Cardinals need to trade out of #7 overall pick

[MadCardDisease]

Clearly the Cardinals have a ton of needs and with the coaching staff change, they will want to put their stamp on this team. The best way to do that is by stockpiling picks in the first 3 rounds. I think this is a very deep draft. So the more picks the better IMO.

Look what Seattle and St Louis did last year. I'd love to see the Cardinals do something similar. I think they need at least 5 picks in the first 3 rounds.

I think it's time to see how well Keim can manipulate the draft. This is where Keim can earn his money and prove he deserved the job. Graves was terrible at moving around and often got fleeced. Will it be the same with Keim? Let hope he has more success!

Teams are always looking to move up. Perhaps we can trade with Miami (may be in need of a starting OT) throw in our 5th rounder and land their extra 2nd round pick (#54 overall). Then we could trade again with someone like Dallas (#18 overall) and land their 3rd rounder (#80 overall) and thier 7th rounder.

That would put us at #18 overall and have two 2nd rounders and two 3rd rounders for at total of 5 picks in the first three rounds.


1st round* (#18) *From Cowboys
2nd round (#38)
2nd round* (#54) *From Miami
3rd round (#69)
3rd round* (#80)*From Cowboys

I'm guessing we would target a QB with the #18 overall pick. Then in the second and third rounds go after OL and DL and RB.

 

[cardinalsfan]

I don't agree. Teams are always looking for ways to trade down. Every year we talk about how many needs we have, but that's true with every team. Why would we pass on a top offensive line guy? We have to eventually address some of our O line problems with a high draft pick. Also, with this years draft class there doesn't appear to be a franchise savior for anyone to trade up for. We wouldn't be getting much in compensation.

 

[crisper57]

We need a willing partner. We can't pull off what the Rams did last year, because no one is going to trade with us for the #7 spot leading up to the draft, so that means we will be looking for another team to swap during our time on the board.

We can say that we want to move back, but realistically, it is very unlikely to happen.

 

[GuernseyCard]

"Need" is hardly a good bargaining chip.

If someone shows up and offers a deal you can't refuse, fine... but, I doubt it.

I don't favour giving up a blue chip prospect at the top of the draft, but, I'm all for moving up and down in the later rounds in search of a gem.

 

[BigRedRage]

no, we need to take the best guy at #7 and hopefully Warmack is still there. If not, maybe trade down.

 

[JeffGollin]

If our BPA board at #7 still had, say, 4 guys we really liked on it, we could trade down as low as #10 and still get one of those four guys.

Or for example, let's say our BPA Board graded the Top 4 players close together as "blue-chippers" followed by 12 players closely graded as "red chip" players. If one or more blue-chippers were still on our board at #7, we should take him. If all four blue-chippers and three red-chippers were gone (& we felt this group represented good value, we could afford to trade down 8 or 9 picks and still get one of these.

Or if we didn't feel anyone still left on our Board represented good enough value, we could trade down farther.

This early in the process, there are 5 OL's I wouldn't pass on (Joeckel, Fisher, L Johnson, Warmack and Schwenke). Add to this a couple of corners (Trufant and Poyer) a couple of DT's (Jenkins, Lotoleilei) and at least a few edge rushers (Worner, D Jones, J Jones, Mingo) and ILB's likeTe'o and we're up to at least 14 guys we might be happy with as our top pick. This would give us a little bit of trade-down wriggle room.

A key question has to be: Which of these 14 or more players do we rate as true blue-chippers too good to pass up at 7 (the top 3 tackles? Warmack)?

Then, of course, we'd have to find another team who wants to tango.

All said, though, this could very well be the right year to trade down (just so long as we don't trade ourselves out drafting a high-quality player (like we did the year we passed up Suggs, M Trufant, Kevin Williams and others to draft Johnson and Pace).

 

[Solar7]

Yeah, unless we're being offered a bounty, I don't like moving back. Top 10 talent has a chance to be completely elite. I'd rather have Warmack or a QB at the 7 spot than gamble that someone great is going to drop.

Maybe I've got some kind of complex thanks to Calvin Pace and Bryant Johnson though. I've always hated trading back.

 

[Chopper0080]

Our best option is to convince the Chargers that someone is interested in moving up for Eric Fisher, and then make a deal with the Chargers so they can ensure they get him. The same could be said for Miami and Keenan Allen, but I think they have too many needs to give up valuable picks. A sleeper team may be the Bucs. They really need to upgrade their pass defense (pass rush and secondary) and they might be willing to move and grab Demontre Moore or Werner if they are still available at #7. Same could be said for Carolina if Lotulelei is available when the Cards pick.

 

[MadCardDisease]

We need a willing partner. We can't pull off what the Rams did last year, because no one is going to trade with us for the #7 spot leading up to the draft, so that means we will be looking for another team to swap during our time on the board.

We can say that we want to move back, but realistically, it is very unlikely to happen.

I'm talking about what Seattle did the day of the draft. That is when teams start to panic that they guy they fell in love with will be snatched up before they pick. I'm not suggesting that we trade the pick before the draft. That would be impossible with the # 7 overall pick.

 

[jw7]

So you pass on Terrell Suggs to get Bryant Johnson and Calvin Pace. Yeah, that worked out well.

 

[MadCardDisease]

So you pass on Terrell Suggs to get Bryant Johnson and Calvin Pace. Yeah, that worked out well.

You are living in the past. Graves is GONE. We won't panic this time around.

 

[Vermont Maverick]

If our BPA board at #7 still had, say, 4 guys we really liked on it, we could trade down as low as #10 and still get one of those four guys.

Or for example, let's say our BPA Board graded the Top 4 players close together as "blue-chippers" followed by 12 players closely graded as "red chip" players. If one or more blue-chippers were still on our board at #7, we should take him. If all four blue-chippers and three red-chippers were gone (& we felt this group represented good value, we could afford to trade down 8 or 9 picks and still get one of these.

Or if we didn't feel anyone still left on our Board represented good enough value, we could trade down farther.

This early in the process, there are 5 OL's I wouldn't pass on (Joeckel, Fisher, L Johnson, Warmack and Schwenke). Add to this a couple of corners (Trufant and Poyer) a couple of DT's (Jenkins, Lotoleilei) and at least a few edge rushers (Worner, D Jones, Mingo) and ILB's likeTe'o and Jarvis Jones and we're up to at least 14 guys we might be happy with as our top pick. This would give us a little bit of trade-down wriggle room.

A key question has to be: Which of these 14 or more players do we rate as true blue-chippers too good to pass up at 7 (the top 3 tackles? Warmack)?

Then, of course, we'd have to find another team who wants to tango.

All said, though, this could very well be the right year to trade down (just so long as we don't trade ourselves out drafting a high-quality player (like we did the year we passed up Suggs, M Trufant, Kevin Williams and others to draft Johnson and Pace).

Good post, Jeff. I agree. Just one note- Jarvis Jones is a 3-4 OLB.

 

[ARZCardinals]

We traded T. Suggs to move down....look how that ended up.

If a quality player is there...you take him

It's a solid pick + a cap friendly contract.

you don't just move to move.

Unless you want Bryant Johnson and Calvin Johnson over T. Suggs again.

 

[Chopper0080]

We traded T. Suggs to move down....look how that ended up.

If a quality player is there...you take him

It's a solid pick + a cap friendly contract.

you don't just move to move.

Unless you want Bryant Johnson and Calvin Johnson over T. Suggs again.

You shouldn't let the past effect your decisions in the future. If the Cardinals decide to trade back I hope they do so with the thought that there are several players they are still interested in rather than banking on one or two players being available like they did then.

 

[JeffGollin]

Good post, Jeff. I agree. Just one note- Jarvis Jones is a 3-4 OLB.

Thanx. I edited my original post.

 

[MadCardDisease]

If you make some of the moves like I mention, you can fill several holes.

Round 1 (#18): QB? Whoever Arians thinks he can work with (Mike Glennon, Geno Smith, Tyler Wilson...)

Round 2 (#38): DE (Someone like Ezekiel Ansah or Alex Okafor)

Round 2 (#54): OL (Someone like Jordan Mills)

Round 3 (#69): RB (Someone like Stepfan Taylor)

Round 3 (#80): TE (Someone like Vance McDonald)

Now these are obviously just examples. You don't have to pick a DE in round 2 if there is someone better at OL that falls to you. However I think it gives the Cardinals a ton more flexibility. Of course this all assumes you have faith in your scouting department.

 

[JeffGollin]

You shouldn't let the past effect your decisions in the future. If the Cardinals decide to trade back I hope they do so with the thought that there are several players they are still interested in rather than banking on one or two players being available like they did then.

A frequently overlooked aspect of that draft fiasco was that we had our eyes set on a pass rusher (McDougal) at #18 or #19, but another team (the Eagles?) got wind of it and traded up one spot above us to grab him. (The irony was that McDougal didn't turn out to be that good anyway).

 

[crisper57]

I'm talking about what Seattle did the day of the draft. That is when teams start to panic that they guy they fell in love with will be snatched up before they pick. I'm not suggesting that we trade the pick before the draft. That would be impossible with the # 7 overall pick.

You mentioned STL in your OP, so that was all I was responding to.

 

[earthsci]

(The irony was that McDougal didn't turn out to be that good anyway).

Neither did the guy that we would have drafted if we had stayed at #6 (not Terrell Suggs).

 

[WildBB]

Posted this last night and nobody responded, so I'll add it with your thread.

You do need a willing partner and Miami has a slew of picks avail.

Thing is we should have better pix to get back into the end of the 1st Rd. if one of our QB targets makes it there.

If we trade down
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Miami would be the logical target at #12.

Look at how many draft pix they have this yr. If we could get #12 along with either #42 or #'s 56 and 77, that would set us up very nicely in this draft.

How about Warmack , Fisher or Cooper @ 12

Here's a look at one writers mock for them.


« 2013 Shrine Game Tuesday Notes: Standout Potential Dolphins
2013 Senior Bowl Offensive Preview: Potential Dolphins to Track This Week »
2013 NFL Mock Draft: Dolphins 7-Round Mock
January 17th, 2013

Draft season has officially gotten underway, with the last underclassmen making their decisions about whether or not to enter the draft. Players will start preparing for the pre-draft routine; the Senior Bowl, Pro Days, and the Scouting Combine.

There are a number of holes that Miami needs to address this off season. Although it’s still early, this is a brief look into one particular direction that the Dolphins may go. With this mock draft, I had in mind that Jake Long would not be re-signed, and that the Dolphins will have signed one of Dwayne Bowe, Mike Wallace, or Greg Jennings.

MDD Staff Writer: Garrett Baker

1st Round (12th overall)-Dion Jordan, DE, Oregon

Jared Odrick isn’t the answer at defensive end, especially not in Miami’s 4-3 scheme. Olivier Vernon showed some potential, but as more of a situational guy, and also more as an outside linebacker than an end. Jordan is arguably the most versatile defensive prospect in this draft, standing at roughly 6’7″ but possessing the athleticism and quickness to line up anywhere on the field. Oregon sometimes played him in coverage against the slot receiver, and he also played some time at linebacker. His versatility would give Miami that edge which it so desperately needs.

2nd Round (42nd overall)-Zach Ertz, TE, Stanford

Here’s where Miami gets some help for Ryan Tannehill. Ertz is a big body with soft hands and a lot of experience, which means he should be able to contribute right away. He isn’t on the level of Notre Dame’s Tyler Eifert, but there’s little chance that Eifert is still here at this slot. Ertz would bring a whole new dynamic to Miami’s offense.

2nd Round (56th overall)-D.J. Fluker, OT, Alabama

Fluker has been phenomenal for Alabama, who had arguably the best offensive line in the country this year. He would come in and compete with Jonathan Martin, as both tackles would be able to play either the right or left side, which would be a great problem for Miami to have.

3rd Round (77th overall)-Stedman Bailey, WR, West Virginia

Even if Miami signs a big free agent receiver, they could still use some depth at the position. Bailey is an under appreciated talent from West Virginia who doesn’t stand out in any way except for his production. He isn’t overly big or fast, but uses great body control, deception, and reliable hands to get open and pull in passes.

3rd Round (82nd overall)-Desmond Trufant, CB, Washington

Even with Richard Marshall healthy, Miami’s cornerback corps needs help. Trufant isn’t a dynamic, shut down talent, but he has the upside to be a very good No. 2 corner who could push Sean Smith for the top spot

 

[ARZCardinals]

any mock that doesn't have the Cards drafting 2-3 o lineman in the first 4 rounds is garbage.

the entire focus this draft will be o line

 

[MadCardDisease]

You mentioned STL in your OP, so that was all I was responding to.

Yeah that's my bad. I include STL in there as an example of picking up extra picks. However I didn't mean to suggest that we trade our pick before the draft which I agree would be pretty much impossible. Sorry for the confusion.

 

[MadCardDisease]

any mock that doesn't have the Cards drafting 2-3 o lineman in the first 4 rounds is garbage.

the entire focus this draft will be o line

Not neccessarily. We obviously need to take at least one OL early on in the draft. However we probalby need to land a QB, DE, and RB early as well. We have so many needs and very little cap space. Hence why I think it is prudent to stock pile early round picks.

 

[kerouac9]

Our best option is to convince the Chargers that someone is interested in moving up for Eric Fisher, and then make a deal with the Chargers so they can ensure they get him. The same could be said for Miami and Keenan Allen, but I think they have too many needs to give up valuable picks. A sleeper team may be the Bucs. They really need to upgrade their pass defense (pass rush and secondary) and they might be willing to move and grab Demontre Moore or Werner if they are still available at #7. Same could be said for Carolina if Lotulelei is available when the Cards pick.

The Huddle Report has Lotulelei available to the Cards at #7. If that's the case, there might be many oppotunities to trade down, unless teams believe that he's no so much Marcel Dareus as he is Alan Branch.

any mock that doesn't have the Cards drafting 2-3 o lineman in the first 4 rounds is garbage.

the entire focus this draft will be o line

I disagree with this. The Cards have 3 young, (relatively) cheap players that they know can play--Levi Brown, Nate Potter, and Bobby Massie. The Cards have one developmental player that the scouting staff seemed to like: Senio Kelemete. They also have two veteran guards who are impossible to cut ties with for salary cap reasons: Daryn Colledge and Adam Snyder. They also have a team captain center that could be upgraded, but would be difficult to get rid of.

That's six of eight likely active-roster positions that are not set in stone but at least pretty likely to be guys we're running with in 2013. There's really not room to draft more than one lineman early, and maybe another one late who can be slipped onto the practice squad.

As for the OP, I don't think the Cards "need" to trade down, and I don't know if they'd like to. If you can pick up picks in 2014, I think that's something that you have to look into. In all possibility, the Cards are stuck with Kevin Kolb as the starter in 2013, because of his contract and because it's possible Michael and Keim still believe in him for some strange reason. If that's the case, getting 2nd and 3rd round picks in 2014 would be great to allow us to move up and get a quarterback once we can finally jettison Kevin Kolb.

I don't think that there are good enough players in this draft to want to load up on picks this year. Doesn't seem to be a great crop.

 

[DoTheDew]

We need to not pigeon hole ourselves. Let the draft play out and see whats there at 7. If we like what's slid to us, stay put. If not, trade down a bit.