Amare to opt out if suns dont give MAX

[jibikao]

good grief man. someone put out a hypothetical if we had Chris Paul... I was obviously going on the assumption that in the hypothetical, we wouldn't have an injured Chris Paul. Sometimes I truly believe I'm conversing with ******** people here.



I didn't. The Lakers CAN be beaten with offense, but we didn't have the offensive weapons to do it. We got down 14-18 points in all four games we lost and it was always because the offense completely broke down for stretches of the game where the Lakers were able to cut off Nash's penetration.

But the fact is fact isn't it? Chris Paul was injured and if Suns had Chris Paul, they probably wouldn't even make it that deep into the playoffs.

So yeah, keep DREAMING about your "hypothetical" Dream Combos with Amare/Lebron.. Amare/Chris.. Amare/Deron. And while we are at it, how about Kobe/Amare combo?

And you don't have to be rude to call people "******".

 

[dreamcastrocks]

not really sure how people are looking at Amare like he's a "mercenary". This is what big time FA do. They try to get the most money they can and look for the best situation for them. I've got no issue with him doing that.

as to how much does someone need? Enough's never enough when you can get more. Amare has the chance to not only set himself up for life, but he's got a chance to set up an entire generation of his family. After coming from nothing, enough can probably never be enough for someone with his background because deep down, the guy's probably petrified of ever having to go back to that or having family members do the same.

he's a good kid. he never gets in trouble. he's come back from some pretty horrendous surgeries/injuries. he's just not as good as he thinks he is. I wouldn't hold that against him.

I agree with this entire quote. He does think that he is better than he is. However, he thinks he is worth max, and he's going to get it from somewhere.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I agree with this entire quote. He does think that he is better than he is. However, he thinks he is worth max, and he's going to get it from somewhere.

The max that we can pay him is quite a bit more than the max available to the rest of the league. He may get the "league" max but I doubt that any of them would step up to the amount we'd have to put out to pay the max. It's hard to tell just what Amare expects here. Would he consider it the max if we just matched what others can offer?

Steve

 

[dreamcastrocks]

The max that we can pay him is quite a bit more than the max available to the rest of the league. He may get the "league" max but I doubt that any of them would step up to the amount we'd have to put out to pay the max. It's hard to tell just what Amare expects here. Would he consider it the max if we just matched what others can offer?

Steve

Doubt it. Maybe if we pay him a bit more than what others can pay. (say 5M more than everyone else when we can over him 20M more)

 

[Irish]

I keep wondering how many ASSUMPTIONS we can pile on before we have completely lost tract of reality. There are just too many assumption and too many qestions for us to even pretend to know what is going on.

1. DOES AMARE REALLY WANT TO PLAY FOR A DEEP LOTTERY TEAM AGAIN? All supermax discussion require him to go to a team without much if anything going for their team. The exception might be the Heat, but they have to figure out how to re-sign Wade and another free agent.

2. DOES CHEMISTRY MATTER TO AMARE? The Suns have great chemistry and a coach he gets along with and is willing to cater to his needs. Can he get that anywhere else?

3. DOES WEATHER MATTER? There are a number of active an retired players living in Phoenix. Are there so many in Chicago, Minnesota, New Jersey, New York, Sacramento, etc. I supposed their LA Clippers have OK weather, but that hasn't keep every player wanto to leave their team.

Obiously, if someone offers you $140 million, it would be hard to turndown. But the people with the massive about of cap space are more fixated on guys like LeBron and outside shooters like "Bosh.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'm pretty sure Amare is only going to consider Phoenix, Miami, and New York in that order.

 

[Superbone]

I haven't seen this mentioned yet, but Dudley today on ESPNEWS said that he doubted the Suns would re-sign Amare. He went on to say that Amare was a great teammate and he raved about how well he gets on with all the players. I was surprised at how positive he was regarding Stat as a player and a teammate.

I see a lot of things about his game that worry me but it makes you stop and think when people a lot closer to the situation put a different face on it. It doesn't change what I see but let's face it, Dudley is probably a much better judge of Amare's value than any of us.

Steve

I'm surprised and sorry to hear Dudley say that. What's coming from Amare is positive about his resigning.

Amare and Dudley are close. Amare is meeting Dudley and Clark in Miami for vacation.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm pretty sure Amare is only going to consider Phoenix, Miami, and New York in that order.

uh... why? Chicago would be a pretty perfect landing spot for him. A team in desperate need of a go to scorer, who already has an actual C in a major market with a great playmaker.

And if we don't offer the MAX and a team like the Nets did, I think we'd see that money talks pretty quick.

 

[Cheesebeef]

But the fact is fact isn't it? Chris Paul was injured and if Suns had Chris Paul, they probably wouldn't even make it that deep into the playoffs.

So yeah, keep DREAMING about your "hypothetical" Dream Combos with Amare/Lebron.. Amare/Chris.. Amare/Deron. And while we are at it, how about Kobe/Amare combo?

And you don't have to be rude to call people "******".

I'm not the one who was "dreaming". I didn't bring the hypothetical up. I was just answering it.

 

[Chaplin]

uh... why? Chicago would be a pretty perfect landing spot for him. A team in desperate need of a go to scorer, who already has an actual C in a major market with a great playmaker.

And if we don't offer the MAX and a team like the Nets did, I think we'd see that money talks pretty quick.

Totally agree here, surprise, surprise. We'd all love to think that loyalty will play a part here, but let's be honest. It won't. It rarely does with max-level players.

 

[illone]

I don't think he is worth the max, but who has been in the past?

Not many guys in pro sports are actually WORTH what they are being paid. Maybe to the owners and guys collecting the checks at the top, but for a FAN of the game?

I say pay the man. It's not my money

 

[elindholm]

We'd all love to think that loyalty will play a part here, but let's be honest. It won't. It rarely does with max-level players.

What makes this situation so unusual is the Suns' ambivalence about Stoudemire. If you look at other max-level players who have been up for renewal -- Bryant, Duncan, Nowitzki -- it's clear that their teams want to do everything they can to keep them. But the Suns can't make up their mind whether they want Stoudemire or not, and frankly, Stoudemire himself has done a lot to fuel that doubt.

We keep coming back to Carter, but he's a good comparison again. When the Nets extended him, I remember thinking, "Huh, that's weird, they don't even really like him." It's worth noting that they extended him for less than the maximum (see http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cartevi01.html), but even so, he was quickly seen as a liability. Now he's been traded and his new team doesn't particularly want him either.

Everyone knows that Stoudemire doesn't deserve to be compensated like a top-five player. Probably some team will bite the bullet and do it anyway, and that will give Stoudemire the excuse he needs to leave. But it will be a mistake for both sides.

 

[Cheesebeef]

What makes this situation so unusual is the Suns' ambivalence about Stoudemire. If you look at other max-level players who have been up for renewal -- Bryant, Duncan, Nowitzki -- it's clear that their teams want to do everything they can to keep them. But the Suns can't make up their mind whether they want Stoudemire or not, and frankly, Stoudemire himself has done a lot to fuel that doubt.

We keep coming back to Carter, but he's a good comparison again. When the Nets extended him, I remember thinking, "Huh, that's weird, they don't even really like him." It's worth noting that they extended him for less than the maximum (see http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cartevi01.html), but even so, he was quickly seen as a liability. Now he's been traded and his new team doesn't particularly want him either.

Everyone knows that Stoudemire doesn't deserve to be compensated like a top-five player. Probably some team will bite the bullet and do it anyway, and that will give Stoudemire the excuse he needs to leave. But it will be a mistake for both sides.

completely agreed on everything said above.

 

[asudevil83]

What makes this situation so unusual is the Suns' ambivalence about Stoudemire. If you look at other max-level players who have been up for renewal -- Bryant, Duncan, Nowitzki -- it's clear that their teams want to do everything they can to keep them. But the Suns can't make up their mind whether they want Stoudemire or not, and frankly, Stoudemire himself has done a lot to fuel that doubt.

We keep coming back to Carter, but he's a good comparison again. When the Nets extended him, I remember thinking, "Huh, that's weird, they don't even really like him." It's worth noting that they extended him for less than the maximum (see http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/cartevi01.html), but even so, he was quickly seen as a liability. Now he's been traded and his new team doesn't particularly want him either.

Everyone knows that Stoudemire doesn't deserve to be compensated like a top-five player. Probably some team will bite the bullet and do it anyway, and that will give Stoudemire the excuse he needs to leave. But it will be a mistake for both sides.

what is also funny is the mentality of NBA fans across the US when it comes to signing Amare. Signing Lebron/Wade/Bosh all to max contracts is a no-brainer to any team. But when it comes to us resigning Amare or Amare signing elsewhere for the max, it comes as a laughable idea.

Amare will end up signing wherever he can for the most money. probably ending up wherever he can play second fiddle. i cannot see him going to NJ by himself, or Miami, or Chicago. He'll piggy back wherever he can because he is CLEARLY not a leader anywhere on or off the floor.

 

[pokerface]

I don't think he is worth the max, but who has been in the past?

Not many guys in pro sports are actually WORTH what they are being paid. Maybe to the owners and guys collecting the checks at the top, but for a FAN of the game?

I say pay the man. It's not my money

I hate it when fans say this..."what player is worth the max...its not my money, pay him..." Unless we have a super wealthy owner that doesn't care about salaries and caps WE HAVE TO CARE ABOUT THE MONEY. We have to care if Sarver cares...If money gets blown stupidly the team will definately suffer...If the team suffers the fans suffer. If Amare stinks on defense we have to bring other defensive players in to cover for him...If he stinks with rebounds then the same thing. There are only so many rostor spots and only so much money to go around. We cant have dead weight and unmovable bloated contracts everywhere. NBA is not only a basketball game but its a money game too!

 

[Cheesebeef]

what is also funny is the mentality of NBA fans across the US when it comes to signing Amare. Signing Lebron/Wade/Bosh all to max contracts is a no-brainer to any team. But when it comes to us resigning Amare or Amare signing elsewhere for the max, it comes as a laughable idea.

Amare will end up signing wherever he can for the most money. probably ending up wherever he can play second fiddle. i cannot see him going to NJ by himself, or Miami, or Chicago.

you say you don't see him in Miami or Chicago, but why? He'd clearly be second fiddle to Wade or Rose in both of those cities.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Suns seem to be playing their hand with Amare like a good poker player. The Suns really don't want to pay Amare the maximum but they have to play their hand like they might. What the Suns really want is to either keep Amare at a more reasonable salary or do a sign and trade. Amare really does not know what other teams will pay him so he has to play his cards as if he might stay with the Suns. The Suns may turn out to be Amare's best option even in a sign a trade because the Suns can give him the more lucrative contract before they trade him if he is in demand.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm surprised and sorry to hear Dudley say that. What's coming from Amare is positive about his resigning.

Amare and Dudley are close. Amare is meeting Dudley and Clark in Miami for vacation.

Dudley also mentioned, perhaps wistfully, that the Suns might be able to keep him for a shorter contract if they came in with more money per than is anticipated. Like I said though, he was acitvely praising Amare as a player and a teammate.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm not sure of the accuracy of the source but below is a link to an article of how the Suns might benefit by owning Amare's Bird Rights if he opts out. The article is fascinating and well worth the read to get one thinking about all the options for the Suns if Amare is in high demand.

http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2010/3/10/1322748/understanding-the-amare-stoudemire

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm not sure of the accuracy of the source but below is a link to an article of how the Suns might benefit by owning Amare's Bird Rights if he opts out. The article is fascinating and well worth the read to get one thinking about all the options for the Suns if Amare is in high demand.

http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2010/3/10/1322748/understanding-the-amare-stoudemire

The only thing I got from that article of note was the implication that the Suns were anticipating a traded players exception. We've had those before and if memory served they netted us nothing (or close to it). I really hope the TPE idea was the author's interpretation and not someone from the organization trying to soften the PR blow of Amare's exit.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

The only thing I got from that article of note was the implication that the Suns were anticipating a traded players exception. We've had those before and if memory served they netted us nothing (or close to it). I really hope the TPE idea was the author's interpretation and not someone from the organization trying to soften the PR blow of Amare's exit.

Steve

Well if the Suns could get a good young player(s) in return for significantly less salary than Amare is slated to make along with possibly a TE and some picks I think this type move might be the Suns best move. I don't view Amare as the building block for the Suns. As long as Nash is around the Suns can make something into something better. I think the Suns can win and rebuild at the same time if they don't lose Amare for nothing. I believe with Kurt Thomas it was all about the LT. This type move might keep the Suns under the LT and still be good.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Well if the Suns could get a good young player(s) in return for significantly less salary than Amare is slated to make along with possibly a TE and some picks I think this type move might be the Suns best move. I don't view Amare as the building block for the Suns. As long as Nash is around the Suns can make something into something better. I think the Suns can win and rebuild at the same time if they don't lose Amare for nothing. I believe with Kurt Thomas it was all about the LT. This type move might keep the Suns under the LT and still be good.

If we could get a player that has near star potential I'd be thrilled with the deal but like I said, I worry about the mention of the TPE. It came across to me that it might be the best part of the deal. Hopefully it was just the author's speculation and not an actual statement from a Suns official.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

If we could get a player that has near star potential I'd be thrilled with the deal but like I said, I worry about the mention of the TPE. It came across to me that it might be the best part of the deal. Hopefully it was just the author's speculation and not an actual statement from a Suns official.

Steve

The idea is the TE is an asset than the Suns may or may not use to get another player. They may not use any or all of it depending upon the LT. It would be important for the Suns to get a good young player plus picks to build upon. I believe a TE is good for a year. It allows the Suns flexibility to make other moves.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The idea is the TE is an asset than the Suns may or may not use to get another player. They may not use any or all of it depending upon the LT. It would be important for the Suns to get a good young player plus picks to build upon. I believe a TE is good for a year. It allows the Suns flexibility to make other moves.

I guess I'm not saying it well. I know what a TPE is but based on our history I wouldn't be very confident that we'd put it to use. It's really just a pretend asset as it has no value until/unless you use it. My concern is that the Suns may be in the process of letting this info out in an effort to soften the blow if we trade Amare and get back just a waiveable player and a TPE.

The article didn't say it outright but this sentence in regards to the TPE left me a little concerned "The Suns believe that having that kind of asset would be very valuable come February 2011". That's just the kind of PR spin they've used in the past.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

I guess I'm not saying it well. I know what a TPE is but based on our history I wouldn't be very confident that we'd put it to use. It's really just a pretend asset as it has no value until/unless you use it. My concern is that the Suns may be in the process of letting this info out in an effort to soften the blow if we trade Amare and get back just a waiveable player and a TPE.

The article didn't say it outright but this sentence in regards to the TPE left me a little concerned "The Suns believe that having that kind of asset would be very valuable come February 2011". That's just the kind of PR spin they've used in the past.

Steve

I think Kerr is now trying to correct the perceived sins of the past. I believe Sarver and Kerr now have a better grasp of how to run a franchise. Hopefully they don't prove me wrong.