Butler Denied Permission, Horton Expected to be Next DC

[schutd]

I'm not saying that Horton is a 3. I'm just extending Joe's metaphor a little. When you hold out for a 10 and all the 7+'s leave, you're left with the same or worse than what you started with.

I think that Horton is a 6. I don't agree that he was being considered for any number of DC positions. I think that Greg Manusky was clearly the best person for this job by no small measure. Experienced at the job, designed good defenses, worked with similar talent as what we have.

I didn't think that Wade Phillips was going to be a candidate for this job, but he clearly would've been better than Horton, and maybe better than Manusky.

Todd Bolwes, Keith Butler, Winston Moss, etc. are all fine guys, and may or may not be better than Horton. But there's certainly egg on the team's face for floating Keith Butler rumors (the media just doesn't manufacture these things) for two months and then fail to get him.

Yer manufacturing egg, dude.

 

[Southpaw]

Fug the Steelers and their serial rapist QB.

I can't even begin to understand this board's love affair with the Steelers.

 

[kerouac9]

Hired Haley from the Cowboys, who went on to become a head coach, something no one from the Cowher era has done, other than Whiz

Mike Mularkey was a former Cowher assistant who was head coach of the Bills. LeBeau went from Pittsburgh to Cinch and came back with his tail between his legs. I think there is one other Pitt OC who became a HC, but I'm having a hard time remembering his name...

 

[Zeno]

Mike Mularkey was a former Cowher assistant who was head coach of the Bills. LeBeau went from Pittsburgh to Cinch and came back with his tail between his legs. I think there is one other Pitt OC who became a HC, but I'm having a hard time remembering his name...

Chan Gailey

 

[Shzm13]

Mike Mularkey was a former Cowher assistant who was head coach of the Bills. LeBeau went from Pittsburgh to Cinch and came back with his tail between his legs. I think there is one other Pitt OC who became a HC, but I'm having a hard time remembering his name...

Guess I should've specified *good* head coaches.

 

[TJ]

I didn't think that Wade Phillips was going to be a candidate for this job, but he clearly would've been better than Horton, and maybe better than Manusky.

Two things that would have been wrong with a Wade Phillips hire:

1. He is 63 years old. Not every coordinator is Dick LeBeau and can coach forever.

2. He does not have the ideal personality, IMO, that this team needs. Phillips seemed to have lost his swagger in the last two seasons at Dallas. The team played lifeless, players began to turn their backs on him and he was constantly getting owned by the Dallas media during press conferences.

From what Ive heard about Horton is he has a grasp on the 3-4 scheme and is a breath of fresh air and a great motivator of men. We need a guy like that to put players on notice, like DRC who tends to lose focus very easily.

Todd Bolwes, Keith Butler, Winston Moss, etc. are all fine guys, and may or may not be better than Horton. But there's certainly egg on the team's face for floating Keith Butler rumors (the media just doesn't manufacture these things) for two months and then fail to get him.

There is egg on nobody's face. Butler was far from a sure thing given the fact he was essentially tagged the DC in waiting for Pittsburgh and it would had to have given us permission to talk with Butler. As you noted yourself, there were other candidates for the job other than Butler. Sounds like most coaching searches where there is a list of candidates with a hierarchy of preference.

 

[wa52lz]

Chan Gailey

Jim Haslett, Marvin Lewis and Dom Capers, as well, where coaches under Cowher who went on to be HC's

 

[Southpaw]

Jim Haslett, Marvin Lewis and Dom Capers, as well, where coaches under Cowher who went on to be HC's

and all were bad to mediocre.

 

[D-Dogg]

His weaknesses are even on his Wikipedia page (You would think he would go in and change some of the quotes on his page, but, as we all know, Billy Davis is incapable of making adjustments).

:jumping_smilie:

That. Was. AWESOME!!!

 

[Rats]

I guess the question I ask myself is why did Whiz not bring Horton in after Clancy got canned? He obviously wanted Butler then and asked for permission to get him. If Horton is so qualified now he should have been just as qualified then after so many years in the Pitt system. Sure he was under contract as a DB coach but would have been allowed to interview for an upgrade to DC. They couldn't make all there coaches DC in waiting. Whiz wanted to install the Lebeau defense all along and now we would be years into doing just that had he brought Horton in after Clancy was canned.
Just seems like a scramble at the end when they couldn't get the guy they wanted and now we will install the Defense with someone that was not there first or second choice.
It will all come down to the players making the adjustment to playing the zone blitzing scheme anyway . We may be sevral years away from being a top D...we would be closer had this move been made after Clancy was canned.

 

[bankybruce]

I guess the question I ask myself is why did Whiz not bring Horton in after Clancy got canned? He obviously wanted Butler then and asked for permission to get him. If Horton is so qualified now he should have been just as qualified then after so many years in the Pitt system. Sure he was under contract as a DB coach but would have been allowed to interview for an upgrade to DC. They couldn't make all there coaches DC in waiting. Whiz wanted to install the Lebeau defense all along and now we would be years into doing just that had he brought Horton in after Clancy was canned.
Just seems like a scramble at the end when they couldn't get the guy they wanted and now we will install the Defense with someone that was not there first or second choice.
It will all come down to the players making the adjustment to playing the zone blitzing scheme anyway . We may be sevral years away from being a top D...we would be closer had this move been made after Clancy was canned.

OK, this is getting ridiculous. You are totally reaching now. John Clayton mentioned that he thought Horton was a top 3 choice for Whiz the day Davis was fired. Please stop this insanity.

 

[Duckjake]

and all were bad to mediocre.

Wasn't Lewis named Coach of the Year in 2009 and Haslett in 2000? Shows how hard it is to stay on top in the NFL if you aren't NE,Indy, or Pittsburgh.

Of course about 70% of NFL coaches have been bad to mediocre as only 10 of the 32 head coaches last season had won 60% of their games as HC and that includes Garrett in Dallas who only has 8 games and the guy in Indy where they don't need a HC to win as long as they have Manning.

 

[Shane]

I guess the question I ask myself is why did Whiz not bring Horton in after Clancy got canned? He obviously wanted Butler then and asked for permission to get him. If Horton is so qualified now he should have been just as qualified then after so many years in the Pitt system. Sure he was under contract as a DB coach but would have been allowed to interview for an upgrade to DC. They couldn't make all there coaches DC in waiting. Whiz wanted to install the Lebeau defense all along and now we would be years into doing just that had he brought Horton in after Clancy was canned.
Just seems like a scramble at the end when they couldn't get the guy they wanted and now we will install the Defense with someone that was not there first or second choice.
It will all come down to the players making the adjustment to playing the zone blitzing scheme anyway . We may be sevral years away from being a top D...we would be closer had this move been made after Clancy was canned.

So in short what your saying is that you were just looking for a reason to bash the pick? With nothing real or substantial to back said bashing. Got it.

 

[Stout]

and all were bad to mediocre.

I think Green Bay disagrees about Capers

 

[Southpaw]

I think Green Bay disagrees about Capers

as head coaches.

 

[Rats]

OK, this is getting ridiculous. You are totally reaching now. John Clayton mentioned that he thought Horton was a top 3 choice for Whiz the day Davis was fired. Please stop this insanity.[/QUOTE

How is it a reach that Horton could have been our DC after Clancy got canned? He should have been a top guy then as well if he is a top guy now. There is nothing ridiculous about that.

 

[Rats]

So in short what your saying is that you were just looking for a reason to bash the pick? With nothing real or substantial to back said bashing. Got it.

I am not. I asked a legit question. Why was Horton not picked after Clancy got canned and Butler was not hired? Answer that.

 

[bankybruce]

OK, this is getting ridiculous. You are totally reaching now. John Clayton mentioned that he thought Horton was a top 3 choice for Whiz the day Davis was fired. Please stop this insanity.

How is it a reach that Horton could have been our DC after Clancy got canned? He should have been a top guy then as well if he is a top guy now. There is nothing ridiculous about that.

Sure, I'll play along. Prove he was not. Maybe we asked and where denied. No way to know. He could have been our first choice then. Speculation is worthless.

 

[Linderbee]

I am not. I asked a legit question. Why was Horton not picked after Clancy got canned and Butler was not hired? Answer that.

I thought Horton was still under contract then, but is not now.

 

[Rats]

Sure, I'll play along. Prove he was not. Maybe we asked and where denied. No way to know. He could have been our first choice then. Speculation is worthless.

Now who is reaching. If a Db coach is asked to interview for a DC position he usually gets it. I think Horton would be a pretty pissed off coach if he was not allowed to interview for a better job and was not promised a DC in waiting position like Butler was. Whatever, he will be just as good as any other to bring the Pitt system here just not sure he was anyones top choice. He certainly wasn't around here until everyone went in to damage control mode when Butler was not available and all the other top choices had already been picked. You may have mentioned him a month ago but no way he was your top choice to be our DC. Get real.

 

[Rats]

I thought Horton was still under contract then, but is not now.

In most cases Linderbee even when under contract if the position is an upgrade to something like DC they are allowed to seek the position. He was under contract but as a Db coach.

 

[bankybruce]

I thought Horton was still under contract then, but is not now.

Logic does not work in this thread.

 

[bankybruce]

In most cases Linderbee even when under contract if the position is an upgrade to something like DC they are allowed to seek the position. He was under contract but as a Db coach.

Kind of like Butler as a LB coach?

 

[bankybruce]

Now who is reaching. If a Db coach is asked to interview for a DC position he usually gets it. I think Horton would be a pretty pissed off coach if he was not allowed to interview for a better job and was not promised a DC in waiting position like Butler was. Whatever, he will be just as good as any other to bring the Pitt system here just not sure he was anyones top choice. He certainly wasn't around here until everyone went in to damage control mode when Butler was not available and all the other top choices had already been picked. You may have mentioned him a month ago but no way he was your top choice to be our DC. Get real.

Again, you are speculating as I admitted to doing so just to play along with your charade.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Shouldn't it be clear at this point? The Steelers organization (maybe not the players, maybe not the coaching staff) did not like Whis OR Grimm. Both got interviews with the front office, and the front office hired someone from outside the organization. Since then, Coach Whisenhunt has done nothing by try and poach their staff. I'm sure that the Steelers' front office is sitting there letting Horton leave and laughing at Whis.

Maybe Horton is a quality assistant waiting to break out like Haley was. Maybe Mike Miller was someone that the Steelers hated to see leave and will turn around the league-second-worst offense that he helped spearhead this season. But the Cards did a wretched job managing expectations this offseason WRT the defensive coordinator search.

c'mon k9, if that organization truly "did not like" them neither of them would have been interviewed for the HC vacancy before tomlin was hired. they didn't need to do it for PR purposes. that comment is just silly, and in my opinion WHOLELY misguided, speculation.