Be very careful what you believe.

[Krangodnzr]

I read several comments on here saying the combine measurements were wrong, claiming there was a way to measure taller. I have no idea whether one can do that or not? I do believe Murray is around 5'8" by looking at pictures from the heisman ceremony. I'm not saying that will make him better or worse, just adding to the conversation in this post about his height.

Or you can believe his actual measurements. You know...optical illusions? I guess you also believe the world is flat too?

Gil Brandt was standing there when Murray was measured and he said it was correct.

 

[Krangodnzr]

There is a picture of Murray standing next to Tim Brown. Hes nearly the same height.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Boom! Same height as Haskins! Proven.

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[Cardsfaninlouky]

Or you can believe his actual measurements. You know...optical illusions? I guess you also believe the world is flat too?

Gil Brandt was standing there when Murray was measured and he said it was correct.

The world is flat, yeah I believe that.......smh laughing. I don't care one way or another honestly, I do not believe he is 5'10" but I'll cheer for him if he is the pick all day long no matter what. At the end of the day imo the cardinals have too many other needs to draft another QB when we already have one. They need to trade down & acquire more picks. Take away the scrambling ability of Murray imo & there wouldn't even be a discussion about him. But hey, some think he's worth the risk & there's no correct science to drafting players anyways.

 

[TheCardFan]

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[PACardsFan]

The world is flat, yeah I believe that.......smh laughing. I don't care one way or another honestly, I do not believe he is 5'10" but I'll cheer for him if he is the pick all day long no matter what. At the end of the day imo the cardinals have too many other needs to draft another QB when we already have one. They need to trade down & acquire more picks. Take away the scrambling ability of Murray imo & there wouldn't even be a discussion about him. But hey, some think he's worth the risk & there's no correct science to drafting players anyways.

Are you certain that we already have one???? There is nothing in Rosen's past, whether at UCLA or last year with the Cardinals, that indicates that he is the answer at QB for the AZ Cardinals. Take away the scrambling ability of Murray & there wouldn't even be a discussion??? Really? Yes, he's more elusive than Michael Vick. He's also as accurate as Drew Brees. Take away the 5'10" discussion, and there has never been a more complete package at the QB position. From pee wee football, up through HS football, and then college football, every time he has stepped on a football field, he is the BEST player on the field. This kid didn't grow up in Maine. He grew up in a state where dominating at the levels I mentioned cannot be ignored. If it means that you have to draft QB in 5 straight drafts in order to find your guy, then you do it. There is no position in any other sport that is paramount to what the QB position means to the NFL. There is no comparison between Josh Rosen & Kyler Murray. And yes, I have always been a fan of taller, more prototypical styles of QB's. If we opt to not draft Murray, it will sadden me to watch him be a superstar in another team's uniform. But, then again, it'll sadly be more evidence that we root for a franchise that'll never truly dare to be great.

 

[TheCardFan]

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[RON_IN_OC]

I don’t know about that. As far as I remember it wasn’t a big rumor before very shortly before the pick was made.

I have found a video (click here to see it) of Adam Schefter on draftday saying “there’s a growing belief” that the Browns could take Mayfield. Or there’s this tweet from Ian Rapaport (click here) the same day stating “[Mayfield going #1] is the buzz…”

Then there’s this tweet (click here) on draftnight from Benjamin Allbright (who, by the way, someone recently brought up as a highly trustworthy source who says that Kyler Murray to the Cards are a done deal): If I were a Browns fan, I'd start prepping for Mayfield. I was wrong on Darnold.”

There’s also this quote “Kiper previously had QB Josh Allen going to Cleveland in every one of his mock drafts, so he made the concession for Mayfield based on all of the reports today.” Or Todd McShay from his mock draft on draftnight: “I’ve had Darnold here in every mock I’ve done, dating back to my Way-Too-Early mock in May 2017, so why waver now?” (Click here to read the article)

Speaking of Allen to the Browns I think you are wrong as well.

Other than the quote from Kiper, there’s this quote from Pete Prisco of SI.com on April 12th (click here to read the article): "I think [Allen’s] going first overall," Prisco said. "I hear that too much from guys I respect in the business, who know a lot of people in the business. I'm talking about scouts and personnel people, who know guys and know Dorsey. I just keep hearing -- I've been saying it for a long time, and I just keep hearing it more and more that he will be the guy who goes No. 1 overall when it's all said and done." A couple of days earlier came this tweet (click here) quoting Daniel Jeremiah saying: “people that know people inside the Browns fully expect Josh Allen to be the pick at No.1.”

You see where this is going?

Those pesky facts getting in the way of an argument again... hahahaha

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[iLLmatiC]

Competent coaching that knows how to gameplan and develop players.

Crazy isn't it?

 

[RON_IN_OC]

This talk about Murray reminds me of the talk about Tavon Austin. We all saw how that worked out. He never lived up to his 8th spot selection.

I'm surprised SK didn't draft Austin...his production has been more like a late round small schooler, than a top 10 draftee.

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[RON_IN_OC]

We’ll have you watched film on Murray? For one, He is probably the best QB runner I’ve seen coming out college. The defense has to account for him running for a first down on every play. He will be the quickest player on the field. His passings not bad either!
It will be fun to watch! Rosen wasn’t fun to watch at all...kinda made me a little sick to my stomach.

Doesn't the same film on Murray also show him having superior skill player talent around him...superior college coaching and system around him? Didn't previous OK QBs have similar success in that system? Who was the last QB to have success in that abortion of a system the Cards ran last year? Even Rivers had some of his worst years in that offense...and the QBs in Denver looked awful, too.



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[RON_IN_OC]

I actually believe that KK was hired based on his plan of drafting Murray to develop his NFL version of the Air Raid Offense. I think Murray was his man all along starting from recruiting him in College. Now he has the chance to make it happen with his favorite QB. If he has to try and develop Rosen it will be forced and probably won’t work.

********! You don't hire a coach, based on a college player who hasn't even declared for the draft...or hasn't even declared football to be his preferred sport.

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[Krangodnzr]

********! You don't hire a coach, based on a college player who hasn't even declared for the draft...or hasn't even declared football to be his preferred sport.

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I think that Murray came up because the Cardinals started evaluating KKs offense and think Murray is a more dynamic fit.

 

[Solar7]

Are you certain that we already have one???? There is nothing in Rosen's past, whether at UCLA or last year with the Cardinals, that indicates that he is the answer at QB for the AZ Cardinals. Take away the scrambling ability of Murray & there wouldn't even be a discussion??? Really? Yes, he's more elusive than Michael Vick. He's also as accurate as Drew Brees. Take away the 5'10" discussion, and there has never been a more complete package at the QB position. From pee wee football, up through HS football, and then college football, every time he has stepped on a football field, he is the BEST player on the field. This kid didn't grow up in Maine. He grew up in a state where dominating at the levels I mentioned cannot be ignored. If it means that you have to draft QB in 5 straight drafts in order to find your guy, then you do it. There is no position in any other sport that is paramount to what the QB position means to the NFL. There is no comparison between Josh Rosen & Kyler Murray. And yes, I have always been a fan of taller, more prototypical styles of QB's. If we opt to not draft Murray, it will sadden me to watch him be a superstar in another team's uniform. But, then again, it'll sadly be more evidence that we root for a franchise that'll never truly dare to be great.

This is ridiculous. Every time he stepped on the field he was the greatest?

Then explain how he wasn't the starter at A&M and had to get a transfer.

The guy has played one season of college football. I'd stop arguing with you guys if you stopped saying every chance you got that Murray is the perfect, infallible, already best NFL QB of all time.

"More accurate than Drew Brees?" "A better runner than Michael Vick?" Come on.

 

[HeHasRosen]

This is ridiculous. Every time he stepped on the field he was the greatest?

Then explain how he wasn't the starter at A&M and had to get a transfer.

The guy has played one season of college football. I'd stop arguing with you guys if you stopped saying every chance you got that Murray is the perfect, infallible, already best NFL QB of all time.

"More accurate than Drew Brees?" "A better runner than Michael Vick?" Come on.

This is what Im saying. It's lunacy. Complete googly eyed rose colored glasses infatuation. Lots of guys losing credibility on evaluations as far as im concerned

 

[JeffGollin]

Rosen is the QB you saw last year!
KK cannot miraculously make him better. If we stick with Rosen get ready for a replay of last year!
I say let’s see what Murray can do as a dynamic passing running threat.
and Quit getting hung up on 5’10”, it’s not that much shorter than others!
We stunk it up last year and Rosen did nothing to inspire hope.
Let me ask you this, Who have we picked up on offense to make you think it will suddenly be any better than last year?
I don’t want to suffer through another year of that miserable play! We are the laughing stock of the NFL!
Draft Murray and let’s light up this offense!
Go get your man KK!

Give Rosen a healthy LT who can pass block and a durable 6-3 220 lb WR who can win 50-50 battles for the ball and I think we win at least a few more games.

I can see the benefits of Murray catching fire or Rosen steadily developing, but can't ignore the logic which says: If Murray bombs, we wind up with a stock roster and no QB. If Rosen bombs, we wind up with no QB but still get Bosa.

 

[cardpa]

Give Rosen a healthy LT who can pass block and a durable 6-3 220 lb WR who can win 50-50 battles for the ball and I think we win at least a few more games.

I can see the benefits of Murray catching fire or Rosen steadily developing, but can't ignore the logic which says: If Murray bombs, we wind up with a stock roster and no QB. If Rosen bombs, we wind up with no QB but still get Bosa.

And a better selection at the QB position come the 2020 draft should there be a requirement to draft one. Actually if the team was smart they would trade out of the #1 position in 2019 and accumulate some 2020 draft picks so if Rosen does fail then they have collateral to move up in the draft in 2020. If Rosen succeeds then you have extra draft choices in 2020.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

Are you certain that we already have one???? There is nothing in Rosen's past, whether at UCLA or last year with the Cardinals, that indicates that he is the answer at QB for the AZ Cardinals. Take away the scrambling ability of Murray & there wouldn't even be a discussion??? Really? Yes, he's more elusive than Michael Vick. He's also as accurate as Drew Brees. Take away the 5'10" discussion, and there has never been a more complete package at the QB position. From pee wee football, up through HS football, and then college football, every time he has stepped on a football field, he is the BEST player on the field. This kid didn't grow up in Maine. He grew up in a state where dominating at the levels I mentioned cannot be ignored. If it means that you have to draft QB in 5 straight drafts in order to find your guy, then you do it. There is no position in any other sport that is paramount to what the QB position means to the NFL. There is no comparison between Josh Rosen & Kyler Murray. And yes, I have always been a fan of taller, more prototypical styles of QB's. If we opt to not draft Murray, it will sadden me to watch him be a superstar in another team's uniform. But, then again, it'll sadly be more evidence that we root for a franchise that'll never truly dare to be great.

Not sure about anything really man, there's no 100% guarantees on anything with these players, as I've said many times it's a crapshoot really, roll of the dice on any player, seems like our cardinals always get the short end of the stick though no pun intended lol. I share your opinion that if another team drafts Murray & he blows up it will suck for us if Rosen is kept & he bombs? He was just put in a god awful situation last yr & I feel like our team needs outweigh drafting another QB. Kind of feel like he needs another yr? If we keep Rosen & he tanks next yr. There's always Tua from Alabama in the 2020 draft. It just pains me, all the yrs being so bad from 1976 till now (you go back further than me) minus a few good yrs here & there. Then we finally go to a SB, then have the BA yrs right on the cusp of doing something, then bam, it all goes to crap & we suck again. Soooooo tired of the losing, i just want the cardinals good again. At the end of the day, if Murray is our choice so be it, I'm a cardinals fan & I will be on board.

 

[slanidrac16]

Not sure about anything really man, there's no 100% guarantees on anything with these players, as I've said many times it's a crapshoot really, roll of the dice on any player, seems like our cardinals always get the short end of the stick though no pun intended lol. I share your opinion that if another team drafts Murray & he blows up it will suck for us if Rosen is kept & he bombs? He was just put in a god awful situation last yr & I feel like our team needs outweigh drafting another QB. Kind of feel like he needs another yr? If we keep Rosen & he tanks next yr. There's always Tua from Alabama in the 2020 draft. It just pains me, all the yrs being so bad from 1976 till now (you go back further than me) minus a few good yrs here & there. Then we finally go to a SB, then have the BA yrs right on the cusp of doing something, then bam, it all goes to crap & we suck again. Soooooo tired of the losing, i just want the cardinals good again. At the end of the day, if Murray is our choice so be it, I'm a cardinals fan & I will be on board.

No matter what we do if it’s the wrong decision keim, Bidwill, kingsbury and the whole bunch will be sliced and diced by media, fans and everybody in between. Winning is the only “right” answer. This team needs to see a 5 game improvement to be considered a successful year. That’s asking a lot. More realistically we need two years to really be competitive. I believe we will be doing a lot of complaining over the remainder of the year because success will not come fast enough.

 

[Cardsfaninlouky]

No matter what we do if it’s the wrong decision keim, Bidwill, kingsbury and the whole bunch will be sliced and diced by media, fans and everybody in between. Winning is the only “right” answer. This team needs to see a 5 game improvement to be considered a successful year. That’s asking a lot. More realistically we need two years to really be competitive. I believe we will be doing a lot of complaining over the remainder of the year because success will not come fast enough.

I agree, I would settle for a 5 game improvement. 8-8 hell yeah, I will take that.

 

[Krangodnzr]

This is what Im saying. It's lunacy. Complete googly eyed rose colored glasses infatuation. Lots of guys losing credibility on evaluations as far as im concerned

I'd say you were losing credibility if you had any in the first place.

HeHasRosen? HeHasBustin.

 

[cardsfanmd]

I pegged baker as the #1 pick during the combine. Those other hacks just had to catch up. the thread is here on asfn

My father and I both had him labeled early on in the collegiate season. Just like we do with Murray this year.

 

[HeHasRosen]

I'd say you were losing credibility if you had any in the first place.

HeHasRosen? HeHasBustin.

Haha how so? I've been firmly planted here in my stance the whole time. Nothing left to say really. Im not the one using the same arguments for me that I rallied against in a different thread lol

I just think it's funny how this debate has evolved into the ridiculous state its in. Literally two sides bashing the other guy for the most ridiculous reasons. Searching for anything to validate their opinion. It is entertaining though.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Haha how so? I've been firmly planted here in my stance the whole time. Nothing left to say really. Im not the one using the same arguments for me that I rallied against in a different thread lol

I just think it's funny how this debate has evolved into the ridiculous state its in. Literally two sides bashing the other guy for the most ridiculous reasons. Searching for anything to validate their opinion. It is entertaining though.

I like debates. Keeps my brain sharp.