Chriss and Knight traded

[JCSunsfan]

My only real problem with this deal actually has nothing to do with the deal itself. It's that EVERYONE is already assuming that Ryan Anderson will be our starting Power Forward. I'm sorry, I just don't see how that helps us, either in wins or in youth development. Ariza? Fine. Booker? Of course. But the starting lineup doesn't need Ryan Anderson, a no-defense big that couldn't get minutes in the playoffs for a Mike D'Antoni coached team. Ryno and TJ off the bench? Ok, I like that, but I'd rather have a player like Bender starting at PF so that you at least have someone that has a better chance at defensively covering up for Ayton's mistakes down low. And that is assuming Ariza starts at SF.

But ideally, Ariza starts at PF with JJ at SF and we go that route. That gives dynamic scoring across the board and decent to strong defense amongst 2 positions, and maybe 3 if - gulp - Shaq Harrison starts at PG.

And technically, you could run that lineup for only 8-10 minutes a night and all other lineups will be dictated by who has the hot hand.

I certainly don't think that. Ariza is our starting pf in my mind.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I will be interested in getting a good look at Melton.

 

[Raindog]

This is a good trade on 2k19. Two 73 rated players for a 76.

Oh, well that settles it then.

 

[Chaplin]

I am going to bet that Bender, Jackson, Warren, and Anderson all will be playing for that starting role in preseason.

It's a pencil in for now

I actually hope that is the case, although I don’t like Warren or Anderson in the starting lineup.

 

[Raindog]

I certainly don't think that. Ariza is our starting pf in my mind.

It's been the speculation of a few pundits that the Suns are looking at Anderson as a starter... which would be ridiculous in my opinion. It well may be baseless, and Anderson gets moved, released, or is just another bench body come the start of the season. Relying on him for any significant minutes, while cutting floor time for JJ, Bridges, and Bender does nothing positive for either the present or future.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It's been the speculation of a few pundits that the Suns are looking at Anderson as a starter... which would be ridiculous in my opinion. It well may be baseless, and Anderson gets moved, released, or is just another bench body come the start of the season. Relying on him for any significant minutes, while cutting floor time for JJ, Bridges, and Bender does nothing positive for either the present or future.

Wasn't it Woj that originally tweeted that? I still can't see Anderson as our starter at pf.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I certainly don't think that. Ariza is our starting pf in my mind.

He's been a shooting guard/small forward his entire career, hasn't he? Regardless, I'm not too thrilled about a 215 pound power forward even in today's game.

 

[Hoop Head]

He's been a shooting guard/small forward his entire career, hasn't he? Regardless, I'm not too thrilled about a 215 pound power forward even in today's game.

He has but it seems to be a trend lately of wings becoming small PF's in today's NBA. Dudley did it, Joe Johnson did it, and Ariza has as well. He played some PF for the Rockets last year who also used PJ Tucker at PF as well. Melo is another wing who has made that change as well. It's not unprecedented.

My main issue with the trade isn't so much the trade itself but how it makes the roster now, after signing Ariza and trading for Bridges at the draft. I know the trade should be judged alone and doing that it's an ok trade, not a win but that has more to do with McD originally overpaying for Knight to bring him to Phoenix and then giving him a big contract right after that partial season in which he was acquired and hurt. If we drafted Chriss with our own pick it would easier to swallow him being a bust but we dealt 2 1st round picks and Bogdanovich for him, making it basically 3 1sts, which was too much.

If Anderson's contract was expiring after this season then I'd like it a lot more but if he plays big minutes that takes time away from not only Bender but Jackson and Bridges also. I would rather have him than Knight but trading away 2 costly mistakes together like McD did only showed just how big of mistakes acquiring those 2 in the first place were.

 

[AzStevenCal]

He has but it seems to be a trend lately of wings becoming small PF's in today's NBA. Dudley did it, Joe Johnson did it, and Ariza has as well. He played some PF for the Rockets last year who also used PJ Tucker at PF as well. Melo is another wing who has made that change as well. It's not unprecedented.

Dudley didn't really do it, that's why he was on the bench. And Ariza has nowhere near the frame of Joe or PJ. He might have a little reach on Tucker but he's not the almost immovable force that PJ is. And Carmelo probably always should have been a 4, he has the size and the build for it.

To me, Ariza is already undersized as a 3, moving him into the 4 is a stretch IMO. He can play a few minutes there but I just don't see him being our true 4 as some are suggesting. I hope I'm wrong, we certainly need someone that can handle that spot better than Bender or Duds or Chriss from last season. But I don't see it happening.

 

[Chaplin]

Dudley didn't really do it, that's why he was on the bench.

Actually Dudley did do it in Washington and was signed specifically to cover PF. That was widely reported at the time. Not saying I agree with it, but that was the intention and definitely his history with the Wizards even though it was short lived.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Actually Dudley did do it in Washington and was signed specifically to cover PF. That was widely reported at the time. Not saying I agree with it, but that was the intention and definitely his history with the Wizards even though it was short lived.

I'm aware that he spent some time at PF in Washington and he did so with us too. But, in my book, failing at a position is not the same thing as playing a position.

 

[Yuma]

This is a good trade on 2k19. Two 73 rated players for a 76.

Melton's score?

 

[Chaplin]

I'm aware that he spent some time at PF in Washington and he did so with us too. But, in my book, failing at a position is not the same thing as playing a position.

Agree to disagree on this one, which boils down to semantics. Can’t fail at a position if you never play it.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Agree to disagree on this one, which boils down to semantics. Can’t fail at a position if you never play it.

Now you've really confused me. I say Dudley failed at power forward because of how he played when he played. How is that never playing? And I look at BRef and it shows his primary position for the last 3 seasons to be power forward and his stats also support the statement that he has failed at the position.

 

[BC867]

Now you've really confused me. I say Dudley failed at power forward because of how he played when he played. How is that never playing? And I look at BRef and it shows his primary position for the last 3 seasons to be power forward and his stats also support the statement that he has failed at the position.

My guess is that Chap was being facetious.

 

[Superbone]

To me, Ariza is already undersized as a 3, moving him into the 4 is a stretch IMO.

No pun intended?

 

[AzStevenCal]

No pun intended?

Just a little. I was hoping it would highlight the fact that even in an NBA world of stretch bigs, he doesn't measure up.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Melton's score?

He hasn't signed so he isn't in the game yet

 

[Phrazbit]

He's a second round pick who didn't play in college for a year. I doubt the 2k sports gang is going to give him much heed. I don't know where the cutoff in the game for "unplayable" is, but I suspect he'll be around there. Not that he will be that in real life, but I'd be surprised if they ever gave 2nd round picks ratings that are not terrible.

 

[Chaplin]

Now you've really confused me. I say Dudley failed at power forward because of how he played when he played. How is that never playing? And I look at BRef and it shows his primary position for the last 3 seasons to be power forward and his stats also support the statement that he has failed at the position.

How so? You were pretty clear in your post:

But, in my book, failing at a position is not the same thing as playing a position.

 

[AzStevenCal]

How so? You were pretty clear in your post:

I thought so. This conversation grew out of a statement that Ariza would be our starting power forward. If we'd moved KJ to the center position and left him there for a few years, you might call that playing center but I wouldn't. We need someone who can actually play power forward, not someone who has technically played the position.

 

[Mainstreet]

For those who want to take another look at the Chriss/Knight trade Kellan Olson writes an article today at Arizona Sports. It particularly focuses on the Suns giving up on Chriss and the risks McDonough has taken in trades.

Here are a couple of excerpts:

The trade-off in value is the most fascinating aspect of the deal that’s impossible to judge from an outside perspective. Did Houston’s general manager Daryl Morey require Chriss as an add-on? Or was it the other way, with the Suns preferring Melton to Chriss?


The initial and more obvious read is Phoenix simply wanted to move on from Knight and Chriss.

What if Chriss could have actually helped the Suns win down the line and they gave him up in this deal for an overpaid stretch four and Melton, a rookie point guard they already passed on at No. 31 to draft Elie Okobo?

That’s another risk to add to the list.

http://arizonasports.com/story/1654390/suns-trade-rockets-marquese-chriss-remaining-upside/

 

[Chaplin]

I thought so. This conversation grew out of a statement that Ariza would be our starting power forward. If we'd moved KJ to the center position and left him there for a few years, you might call that playing center but I wouldn't. We need someone who can actually play power forward, not someone who has technically played the position.

Hyperbole much?

So much for point-counterpoint discussion. If you don't want to discuss, then don't reply.

 

[Chaplin]

For those who want to take another look at the Chriss/Knight trade Kellan Olson writes an article today at Arizona Sports. It particularly focuses on the Suns giving up on Chriss and the risks McDonough has taken in trades.

Here are a couple of excerpts:





http://arizonasports.com/story/1654390/suns-trade-rockets-marquese-chriss-remaining-upside/

Did he also throw in a blurb about how much he still loves Doncic? Because he and Sidery talk about it all the time.

 

[Mainstreet]

Did he also throw in a blurb about how much he still loves Doncic? Because he and Sidery talk about it all the time.

It's not in the article but I see no reason why he shouldn't like Doncic.