Bucks @ Suns Tuesday game thread 3-14-2023

[AzStevenCal]

So what's the excuse the other dozen times they've taken our lunch money recently?

Well counting our finals loss we're 5-7 over our past 12 games and that seems to match up fairly accurately with the talent difference between the two clubs.

 

[Hoop Head]

Suns had a chance to upgrade from Payne and JJ decided not to do so. Payne is a problem.
Shooting 23% off the bench? Derrick Rose was available among other veteran PGs. Jones
should have addressed this problem in the offseason or at the very least, trade deadline.

Derrick Rose is NOT the answer. This isn't 2013. Payne will be fine. He's working his way back from a prolonged absence and hasn't found his shot yet but he's still a facilitator that defenses need to keep an eye on. Derrick Rose hasn't been a threat to do anything in years. Payne is among one of the top backup PG's in the league. He knows his role and wants to be here. He didn't cost us this game.


I had to look up Rose's stats and he's shooting 30% from 3 and 38% from the field for the year. Payne is shooting 36% from 3 and 42% from the field this year. Payne averages 3 more assists a game, which is impressive since he only averages 4.7 a game. Rose meanwhile is the answer at 1.7 assists a game. Payne has doubled Rose's minutes as well at 784 to 338.

 

[Raindog]

The only (consistent) talent disparity over that period is that the Bucks have harder nosed and physically (and mentally) tougher players. The Suns, even at full strength, have to be 100% on their game to compete with any team that has those same attributes, and that's at best a precarious prospect, especially in the playoffs when physical teams always get the benefit of the officiating.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Derrick Rose is NOT the answer. This isn't 2013. Payne will be fine. He's working his way back from a prolonged absence and hasn't found his shot yet but he's still a facilitator that defenses need to keep an eye on. Derrick Rose hasn't been a threat to do anything in years. Payne is among one of the top backup PG's in the league. He knows his role and wants to be here. He didn't cost us this game.

I don't know if Payne will be fine but yeah, Rose is no longer the answer.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't know if Payne will be fine but yeah, Rose is no longer the answer.

I hope he's fine. I'm giving him time to work himself back into game shape as he's typically a pretty streaky shooter. I wish Paul were playing better so Payne's play wasn't a necessity but I wish Monty would give Payne a couple starts, and let Paul rest, to sort of push Payne as he produces really well when thrust into a starting role.

Rose is likely done though. He might sign on somewhere next season but his days of making an impact are over. They were over a year or two back but Thibs kept him around in New York out of loyalty or familiarity.

 

[DJ Tabooh]

I hope he's fine. I'm giving him time to work himself back into game shape as he's typically a pretty streaky shooter. I wish Paul were playing better so Payne's play wasn't a necessity but I wish Monty would give Payne a couple starts, and let Paul rest, to sort of push Payne as he produces really well when thrust into a starting role.

Rose is likely done though. He might sign on somewhere next season but his days of making an impact are over. They were over a year or two back but Thibs kept him around in New York out of loyalty or familiarity.

Umm….Ross never played for the Knicks. He’s been on the Raptors, Magic and now Suns. Never played for Thibs.

 

[TJ]

This team plays their assess off but loses way too many games that involve complex strategy. Monty is proving to be a better mentor or cheerleader than head coach. Lately, he just seems over his head

 

[AzStevenCal]

I hope he's fine. I'm giving him time to work himself back into game shape as he's typically a pretty streaky shooter. I wish Paul were playing better so Payne's play wasn't a necessity but I wish Monty would give Payne a couple starts, and let Paul rest, to sort of push Payne as he produces really well when thrust into a starting role.

Rose is likely done though. He might sign on somewhere next season but his days of making an impact are over. They were over a year or two back but Thibs kept him around in New York out of loyalty or familiarity.

He was a huge factor for them for the first year plus and many of their bad losses came when he wasn't available. But yeah, he's just not the same player this season. I don't follow them close enough to know just why but he's been a shell of the player he was when the Knicks were the surprise of the league a couple years ago.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I hope he's fine. I'm giving him time to work himself back into game shape as he's typically a pretty streaky shooter. I wish Paul were playing better so Payne's play wasn't a necessity but I wish Monty would give Payne a couple starts, and let Paul rest, to sort of push Payne as he produces really well when thrust into a starting role.

Umm….Ross never played for the Knicks. He’s been on the Raptors, Magic and now Suns. Never played for Thibs.

True but that post was about D Rose.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The only (consistent) talent disparity over that period is that the Bucks have harder nosed and physically (and mentally) tougher players. The Suns, even at full strength, have to be 100% on their game to compete with any team that has those same attributes, and that's at best a precarious prospect, especially in the playoffs when physical teams always get the benefit of the officiating.

can’t agree here. Giannis alone tilts the talent scale over to their side and They’re 1-2-3 have been more talented than ours the last two seasons and this season by a country mile with the way CP3 has fallen off a cliff. They’re also taller and more versatile with big guys that can post and shoot threes with Lopez and Crazy Eyes (can’t remember his name).

 

[GatorAZ]

Monty complaining after the fact means nothing. You gotta have your guy’s backs in the moment.

 

[TJ]

This guy needs to stop with the Clueless “my bad” takes during pressers and actually learn from these mistakes. I love Monty and am desperately holding out hope that he can get this team across the finish line, but I’ve seen far more coaching blunders from him these past few weeks or so than I’ve ever seen.

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[TJ]

Monty complaining after the fact means nothing. You gotta have your guy’s backs in the moment.

It’s become disingenuous. He apologizes, tells the media he needs to do something more or something better and just doesn’t do it

 

[nashman]

This is what I've been thinking. We clearly were not utilizing Mikal to the extent he was capable.

Eh that’s not on Monty dude played tons of minutes just didn’t perform like he is in Brooklyn with zero pressure. Mikal got plenty of chances and was hit or miss basically his whole time here, was always pretty good defensively but his offense could be good or dreadful on any night!

 

[nashman]

Booker is FANTASTIC but time after time it’s apparent he’s not athletic enough to impose his will on the best players. The best players in the game do. Period. To argue against this tonight of all nights, when he was totally shut down in the 4th just tells me you’re too drunk on the Kool-Aid to be objective.

Let’s be objective then Booker was fouled all night by Holiday and others and shot 3 ducking FTs all game while Giannis gets 24 on less contact sometimes. It’s pretty ridiculous they are allowed to be that physical with Book and get no calls!

 

[nashman]

I see a floundering Suns team out there on the court without much depth.

If Durant doesn't return soon, the Suns look like a play-in team.

Floundering they just lost to arguably 3 of the best highest scoring teams in basketball and were in all of them late in the 4th…

 

[leclerc]

Middleton always seems to have great games against us so not sad about this.

Eager to see Okogie try to stop their PG, Holiday something-something.

 

[Chaplin]

Floundering they just lost to arguably 3 of the best highest scoring teams in basketball and were in all of them late in the 4th…

I'm still pretty sure we win all 3 games had we had Durant on the floor. Last night would have still been a little nerve wracking, but the previous 2? Abso-frickin-lutely we would have won with KD playing.

 

[Chaplin]

Since Kevin Durant has hardly played for the Suns yet, the best answer to whether he will lead the Suns to defeat the Bucks, Warriors or Celtics is: difficult to say. If I should bet on him wiith no anecdotal evidence (figuratively - I don't gamble), convince me.

I feel almost the same as Mainstreet about the trade. The only difference is our reasons. Mine is more that I had no interest in superstar-chasing, and was annoyed.

I don't need to convince you -- we were close in the 4th against these previous teams, a perennial HOF added to the mix would have heavily weighted in our favor. That's it. Wouldn't be easy, but KD could easily put us over the top. Not only would he provide the offensive punch we need to score more points, he would also get us a lot more free throws and cause havoc defensively.

And you yourself has said you haven't followed the team until recently. Not sure faux outrage on the trade is a good look for you.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That seems to be an extension of Monty and JJ. They both seem to be oriented towards finesse basketball rather than physical basketball. Ergo, why we regularly get our teeth kicked in by physical teams like the Bucks, Clippers, Pelicans, etc.

Once again, we seem to be repeating the D'Antoni era... when we regularly got wedgied by Popovich's Spurs teams. I'm not sure why we always need to be the softies of the league, even when we have some of the better personnel.

Can’t understate the difference mcgee and crowder created. If you recall the beginning of last season teams were crying when they played us that we were a physical team beating them up. Those two had an effect on other players’ play. It’s certainly not because we let bridges or cam Johnson go, in their own natural playbthise two aren’t bullies. But our entire demeanor has changed without mcgee and crowder.

 

[Chaplin]

Can’t understate the difference mcgee and crowder created. If you recall the beginning of last season teams were crying when they played us that we were a physical team beating them up. Those two had an effect on other players’ play. It’s certainly not because we let bridges or cam Johnson go, in their own natural playbthise two aren’t bullies. But our entire demeanor has changed without mcgee and crowder.

McGee? Meh. Crowder? Absolutely. I'm no fan of Jae Crowder and his 1-8 from 3 nights, but he at least brought some toughness to the lineup.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Let’s be objective then Booker was fouled all night by Holiday and others and shot 3 ducking FTs all game while Giannis gets 24 on less contact sometimes. It’s pretty ridiculous they are allowed to be that physical with Book and get no calls!

I don’t think you know what this word means.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

McGee? Meh. Crowder? Absolutely. I'm no fan of Jae Crowder and his 1-8 from 3 nights, but he at least brought some toughness to the lineup.

I’m not even arguing mcgee from a fit perspective, just the attitude he helped crowder instill.

 

[Germz249]

I am tired of the NBA.. Luka gets away with all these push offs and gets gifted trips to the free throw line.. Giannis can lower his shoulder and run through people and get the blocking foul and free trips to the free throw line.

These guys going to the free throw line 15-20 times a game.. its starting to be a joke to me..

 

[Covert Rain]

McGee? Meh. Crowder? Absolutely. I'm no fan of Jae Crowder and his 1-8 from 3 nights, but he at least brought some toughness to the lineup.

Absolutely McGee. There is a big drop off with attitude and toughness coming off our bench verses Landale. It’s not even close. Teams were calling the Suns tough, physical and sometimes even dirty by opposing fans.