Cards sign 3, and release two.

[duckfallas]

I think he is sold on JJ because he is one of his guys. This tells me he's not sold on Hambrick, Scobey, and Anderson.

 

[joeshmo]

Fact is, maybe Denny, after mini camps , isnt sold on Arrington as much as we would like.....

Then that would go against everything that has been reported about the mini camps.

The signings have everything to do with Croom, Scobey, Anderson, Robinson, and Hambrick being on the roster. And what Jeff stated.

 

[Diamondback Jay]

Anyone remember when James Jackson, after being drafted, declared himself "The Greatest RB in Cleveland Brown history"



Eh well.. Solid pickups none the less.

 

[kerouac9]

Hmmmm, did we forget that Shipp didn't play at all last year and the year before that, every time we got anywhere close to the goal line they gave the ball to Emmitt Smith?

Yeah, I'm sure the fact that Marcel Shipp hasn't scored a TD in 30+ months, had a 3.5 YPC average the last time he toted the ball, and is coming off an absolutely horrific injury has nothing to do with the fact that Dennis Green brought in a bunch of guys from the waiver wire that play his position.

 

[40yearfan]

Yeah, I'm sure the fact that Marcel Shipp hasn't scored a TD in 30+ months, had a 3.5 YPC average the last time he toted the ball, and is coming off an absolutely horrific injury has nothing to do with the fact that Dennis Green brought in a bunch of guys from the waiver wire that play his position.

So you are still of the opinion that either of those running backs could replace Shipp "like that"?

Anything to back that up other than just pure doubletalk?

BTW, those guys also play JJ's position. I guess they can replace him just "like that" also. And if you would bother to read the rest of the thread, you are in the extreme minority. Open mouth, insert foot.

 

[CardLogic]

Bottom line: Cardinals are looking to improve the depth of the team.

• Eric Johnson is better/more experinced than Leon Joe; plus Green doesn't like crap like Joe got into in D.C.
• Slew of mediocre RB's for camp as has been mentioned; also whichever "survives" the competition will strengthen the team.

Being Cardinals fans we aren't familiar with this process, but it is what successful teams do. When there is an opportunity to improve the team, successful teams take it! Always, always, always looking for ways (personnel) to strengthen, improve the depth of the team.

 

[kerouac9]

So you are still of the opinion that either of those running backs could replace Shipp "like that"?

Anything to back that up other than just pure doubletalk?

BTW, those guys also play JJ's position. I guess they can replace him just "like that" also. And if you would bother to read the rest of the thread, you are in the extreme minority. Open mouth, insert foot.

Doubletalk? Huh? I'm just stating the facts. The fact that Marcel hasn't played football in over a year doesn't count in his favor; it's a negative.

Hoestly, I don't think that Redmond or Jackson could have presented a challenge to the 2004 Marcel Shipp, or even the one that ended the 2003 season without a touchdown. But this one, who hasn't scored a TD in two years, who has a coach that has no confidence in him or loyalty toward him, and at the salary he's carrying? Yeah, I think that it'd be all too easy for Hambrick to take his job, and not much harder for Redmond or Jackson to do the same.

And I'm not alone in this. Jack Kemp was saying much the same thing yesterday at about 5:45 when he mentioned the signings.

J.J. Arrington is going to start the season. He's Denny's draft choice, and Denny love nothing more than to start his rookies (or his FAs--which is why the other corner isn't going to start, but why Jeremy Bridges should be looking over his shoulder). J.J. Arrington also presents a special skill set of speed and moves that none of the other candidates--including Marcel Shipp--represent.

The only skill set that Shipp presents is the marginal ability to carry the ball 10-12 times a game and cash huge paychecks while failing to score TDs. And getting injured. I think that James Jackson could do that just as well as Shipp could.

 

[40yearfan]

Doubletalk? Huh? I'm just stating the facts. The fact that Marcel hasn't played football in over a year doesn't count in his favor; it's a negative.

Hoestly, I don't think that Redmond or Jackson could have presented a challenge to the 2004 Marcel Shipp, or even the one that ended the 2003 season without a touchdown. But this one, who hasn't scored a TD in two years, who has a coach that has no confidence in him or loyalty toward him, and at the salary he's carrying? Yeah, I think that it'd be all too easy for Hambrick to take his job, and not much harder for Redmond or Jackson to do the same.

And I'm not alone in this. Jack Kemp was saying much the same thing yesterday at about 5:45 when he mentioned the signings.

J.J. Arrington is going to start the season. He's Denny's draft choice, and Denny love nothing more than to start his rookies (or his FAs--which is why the other corner isn't going to start, but why Jeremy Bridges should be looking over his shoulder). J.J. Arrington also presents a special skill set of speed and moves that none of the other candidates--including Marcel Shipp--represent.

The only skill set that Shipp presents is the marginal ability to carry the ball 10-12 times a game and cash huge paychecks while failing to score TDs. And getting injured. I think that James Jackson could do that just as well as Shipp could.

So the fact that Shipp is a proven commodity as illustrated by his 3 years with the Cards means nothing and these two guys with 10 years experience between them and not having as good of stats together are gonna run Shipp off. Keep dreaming. Shipp might not be the best RB to ever hit this team, but he's certainly better than either of those two.

And about Shipp's pay----the Cards aren't in cap hell remember? They can afford him and won't throw him out because he makes more dollars. Green will keep the people who best suite his team and are willing to work with-in his system and money be damned.

If James Jackson could do as well as Shipp, why isn't he still with his old team? You seem to think RB is an easy position to play. If that's the case, why not just keep Anderson or Croom. They're cheap and if Jackson can handle it so easily, they certainly should be able to.

Sometimes throwing out a flippant remark without thought comes back to haunt you. Think about that.

 

[kerouac9]

So the fact that Shipp is a proven commodity as illustrated by his 3 years with the Cards means nothing and these two guys with 10 years experience between them and not having as good of stats together are gonna run Shipp off.

The only thing proven about Shipp is that he's a below-average running back in the NFL. Both Redmond and Jackson have been shown to be the same thing. Shipp has never shown that he's better than Hambrick. I don't doubt that post-injury Shipp could easily lose his roster spot to Hambrick, Redmond, or Jackson.

To me, Croom/Anderson/Scobey are equally camp fodder as anyone besdies J.J. Arrington, who is the only 'back on the roster besides 'Femi with any job security whatsoever.

I think that people are deluded in thinking that his injury is going to have no effect on the player #31 that shows up in Prescott on Sunday. It's going to be a different guy, and he's not going to be better.

 

[BACH]

I think that people are deluded in thinking that his injury is going to have no effect on the player #31 that shows up in Prescott on Sunday. It's going to be a different guy, and he's not going to be better.

So let me get this right...
It's okay to guess that Shipp has lost a step, but NOT okay to think that he's fully recovered (what you call hoping).

 

[40yearfan]

The only thing proven about Shipp is that he's a below-average running back in the NFL. Both Redmond and Jackson have been shown to be the same thing. Shipp has never shown that he's better than Hambrick. I don't doubt that post-injury Shipp could easily lose his roster spot to Hambrick, Redmond, or Jackson.

To me, Croom/Anderson/Scobey are equally camp fodder as anyone besdies J.J. Arrington, who is the only 'back on the roster besides 'Femi with any job security whatsoever.

I think that people are deluded in thinking that his injury is going to have no effect on the player #31 that shows up in Prescott on Sunday. It's going to be a different guy, and he's not going to be better.

My first post on this thread - post #25

I understand that you hate Shipp, but for you to say one of these guys could take his place "like that" is really out of whack. Unless Shipp has some serious problems with his injury, neither of these guys will beat him out of a job.

Hambrick might be a better running back, but he has such a chip on his shoulder, we'll probably never find out. When you say Shipp has never proved he's better than Hambrick you are right, but conversly Hambrick has never proving he's better than Shipp. We all know who has the better work ethic and more desire.

As you say, we'll find out about Shipp during this preseason. You think he'll be worse and I think he'll be better. Guess we'll find out.

 

[kerouac9]

So let me get this right...
It's okay to guess that Shipp has lost a step, but NOT okay to think that he's fully recovered (what you call hoping).

Well, I have another year of age, a year of rust, and a grisly injury on my side. . .

. . .And you have... well, hope, I guess. That's. . . something. Good for you.

 

[Assface]

Hodgins should be happy with a roster spot come September, which is all but unlikely.

Is this how you meant to phrase that because you're saying that it IS likely he'll be on the roster.

I really don't see him getting cut because if DG doesn't want him he'd already be gone like Shelton, Clement, Thompson, etc.

 

[40yearfan]

Well, I have another year of age, a year of rust, and a grisly injury on my side. . .

. . .And you have... well, hope, I guess. That's. . . something. Good for you.

Hope and Shipp's mental attitude, his work ethic and his desire to suceed. I think that makes us even.

 

[joeshmo]

Is this how you meant to phrase that because you're saying that it IS likely he'll be on the roster.

I really don't see him getting cut because if DG doesn't want him he'd already be gone like Shelton, Clement, Thompson, etc.

Agreed.

If Green really wanted him gone he would have given him an injury settlement and sent him on his way last year. Plus not to mention Hodgins was working with the first team just as much as Femi was in training camp.

 

[Redheart]

So the fact that Shipp is a proven commodity as illustrated by his 3 years with the Cards means nothing and these two guys with 10 years experience between them and not having as good of stats together are gonna run Shipp off. Keep dreaming. Shipp might not be the best RB to ever hit this team, but he's certainly better than either of those two.

And about Shipp's pay----the Cards aren't in cap hell remember? They can afford him and won't throw him out because he makes more dollars. Green will keep the people who best suite his team and are willing to work with-in his system and money be damned.

If James Jackson could do as well as Shipp, why isn't he still with his old team? You seem to think RB is an easy position to play. If that's the case, why not just keep Anderson or Croom. They're cheap and if Jackson can handle it so easily, they certainly should be able to.

Sometimes throwing out a flippant remark without thought comes back to haunt you. Think about that.

You go, 40.

Shipp has played by the Cardinals rules. This guy...man, I could go on for a while...let me hit the highlights.

2004 was his year, No Doubt About IT, before that horrid injury in Flagstaff. I was front row and he was not 20 yards in front of me...I had to look away cause I was going to hurl. 2004 did not pan out as I expected, which was for Shipp to TAKE the #1 RB spot from Emmitt. I was at the scrimmage, and from what I saw, he WAS going to take the #1 spot, right up until the injury.

Shipp came up through the Cardinals system and they have rewarded him in the past with his lucrative contract; the Cardinals Organization has put their money where their mouth is concerning Shipp because his was a TEAM player throughout the Emmit-means-$ thing. I pray Denny Green gives him the opportunity to earn the #1 spot, because I would like to be a fan of team who would INSIST that Shipp be given that shot and a Coach who wouldn't even consider otherwise.

The last time I saw him run...Shipp had "It". He was going to have a breakout year in 2004, then the injury. He has had about the same time as Q to come back from his injury and The Quan say he is hitting on all eight cyllinders.

Shipp did not arrive where he is at by luck, I believe he came into this league as an undrafted free-agent and was on the cusp of being a starting RB in the NFL. If you can't understand that kind of cinderella-story, then you don't understand what it is to be a Cardinal Fan.

I REALLY pray that Shipp is 100%, but I can't remember reading anything that says he is. But IFF he is...this Organization, the Cardinals, Denny, need to let him run.

 

[40yearfan]

Agreed.

If Green really wanted him gone he would have given him an injury settlement and sent him on his way last year. Plus not to mention Hodgins was working with the first team just as much as Femi was in training camp.

I'd love to see Hodgins in this offensive scheme as a blocking back for JJ and Shipp or maybe even playing in a two tight end scheme. With his size, he should be a valuable asset to this team.

 

[40yearfan]

You go, 40.

Shipp has played by the Cardinals rules. This guy...man, I could go on for a while...let me hit the highlights.

2004 was his year, No Doubt About IT, before that horrid injury in Flagstaff. I was front row and he was not 20 yards in front of me...I had to look away cause I was going to hurl. 2004 did not pan out as I expected, which was for Shipp to TAKE the #1 RB spot from Emmitt. I was at the scrimmage, and from what I saw, he WAS going to take the #1 spot, right up until the injury.

Shipp came up through the Cardinals system and they have rewarded him in the past with his lucrative contract; the Cardinals Organization has put their money where their mouth is concerning Shipp because his was a TEAM player throughout the Emmit-means-$ thing. I pray Denny Green gives him the opportunity to earn the #1 spot, because I would like to be a fan of team who would INSIST that Shipp be given that shot and a Coach who wouldn't even consider otherwise.

The last time I saw him run...Shipp had "It". He was going to have a breakout year in 2004, then the injury. He has had about the same time as Q to come back from his injury and The Quan say he is hitting on all eight cyllinders.

Shipp did not arrive where he is at by luck, I believe he came into this league as an undrafted free-agent and was on the cusp of being a starting RB in the NFL. If you can't understand that kind of cinderella-story, then you don't understand what it is to be a Cardinal Fan.

I REALLY pray that Shipp is 100%, but I can't remember reading anything that says he is. But IFF he is...this Organization, the Cardinals, Denny, need to let him run.

You are a true fan Redheart. Some people just don't understand loyalty and appreciation for hard work. Winning is great, but if you lose your ethics and morals to achieve that goal, it's a hollow victory.

 

[Pariah]

Winning is great, but if you lose your ethics and morals to achieve that goal, it's a hollow victory.

I'm a big fan of Shipp, too, but this is a little heavy-handed for me to swallow. If we made it to the superbowl with Hambrick and his attitude and cut Shipp with his fantastic attitude, it wouldn't seem hollow in the least to me.

Would I have loved to see coach Mac take a team to a championship? Yeah, you bet. But I won't flinch if we have to make some tough football choices that may leave nice guys behind en route to the Lombardi trophy.

I don't think Shipp is one that should or will be left behind, but if it happens it's probably because it's best for the team.

 

[40yearfan]

I'm a big fan of Shipp, too, but this is a little heavy-handed for me to swallow. If we made it to the superbowl with Hambrick and his attitude and cut Shipp with his fantastic attitude, it wouldn't seem hollow in the least to me.

Would I have loved to see coach Mac take a team to a championship? Yeah, you bet. But I won't flinch if we have to make some tough football choices that may leave nice guys behind en route to the Lombardi trophy.

I don't think Shipp is one that should or will be left behind, but if it happens it's probably because it's best for the team.

Pariah, that is my own personal philosophy. It might not be the best way to run a football team, but it certainly suceeds in business.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm a big fan of Shipp, too, but this is a little heavy-handed for me to swallow. If we made it to the superbowl with Hambrick and his attitude and cut Shipp with his fantastic attitude, it wouldn't seem hollow in the least to me.

Would I have loved to see coach Mac take a team to a championship? Yeah, you bet. But I won't flinch if we have to make some tough football choices that may leave nice guys behind en route to the Lombardi trophy.

I don't think Shipp is one that should or will be left behind, but if it happens it's probably because it's best for the team.

This is what I'm saying. Leaving Shipp and his no TDs/high $ contract behind would be a good football decision, and good football decisions are what earn better than 5-11 seasons.

The "Mac Way" just doesn't succeed in football. No one has made it happen. There are good, talented guys like Fredy Bruschi out there, but not enough to fill a 45-man roster for 16 weeks. You can only hope that you get good players who are also positive influences.

What Cardinal fans have settled on for far too long are positive influences that are mediocre players, like Ronald McKinnon, Kyle Vanden Bosch, and Marcel Shipp. None of the young guys listen to these guys, because they suck. How are you going to take advice from guys who have never won anything?

 

[Pariah]

This is what I'm saying. Leaving Shipp and his no TDs/high $ contract behind would be a good football decision,

That's where we disagree.

 

[kerouac9]

Hope and Shipp's mental attitude, his work ethic and his desire to suceed. I think that makes us even.

All that and a medical procedure will pin up that ankle that he shattered last August.

There are plenty of guys with mental attitude, work ethic, and desire to succeed sitting by their phones waiting for NFL teams to ask them to camp. Larry Centers comes to mind.

Shipp was just barely NFL material before he was injured. Nick Goings showed that you don't have to be that good to put up Marcel Shipp '03 numbers in the NFL.

 

[BACH]

Well, I have another year of age, a year of rust, and a grisly injury on my side. . .

. . .And you have... well, hope, I guess. That's. . . something. Good for you.

And exactly in what way does that differ from hoping Jackson and Redmond will be good pick-ups for us when their previous teams didn't think they were worth a roster spot??

 

[kerouac9]

And exactly in what way does that differ from hoping Jackson and Redmond will be good pick-ups for us when their previous teams didn't think they were worth a roster spot??

I'm not really "hoping they'll be good pick-ups". I think that Redmond kind of got caught in a numbers game when they signed Jordan and Justin Fargas recovered from injury. I think that Jackson over-estimated his value to the Browns, and then they traded for Reuben Droughns.

I merely think that they're about equal to post-injury, even-slower Marcel Shipp, and that the big difference in their salaries could be a deciding factor. I'd also guess that both Jackson and Redmond are far better in blitz protection than Shipp ever was, which could be the clincher once it gets down to brass tacks.