Bring Nash Off the Bench

jandaman

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Posts
1,263
Reaction score
3
Calderon with Stoudemire, O'Neal, Diaw, Bell would suffice and hopefully "keep" the Suns within 20 points of the opposition within the first half of the first quarter..

Then Nash can come in and hopefully give the Suns the lead....


All you can do is give me an emoticon that rolls its eyes...


Seriously... THINK for a second.
 

jandaman

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Posts
1,263
Reaction score
3
Calderon with Stoudemire, O'Neal, Diaw, Bell would suffice and hopefully "keep" the Suns within 20 points of the opposition within the first half of the first quarter..

Then Nash can come in and hopefully give the Suns the lead....


All you can do is give me an emoticon that rolls its eyes...
I dont smoke... anymore.


Seriously... THINK for a second.

Your analogy is just not even close to what I stated before.


Calderon starts... Nash comes in...
PLAYS his normal minutes...

SIMPLE.

People think Suns are complete TRASH without Nash on the court..... With Barbosa, the Suns played "okay"... and thats mainly hogging the ball and alienating the players that he should be passing to..

So with a play maker in Calderon, wouldnt that be a better scenario?.. so much better atleast. Then you have Nash come in, with a semi-tired starter point guard... so now with his age, he can keep up atleast defensively..
 

mack2323

Newbie
Joined
May 15, 2008
Posts
24
Reaction score
0
Maybe Kobe should come off the bench. Maybe he'll win the 6th man of the playoff.lol.
 

okhoops

Rookie
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Posts
77
Reaction score
0
Nobody's even mentioning the fact that Toronto isn't likely to trade Calderon especially for a seriously deficient Barbosa and Tucker. Outside of Deron Williams and Chris Paul, Calderon is the third best young PG in the league. Living in Canada, I get a ton of Raptor games and he is legit. They will trade TJ and build behind Calderon. Genuine point guards/team leaders are the rarest of breeds at any level. Brian isn't going to trade him unless someone gives up the farm.
 

YouJustGotSUNSD

Custom User Title!
Joined
Jun 6, 2007
Posts
5,168
Reaction score
0
Shame on anyone advocating Nash off the bench. He is the commander of the court.

It's just as silly as people saying he would be a great 2 guard since his shooting stats are so good.
 

mojorizen7

ASFN Addict
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Posts
9,165
Reaction score
472
Location
In a van...down by the river.
Yeah seriously. It's called an analogy. :rolleyes:

Nash isn't Chris Paul but he is still a top 3 PG in this league.

What the hell are you guys smoking?
;)
You must be registered for see images

Remember,i'm from the camp that say's trade Nash/Barbs/Bell for youth/picks and blow up the backcourt altogether so i'm not in favor of Nash off the bench but i'm saying it's possible.
 

mojorizen7

ASFN Addict
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Posts
9,165
Reaction score
472
Location
In a van...down by the river.
GM Colangelo has several options at his disposal after Bulls land top selection in draft

May 22, 2008 04:30 AM
Doug Smith
SPORTS REPORTER

Now that the NBA draft lottery is out of the way, the shopping can start in earnest for the Raptors.
And from the school of "one team's misfortune is another team's opportunity," there are those within the organization who think things worked out just swimmingly Tuesday night.
Chicago winning the right to the No.1 pick in the June 26 draft, knocking the favoured Miami Heat down to No.2, was "not a bad thing," according to one voice within the Toronto hierarchy.
The scenario the Raptors envision is:
The Bulls, who have soured completely on Kirk Hinrich as their point guard, take Memphis' Derrick Rose, a Chicago product represented by an agent with close ties to the Bulls organization, with the No.1 pick.
That leaves the Heat to decide whether they want Kansas State power forward Michael Beasley and, if they do, Miami will still be in the market for an accomplished point guard, something Toronto has in T.J. Ford and Jose Calderon.
No one from the Raptors was talking in specifics yesterday, but the chance to move either Ford or Calderon could net someone like power forward Udonis Haslem in some kind of package deal.
And with the way general manager Bryan Colangelo likes to think, there's even a likelihood he'll ask about the availability of the No.2 pick in some kind of blockbuster trade.
There is no doubt teams covet Calderon, a restricted free agent, in some kind of sign-and-trade transaction and there's also no doubt the Raptors have fielded several calls about him. And Ford, according to league sources, has plenty of marketability around the league as teams see him as a starter with a manageable contract that pays him slightly more than $8 million a season for the next three.
The rest of the lottery held pretty much true to form, which again leaves the guard-rich Raptors, who also have a collection of players with expiring contracts to add to any deal, anxious to see what opportunities present themselves.
The Seattle SuperSonics, already among the youngest teams in the league, may be enticed to deal the No.4 pick, but there will be several teams chasing that pick if it's available.
It's impossible to predict now how the rest of the lottery will unfold – teams haven't even started working out prospective picks – but the thought is Minnesota may need a centre to go along with power forward Al Jefferson, and look to Stanford's Brook Lopez. Or the T-Wolves could opt for USC's O.J. Mayo to improve their backcourt.
Memphis at No.5 is an uncertainty. The Grizzlies seem set at point guard and on the wings but could use a big man.
The immediate speculation is that the Knicks, with the No.6 pick and a point guard (Nate Robinson) who has the kind of quickness new coach Mike D'Antoni likes, would be intrigued by Italian forward Danilo Gallinari.
If D'Antoni is enamoured of Robinson and Jamal Crawford as a potent offensive backcourt, the likelihood of drafting Gallinari increases.
But even if the Raptors are able to get nothing accomplished by trading with a lottery team, they have all kinds of options with their own pick, No.17 in the first round.
Colangelo and his staff are whittling down an extensive list of potential selections to a manageable number.
There are about a dozen big men and an equal number of wings and guards who are likely to be available at that choice, giving the braintrust plenty of names to consider.
All of this is dependent on what transpires ahead of them, but Toronto could have a choice of big men like JaVale McGee of Nevada, Mareese Speights of Florida, France's Alexis Ajinca or Georgetown's Roy Hibbert.
http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_a...ptors_still_fielding_calls_for_ford/calderon/
 

Covert Rain

Father smelt of elderberries!
Supporting Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2005
Posts
35,771
Reaction score
14,506
Location
Arizona
First off you play your best players together. Typically by the time the backup PG comes in the game he is not playing with all the starters. You would not get your best out of Nash or your starters.

Second, Nash has a history of back problems. Sitting him at the start of games is not advisable. Asking him to come into a game already in full swing towards the latter half of the 1st period is not advisable. Usually Nash has a short period from warm-ups to the actual game. It doesn't give his back a chance to stiffen up on him.

So yes Nash could still get his minutes. However, they would be less meaningful minutes IMO with a much higher risk of injury for him. Also, I don't see the point of starting an inferior guard over Nash. If the logic that Nash would still get his minutes applies to Nash...wouldn't that also apply to our other guard? Why couldn't are other guard still get his minutes coming off the bench?

I have yet to read one plausible reason to bring an inferior guard to this team, have him start and bring Nash off the bench. Why? Just to convince the guy to come here? If that's the case than any smart PG is going to know that Nash will be in there during crunch time and probably wouldn't want to come here knowing that anyway.
 

mojorizen7

ASFN Addict
Joined
Oct 16, 2007
Posts
9,165
Reaction score
472
Location
In a van...down by the river.
Second, Nash has a history of back problems. Sitting him at the start of games is not advisable. Asking him to come into a game already in full swing towards the latter half of the 1st period is not advisable. Usually Nash has a short period from warm-ups to the actual game. It doesn't give his back a chance to stiffen up on him.
Good point. I hadn't considered that.
 

TBaslim

Planet Orange
Joined
Apr 13, 2006
Posts
1,312
Reaction score
0
Calderon with Stoudemire, O'Neal, Diaw, Bell would suffice and hopefully "keep" the Suns within 20 points of the opposition within the first half of the first quarter..

Then Nash can come in and hopefully give the Suns the lead....


All you can do is give me an emoticon that rolls its eyes...


Seriously... THINK for a second.

Seriously...I did think for a sec. This is a terrible idea.

Maybe Nash comes off the bench a few more years from now, but he is still just passing the peak of his prime.

The issues with him wearing down are due to not having ANY decent backup PG who can run the team and not lose a lead. Not because he is ready to be a bench player.

Flopinobli is unique...he's a starter and Bowen is a 6th man at this stage of his career. They just start Bowen to set a nasty, physical tone with the refs from the jump ball. It is part of the Spurs intentional strategy for allowing the game to get rough and not foul their entire team out by the 3rd.
 

Darth Llama

Rise Up Red Sea!
Joined
Dec 9, 2007
Posts
2,360
Reaction score
0
Location
Section 444 Row 4
I understand the logic, but it's a bad idea.

The Starters are the ones that establish the tempo of the game, and then you bring the bench in to try and "hold down the fort" while you get some rest for your starters. If Nash's minutes are an issue, then it makes more sense to bring his eventual replacement off the bench and just limit Nash's minutes as a starter. The team develops a chemistry to start a game, and they have a comfort zone that is best held with familiarity. The Suns are familiar with Nash, they're used to him, it's not that big of a deal for a front court player, but it's huge for a Point Guard.

You don't find new direction for your franchise by benching your best player (or one of them at least.) Steve Nash is not the problem for Phoenix, Steve Nash is a stud. If you're going to use Nash as a mentor and a teacher, you don't have him in a back up role, it's just that simple. I totally understand the logic of the post, but you would accomplish it better by just bringing in a PG that can come off the bench and reduce Nash's minutes as a starter.
 

SO91

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Sep 13, 2006
Posts
3,046
Reaction score
371
It's a ridiculous idea...you don't bring the leader of the team off the bench when he's better than nearly every pg in the league.
 

jandaman

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Posts
1,263
Reaction score
3
Again some didnt get the idea..

I only agreed to bring Nash off the bench if the Suns can net a PG that WILL work with the starting 5 almost as good as with Nash on there.

And thats limited to a few point guards...
so obviously... if its not Calderon, Deron, Chris, heck even Andre Miller... then theres no point bringing Nash off the bench


But if theres a point guard available that can carry the first minutes decently, and give Nash rest so he can come in and play with more energy in crunch time and fresher for the second half of the season I'm all for it..




Again, once your pass a certain age and you play many minutes, the changes from one season to the next is significant enough, stat wise it depends, but it hits you harder the last leg of the season into the playoffs.
 

Ollie

Croissant Eater
Joined
Jul 6, 2005
Posts
1,010
Reaction score
0
IF, by some kind of miracle, Kerr manages to lure Calderon in Phoenix, you must start him next to Nash and bring Raja off the bench.

Backcourt 1997, baby!
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,214
Reaction score
11,795
Caulderon isn't better than Nash at this point in his career. I've lost faith in quite a few of you.

There are 2 PG's in this league you can start over Nash right now. Chris Paul and Deron Williams. THAT'S IT!

What a shame.
 

Darth Llama

Rise Up Red Sea!
Joined
Dec 9, 2007
Posts
2,360
Reaction score
0
Location
Section 444 Row 4
Caulderon isn't better than Nash at this point in his career. I've lost faith in quite a few of you.

There are 2 PG's in this league you can start over Nash right now. Chris Paul and Deron Williams. THAT'S IT!

What a shame.

Umm.. Tony Parker?

I love Nash, but he's 4th on my list.

1. Chris Paul
2. Deron Williams
3. Tony Parker
4. Steve Nash

But that's just me I guess. :p
 

dreamcastrocks

Chopped Liver Moderator
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2005
Posts
46,214
Reaction score
11,795
Umm.. Tony Parker?

I love Nash, but he's 4th on my list.

1. Chris Paul
2. Deron Williams
3. Tony Parker
4. Steve Nash

But that's just me I guess. :p

Tony Parker is arguable. He's good, but Nash is still putting up MVP numbers.

Caulderon??? Some of you guys are smoking crack.
 

Darth Llama

Rise Up Red Sea!
Joined
Dec 9, 2007
Posts
2,360
Reaction score
0
Location
Section 444 Row 4
Tony Parker is arguable. He's good, but Nash is still putting up MVP numbers.

Caulderon??? Some of you guys are smoking crack.

Yeah, I agree, I could go either way with those two (Parker/Nash.) Caulderon is no where near the Caliber of any of those 4. Those 4 are VERY close in talent, and then the drop off from 4th to 5th is huge. No way anyone on that list comes off the bench for anyone.
 

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
547,496
Posts
5,351,652
Members
6,304
Latest member
Dbacks05
Top