Busted most likely

[GimmedaBall]

We hammer our Cards and GM SK for his 'poor' record at drafting players who stick.

The numbers for the league overall are not at all pretty---and add some perspective when looking at how the Cards have done with their draft picks.

Here's a breakdown (with a Vikings perspective) with a key takeaway

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts

Biggest busts of the last 15 years:

http://www.businessinsider.com/top-nfl-draft-busts-2017-10

There might be some method to SK's success with the lower round selections: key takeaway of this .pdf article

"The results of the research show that 60 % of the running backs and wide receivers in the 3 rd-7th round sample have amassed greater average career statistics than the 1st and 2nd round players they were compared with."

https://fisherpub.sjfc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1064&context=sport_undergrad

 

[DevonCardsFan]

We hammer our Cards and GM SK for his 'poor' record at drafting players who stick.

The numbers for the league overall are not at all pretty---and add some perspective when looking at how the Cards have done with their draft picks.

Here's a breakdown (with a Vikings perspective) with a key takeaway

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts

Biggest busts of the last 15 years:

http://www.businessinsider.com/top-nfl-draft-busts-2017-10

There might be some method to SK's success with the lower round selections: key takeaway of this .pdf article

"The results of the research show that 60 % of the running backs and wide receivers in the 3 rd-7th round sample have amassed greater average career statistics than the 1st and 2nd round players they were compared with."

https://fisherpub.sjfc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1064&context=sport_undergrad

Keim is missing with the early picks though, with guys we all as a board Universally hate. Cooper, Brandon Williams, Troy Nicklaus, Reddick, Alot of picks we all universally meh'd

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Heres Keims draft WOW, is 2016 bad, 2017 is pretty bad aside from Baker. This is the reason the Cards depth is lacking, Keims past 2 drafts were pretty Awful!


2017 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 13 Haason Reddick LB Temple
2 36 Budda Baker SAF Washington-
3 98 Chad Williams WR Grambling State
4 115 Dorian Johnson G Pittsburgh
5 157 Will Holden T Vanderbilt
5 179 T.J. Logan RB North Carolina
6 208 Rudy Ford SAF Auburn
2016 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 29 Robert Nkemdiche DT Mississippi
3 92 Brandon Williams CB Texas A&M
4 128 Evan Boehm C Missouri
5 167 Marqui Christian SAF Midwestern State
5 170 Cole Toner T Harvard
6 205 Harlan Miller CB Southeastern Louisiana
2015 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 24 D.J. Humphries T Florida
2 58 Markus Golden DE Missouri
3 86 David Johnson RB Northern Iowa
4 116 Rodney Gunter DT Delaware State
5 158 Shaquille Riddick DE West Virginia
5 159 J.J. Nelson WR Alabama-Birmingham
7 256 Gerald Christian TE Louisville
2014 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 27 Deone Bucannon SS Washington State
2 52 Troy Niklas TE Notre Dame
3 84 Kareem Martin DE North Carolina
3 91 John Brown WR Pittsburg State
4 120 Logan Thomas QB Virginia Tech
5 160 Ed Stinson DE Alabama
6 196 Walt Powell WR Murray State
2013 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 7 Jonathan Cooper OG North Carolina
2 45 Kevin Minter LB LSU
3 69 Tyrann Mathieu FS LSU
4 103 Alex Okafor LB Texas
4 116 Earl Watford OG James Madison
5 140 Stepfan Taylor RB Stanford
6 174 Ryan Swope -- Texas A&M
6 187 Andre Ellington RB Clemson
7 219 D.C. Jefferson TE Rutgers

 

[Dan H]

All but one player from the 2016 draft is still on the roster, and he's not because he WASN'T a bust.

I think it's too soon to grade the last two drafts, especially given the universally recognized inability of Arians' staff to develop young players.

 

[Billy Bob]

All but one player from the 2016 draft is still on the roster, and he's not because he WASN'T a bust.

I think it's too soon to grade the last two drafts, especially given the universally recognized inability of Arians' staff to develop young players.

Williams, Boehm and Nkemdichie I count 3

 

[Finito]

We hammer our Cards and GM SK for his 'poor' record at drafting players who stick.

The numbers for the league overall are not at all pretty---and add some perspective when looking at how the Cards have done with their draft picks.

Here's a breakdown (with a Vikings perspective) with a key takeaway

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts

Biggest busts of the last 15 years:

http://www.businessinsider.com/top-nfl-draft-busts-2017-10

There might be some method to SK's success with the lower round selections: key takeaway of this .pdf article

"The results of the research show that 60 % of the running backs and wide receivers in the 3 rd-7th round sample have amassed greater average career statistics than the 1st and 2nd round players they were compared with."

https://fisherpub.sjfc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1064&context=sport_undergrad

Don't even try. No one listens to reason here SK is the worst GM in the NFL

 

[AZfaninMN]

Williams, Boehm and Nkemdichie I count 3

Harlan miller too.

 

[Dan H]

Harlan miller too.

I thought Toner was still on the club, but the larger point remains.

 

[AZfaninMN]

I thought Toner was still on the club, but the larger point remains.

I believe he signed with the chargers. Either way, nothing that’s worth really mentioning. Hopefully that’s this classes coming out party

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Don't even try. No one listens to reason here SK is the worst GM in the NFL

LOL Yes an Awesome he has molded

QB Bradford/Glennon

Fitz and Butler

1 CB,

Keim is killing it, this Squad just screams Championship!

 

[Solar7]

LOL Yes an Awesome he has molded

QB Bradford/Glennon

Fitz and Butler

1 CB,

Keim is killing it, this Squad just screams Championship!

The team was in the NFC Championship game 3 years ago. I know you want to cry and scream, but we've won the 5th most games in the league in his tenure.

 

[cardncubfan]

The team was in the NFC Championship game 3 years ago. I know you want to cry and scream, but we've won the 5th most games in the league in his tenure.

Nobody listens to reason. They are like an infant that needs it's pacifier. They need instant gratification & cry if they don't get it.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

The team was in the NFC Championship game 3 years ago. I know you want to cry and scream, but we've won the 5th most games in the league in his tenure.

LoL we also made the Superbowl with Whiz as a Headcoach lol. Cards won despite of Keim, besides prove it deals and Palmer and Jones trade, name a stellar move by Keim?

 

[GimmedaBall]

Draft success has to be weighed in relationship to how well other teams perform in the draft. From that perspective, looks like SK is doing above league average.

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts

Without going into details on each of SK's draft (that duty falls on those with the negative point to prove) it appears that (1) less than 2 of every 3 players he has drafted is a bust, (2) more than half have added some value to the team after being drafted, and (3) more than 1 out of 10 is having a distinguished career in the NFL. (Based on the definitions in the Viking draft analysis cited above)

Now, it would be nice if every single pick was being selected All-Pro . . . but that can be said for every other team as well.

 

[BillsCarnage]

I think it's too soon to grade the last two drafts, especially given the universally recognized inability of Arians' staff to develop young players.

Bingo! Under Arians the Cards hoped the early round picks would be able to contribute immediately. The reality is that the vast majority of draft picks need development.

Let's see if Wilks' staff can do anything with the remaining draft picks before calling them all busts.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Draft success has to be weighed in relationship to how well other teams perform in the draft. From that perspective, looks like SK is doing above league average.

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts
https://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/4/12/15274148/most-nfl-draft-picks-are-busts
Without going into details on each of SK's draft (that duty falls on those with the negative point to prove) it appears that (1) less than 2 of every 3 players he has drafted is a bust, (2) more than half have added some value to the team after being drafted, and (3) more than 1 out of 10 is having a distinguished career in the NFL. (Based on the definitions in the Viking draft analysis cited above)

Now, it would be nice if every single pick was being selected All-Pro . . . but that can be said for every other team as well.

The proof is lets go per rd, he is missing in yhe early rds when you need it. Alot of busts in the later rd, but Keim is missing with his early picks. This is too general of a concept, looking at the whole draft, most late rders bust

 

[cardncubfan]

The proof is lets go per rd, he is missing in yhe early rds when you need it. Alot of busts in the later rd, but Keim is missing with his early picks. This is too general of a concept, looking at the whole draft, most late rders bust

How many of the first 32 players picked each year do you think go on to have great careers?

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

Nobody listens to reason. They are like an infant that needs it's pacifier. They need instant gratification & cry if they don't get it.

Yeah, that's it!!

We are one of the oldest clubs in the league, and only sniffed the Lombardi ONCE!

 

[Solar7]

LoL we also made the Superbowl with Whiz as a Headcoach lol. Cards won despite of Keim, besides prove it deals and Palmer and Jones trade, name a stellar move by Keim?

Overall roster construction. John Abraham came onto the team and succeeded. So did Antonio Cromartie. He drafted Honey Badger, who was All-Pro, unfortunately derailed by injuries. He drafted David Johnson, who is far and beyond the best running back the Cardinals have ever had in Arizona.

In terms of overall success, within Keim's first year, we had turned over 26 players on the roster. By 2014, it was something like 13 remaining players from the Graves era. By 2015, our best year? I believe it was 5 or under. Like it or not, this was Keim's team, and he built a strong, competitive team in just a few years, without the benefit of a cheap franchise QB.

The proof is lets go per rd, he is missing in yhe early rds when you need it. Alot of busts in the later rd, but Keim is missing with his early picks. This is too general of a concept, looking at the whole draft, most late rders bust

Do the research then. Go through and pick a similar team with a "good" GM and gauge their successful draft picks in the past 5 years.

I bet you'll find that other teams picking outside of the top 10 in that 5 year span had similar or worse success.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

How many of the first 32 players picked each year do you think go on to have great careers?

2017 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 13 Haason Reddick LB Temple
2 36 Budda Baker SAF Washington-
3 98 Chad Williams WR Grambling State

2016 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 29 Robert Nkemdiche DT Mississippi
3 92 Brandon Williams CB Texas A&M

2015 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 24 D.J. Humphries T Florida
2 58 Markus Golden DE Missouri
3 86 David Johnson RB Northern Iowa


2014 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 27 Deone Bucannon SS Washington State
2 52 Troy Niklas TE Notre Dame
3 84 Kareem Martin DE North Carolina


2013 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 7 Jonathan Cooper OG North Carolina
2 45 Kevin Minter LB LSU
3 69 Tyrann Mathieu FS LS


Ok Out of this 14 first 3 rd picks, how many would you say hit and lets compare to the avg.

2015 seems to be the outlier, if you throw that out, 1 out of every 3 first rd picks busted, not including 2015

 

[Solar7]

Yeah, that's it!!

We are one of the oldest clubs in the league, and only sniffed the Lombardi ONCE!

*Were one of the oldest teams.

We haven't lost more than 8 games in five years. Are you forgetting how bad this franchise was? If it weren't for being in the same division as Super Bowl contending clubs, and losing our QB at the worst possible time in 2014, this team would have done more than "sniff" the Lombardi.

 

[Solar7]

2017 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 13 Haason Reddick LB Temple
2 36 Budda Baker SAF Washington-
3 98 Chad Williams WR Grambling State

2016 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 29 Robert Nkemdiche DT Mississippi
3 92 Brandon Williams CB Texas A&M

2015 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 24 D.J. Humphries T Florida
2 58 Markus Golden DE Missouri
3 86 David Johnson RB Northern Iowa


2014 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 27 Deone Bucannon SS Washington State
2 52 Troy Niklas TE Notre Dame
3 84 Kareem Martin DE North Carolina


2013 - ARIZONA CARDINALS
RD SEL # PLAYER POSITION SCHOOL
1 7 Jonathan Cooper OG North Carolina
2 45 Kevin Minter LB LSU
3 69 Tyrann Mathieu FS LS


Ok Out of this 14 first 3 rd picks, how many would you say hit and lets compare to the avg.

2015 seems to be the outlier, if you throw that out, 1 out of every 3 first rd picks busted, not including 2015

Man, it's a good thing the OP literally provided a quote with the average!

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

Out of 14 players, I count 4 starters/key contributors (and I went ahead and didn't count DJ Humphries, to help make your argument), and 2 All-Pros. 6/14, a little under half. Just a little bit better than average, with two bonafide hits.

 

[GimmedaBall]

Yeah, that's it!!

We are one of the oldest clubs in the league, and only sniffed the Lombardi ONCE!

I posted the thread in regards to SK's tenure as GM and his draft picks. We can't hold SK to account for the long history
of failure prior to his taking charge of the draft.

If you look back on the many years that the original MR. B was the defacto GM, you have a point to make.

 

[GimmedaBall]

Interesting charts that plots the pick # vs. % success:

https://datascopeanalytics.com/blog/the-chance-of-a-bust-in-the-nfl-draft/

Falcons did a study and concluded that only 56% of first round picks have success in the league.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...round-of-the-draft-remains-a-total-crapshoot/

 

[DevonCardsFan]

Man, it's a good thing the OP literally provided a quote with the average!

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

Out of 14 players, I count 4 starters/key contributors (and I went ahead and didn't count DJ Humphries, to help make your argument), and 2 All-Pros. 6/14, a little under half. Just a little bit better than average, with two bonafide hits.

Man, it's a good thing the OP literally provided a quote with the average!

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

Out of 14 players, I count 4 starters/key contributors (and I went ahead and didn't count DJ Humphries, to help make your argument), and 2 All-Pros. 6/14, a little under half. Just a little bit better than average, with two bonafide hits.

Man, it's a good thing the OP literally provided a quote with the average!

" . . . a little over 2 out of every 3 players drafted are a bust - with over half (53%) of all draft picks adding no value to the team that drafted them- and 9 out of 10 have basically undistinguished careers in the NFL."

Out of 14 players, I count 4 starters/key contributors (and I went ahead and didn't count DJ Humphries, to help make your argument), and 2 All-Pros. 6/14, a little under half. Just a little bit better than average, with two bonafide hits.

1 year was a outlier, with 3. Every other year was 1 of 3, if there was 1. 1 year was a fluke other years are horrible. 33pct every year but 1.