that he is.... that's a different story.

 

[Brian]

Great point. oh, and what have Kobe and Bynum already mastered (and I bet Kobe and Pau will soon?) The high pick and roll.
quote]

This is a point that so many Suns fans are not getting. I've watched the pick and roll run against the Lakers when Shaq was there so many times, it makes me sick to even think about it. This is Shaq's biggest weakness, and teams are going to try and exploit it, just like they did when he was with the Lakers and the Heat.

Didn't Shaq win some titles playing for those two teams? My point is that it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Nick, that's not a desperation move...it is a move to make a decent-to-good team into a championship contender.

You had a championship contender, with worries about if it would make it, and took away a KEY component for a declining used to be great center who is NOTORIOUS for not putting in the work to be better. That's what the whole shaq/kobe feuds were about. He is a lazy, lazy, lazy man and Kobe couldn't stand it. He could have been the GOAT, but he didn't care. Now, he is old and beatdown, and he can't lean on his talent. You need to integrate him into a RUNNING system, with a coach who is also NOTORIOUS for sticking with his system.

Can you not understand how Laker fans are freaking giddy at this point? We just improved to title contention level, and you guys put in a desperation move that is 95% likely to fail.

I can understand it. I just feel that your hatred for Shaq may be clouding your judgement for some. This has the ability to be a good trade for the Suns, and you aren't seeing that.

 

[bko32]

The problem with that, is that After Bynum gets past Amare, (if we are going to take that assumption) he'll still have Shaq to contend with. Now if Bynum becomes the passer that you guys think that he is.... that's a different story.

No disrepect DRC, but I don't follow your point. How does Bynum and Amare play into the high pick and roll scenario?

 

[D-Dogg]

How many centers run the P&R against the Suns? It will still be Nash and Amare on the P&R, with Shaq back to defend.

Phil Jackson and the Lakers will run it all damn day long.

Tex Winter HATED shaq because of his asstastic play on the p&r. you'll get a healthy dose of it in the playoffs if we meet again.

 

[D-Dogg]

Didn't Shaq win some titles playing for those two teams? My point is that it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal.

If you think you are getting the Shaq of the title years bro, I am not going to ruin that daydream for you.

Keep dreamin' on.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That's one (there's a few others as well) thing that concerns me about Shaq. Duncan and Tony Parker pick-and-roll is going to absolutely murder the Suns D. Shaq never shows and Nash can't get around screens which is a deadly combo. This also leaves the perimeter D pretty suspect and thin even though I agree Marion was a vastly overrated defender on the perimeter. The only guy left on the roster left that can guard Kobe, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Manu, Parker, Brandon Roy, Iverson, and Baron is Raja and even he seems to have lost a step. This move needs to be countered with something else to bolster the backcourt even if it is Ruben Patterson.

 

[bko32]

Didn't Shaq win some titles playing for those two teams? My point is that it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal.

Those teams were able to get away with Shaq's bad defense because Shaq would be able to dominate the opposing team on the offensive end of the court. Shaq would give up a basket on the defensive end, but get it back on offense. However, I think we can all agree that Shaq is past being a dominant offensive player.

 

[D-Dogg]

I can understand it. I just feel that your hatred for Shaq may be clouding your judgement for some. This has the ability to be a good trade for the Suns, and you aren't seeing that.

Dude, I gave you a 5% chance that it would work out...that's the most I can give with the decline of Shaq, the loss of Marion and the system of Mike D'Runtoni.

If I were full on giving my Shaq hate, I'd not give you a shot in hell. But there is a chance that he could try...he did it in Miami for one year.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

No disrepect DRC, but I don't follow your point. How does Bynum and Amare play into the high pick and roll scenario?

Phil Jackson and the Lakers will run it all damn day long.

Tex Winter HATED shaq because of his asstastic play on the p&r. you'll get a healthy dose of it in the playoffs if we meet again.

Shaq won't be on Bynum the entire game. In fact, I'd wager that Amare will be playing against Bynum more than Shaq will.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Dude, I gave you a 5% chance that it would work out...that's the most I can give with the decline of Shaq, the loss of Marion and the system of Mike D'Runtoni.

If I were full on giving my Shaq hate, I'd not give you a shot in hell. But there is a chance that he could try...he did it in Miami for one year.

Fair enough.

I gotta go, my daughter is sick. I be on back and forth today.

 

[JCSunsfan]

This is the anti-Barkley trade. Suns go from legit title contender to Western Conf also-ran once this thing goes through. Shaq is a shell of his former self. He's broken down, old, out of shape and pretty much worthless at this point in his career unless you need a big off the bench to get you a couple easy dunks a game and use up 6 fouls. I think this is a terrible trade for the Suns. Maybe it will work out, who knows, but I just can't see any scenario playing out in which it does. Just when I thought this team couldn't possibly frustrate me anymore than they have already... we trade for freaking Shaq.

Shaq is 21, 10.5, 4, and 2 in two games against the Suns this year.
His rebounds per 48 are exactly the same as Marion.
His fg% is miles better than Shawn.

He is not a better player than Shawn at this moment, but that is far from "worthless."

 

[LakeShowMan]

One thing I can't wait to see though, is the first time all the Suns fans complain about Shaq getting fouled all the time. Also, when you all defend his post move and say that he isn't committing an offensive foul.

I remember all of you howling that he should foul out every game. Something tells me that a lot of you may have a different perspective this time around.

With that said, I still think this is a positive move for the Suns.

 

[Big D]

Shaq is 21, 10.5, 4, and 2 in two games against the Suns this year.
His rebounds per 48 are exactly the same as Marion.
His fg% is miles better than Shawn.

He is not a better player than Shawn at this moment, but that is far from "worthless."

And exactly who on the Suns was guarding him when he put up those numbers? Bynum? Duncan? Chandler? Any legit C at all?

 

[abomb]

Shaq is 21, 10.5, 4, and 2 in two games against the Suns this year.
His rebounds per 48 are exactly the same as Marion.
His fg% is miles better than Shawn.

He is not a better player than Shawn at this moment, but that is far from "worthless."

Who's numbers ARENT that against the Suns?!?

Check Shaq's minutes and games played. PER means nothing when you are not on the court.

 

[slinslin]

regular season is irrelevant anyway as long as he is healthy in the playoffs.

We will win enough regular season games even if Shaq wasn't playing at all.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Who's numbers ARENT that against the Suns?!?

Check Shaq's minutes and games played. PER means nothing when you are not on the court.

Centers that we think of as big and slow. Yao for example.

Listen, we'll see it work or it won't. Marion was gone this summer anyway.

 

[abomb]

Listen, we'll see it work or it won't.

At least we can agree on that. It should be interesting to say the least.

 

[D-Dogg]

We will win enough regular season games even if Shaq wasn't playing at all.

You think you would win most of your games without marion?

 

[Louis]

I'd to like to have a vote on the bandwagon term.

Can we now call the Suns bandwagon the...

Wait for it...

Snaqwagon!

 

[abomb]

Snaqwagon!

Loves it.

Louis is the funniest guy in Valentine, NE.

 

[Solar7]

I'm going to get my ShaqFu game cartridge signed!

 

[Covert Rain]

You think you would win most of your games without marion?

I don't. This is a "go for bust" trade. If Shaq ends up being a disaster and we are not without Marion...the Suns are screwed.

The only thing that could save us is if we get some huge contribution from some of our lesser known up and comers (Strawberry/Tucker). We still don't really know how much they can contribute.