Well it wasn't level in the Negro Leagues either. Not sure exactly what level of talent they had there if they never got to go play in the MLB. It may have been a few guys dominating a weaker league, though I admire Paige for being able to pitch for all those years.
Congrats to Barry Bonds...
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Who are you to decide who is a "true" baseball fan and who's not? I think you're crazy if you won't go see a game Barry is playing in (especially if he's playing the Dbacks here in AZ). Do you want to take away any record that could potentially have an asterisk next to it? Because tons of players have been cheating the game since it began, there have been rumors of steroids and another performance enhancers since the mid 80s, so please get a clue.
Furthermore, what does my age have to do with it?
And Hank did it 'naturally', well thats a tough thing to define. Is working out natural? What about proper diet and nutrition that modern players are much more likely to have as compared to those 30,40, whatever years ago. Baseball looked the other way during the 'roid era, why do people put so much hate on Bonds in particular, when guys on our own team (Gonzo) may have done the same thing, and a huge portion of baseball was doing it too? Why not take all this anger and throw it at Selig? Or the owners? Or the players union? These guys are the most competitive people on the planet, while you may not agree with what they did, I would surely think you'd be able to understand, why they did it.
I have no problem with whether or not Barry Bonds or anyone else did 'roids. It was a roids era, get over it. Bonds was one of the best, the best, of his generation, he's going to the hall. I'm sorry that you are so hung up on such a silly issue as steroids that you can't enjoy a great record.
All of these AND you sent me a PM saying I'm a kid. First off, what the heck does that even mean? How old do you think I am? I have my own apartment, a job, and a bachelors degree. I'm old enough to drink, vote, go to war, etc. I don't see how I'm a 'kid.'
Does it really upset you that badly that someone has a different point of view from you that you have to revert to name calling? Remember, as Barry Goldwater often said, 'you can disagree with out being disagreeable," perhaps thats something to consider.
Furthermore, if you do want to devolve into name calling, I'm fine with that, but PLEASE be creative. Repeatedly calling me a "kid," double posting and generally making no cogent points or any semblance of sense, wow, you've certainly proved your 'point.'
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I am saddened that Bonds tied Aaron's record. If I was the manager, I would never have pitched to Bonds. I would walk him intentionally, pitch around him or even bean him. But, I would never let any of my pitcher's give Bonds a chance to hit a hr.
Aaron is a class act. Bonds is a juiced up fraud.
Aaron is a class act. Bonds is a juiced up fraud.
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the only reason that this record breaking does not completely enrage me is the fact that i know the record by Balc-i mean Bonds will be broken by A-Rod in a couple of years. Whoever says congrats to Bonds or is happy for him just wants to be able to say that "I got to see Barrry Bonds", or "oh i was so happy for Barry" deep down you know he's a cheater and doesn't deserve to push back a class act like Hank Aaron in the record books.
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Debate the topic and not the poster. This goes for everybody here, and this is the only warning that is going to be given.
Why does it drive the anti Barry people up the wall so much that some people either 1. like Barry, or 2. are neutral. Deep down we know he's a cheater? Yah well so was Gaylord Perry, but I don't put a mental asterisk next to his 300 wins, do you?
I find this whole topic so weird, I can not get my brain around why Barry upsets people so much. Perhaps people just listen to media parrots too much, but why aren't people equally mad at Sosa, McGwire, Palmero, or the cheaters of generations gone by? These guys are hyper competitive, they've always tried to find a way to cheat and they always will.
phillycard
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Whatever, whatever. I'll give him his props, but I don't have to like it.
Brian
PANEM ET CIRCENSES
To answer your questions, none of the people you mentioned are chasing the all-time home run record.
Barry Bonds would never be about to break this record if he hadn't juiced up.
It is an unfair advantage that Aaron didn't have.
If Barroids was just another player who juiced up I wouldn't care about him either way. If Barroids wasn't such an a-hole I wouldn't dis-like him.
As a human being he's an ass. As a baseball player he's a cheater.
But Hank Aaron didn't have to play against all the great Latino and Asian players that Bonds had to, so he had that advantage. See, you can go on all day about "well player from generation X had tons of advantages over generation Y"
I guess I just don't see the logic in attaching myself to a record that 1. wasn't hit by my team, 2. wasn't hit by someone I'm friends or family with. I mean, for instance, Kobe is a jerk, but if someday he breaks the All Time Scoring record (won't happen), I won't care in the least bit. Will the fact that he's an ass, and has had off court issues make you lose your mind booing him?
Also, out of curiosity, what could Barry do to quell your anger? At this point if he came out and said "You know what guys, I did do drugs, I was so worried about keeping up with everyone else doing it, I thought I had to. I'm sorry if I upset the fans", would you forgive and forget? I have a feeling a lot of people wouldn't, it seems like people just 'love to hate' Barry.
Brian
PANEM ET CIRCENSES
What could Barry do to quell my anger? Nothing.
The record belongs to Aaron until someone else who wasn't/isn't using steroids or HGH breaks it.
Imagine you are watching your 10 year old playing in a little league game and he hits a ball 150 feet because that is as far as his 10 year old body can hit it. Would you be proud of him? Sure.
Now imagine if in that same game some roided up 10 year old blasts one 300 feet. As he's rounding the bases would you applaud him? As for me, hell no. I boo the crap out of him to make sure he knows some of us don't approve of his cheating.
He's an arrogant hypocrite, he says last night "Baseball players are a fraternity and we need to stick together, the sooner we realize that the sooner we can all move on from this" well if they should become more close knit, how can he say this yet still cheat to break a record held by one of the most beloved players among major leaguers.
He's been a jerk to me and others each time I've seen him in person. Must have caught him on multiple bad days, eh?
In the end it doesn't matter why some people boo him and others cheer him. You do your thing and we'll do ours.
Brian
PANEM ET CIRCENSES
He's been a jerk to me and others each time I've seen him in person. Must have caught him on multiple bad days, eh?
In the end it doesn't matter why some people boo him and others cheer him. You do your thing and we'll do ours.
Oh okay, if you say so Brian.
NavyVet
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Ken Griffey, Jr, is the best ballplayer of the modern era. Had he stayed healthy, he'd been close to or have already broken the record. Even now, he only stands 11 away from 600. Barry Bonds doesn't come close to his talent.
Well thats the thing w/ records, they take longevity and health, thats why they are so hard to break. I think both at their peak Bonds and Griffey were pretty similar players talent wise, I hardly think Bonds "doesn't come close."
Brian
PANEM ET CIRCENSES
We're both on the side that can't stand Bonds. What's your deal?
Sorry, I COMPLETELY misunderstood your post. I re-read it and now I understand.
(I thought you were in essence telling me to shut up and that Barry was a good guy).
Sorry again.
82CardsGrad
7 x 70
Bonds has more haters than admirers... And it's not just because of roids. He is a complete, total, Class A cornholio.
Now, roids or not, what he has accomplished over his career is worthy of admiration and praise.
His biggest problem - aside from the obvious roids issue - is that the man who held the greatest record in all of sports happens to be one of the greatest men to ever play baseball. Aaron is the standard bearer when it comes to what a pro athlete should be like. He is loved by everyone. The way he built his records will never, ever be duplicated. Check out his stats and you'll be amazed by facts like: He never once hit more than 47 HR's in a season! He's #3 alltime with a total of 3,771 career hits! He's #1 alltime in RBI's, Total Bases & Extra Base Hits! He's #3 alltime in Runs Scored! He has a career .305 batting average...
Bonds could certainly never really measure up to Aaron as a baseball player, and he certainly whiffs bigtime when compared to Hank as a human being...
There's hardly a baseball fan who wishes it were someone else breaking this record. Griffey would have been huge. A-Rod will one day surpass Bonds and that will be huge too...
But Bonds passing Aaron? Bleh... nobody outside of the Bonds family gives a crap. That is one of the saddest statements about the great game of baseball that has ever surfaced.
Now, roids or not, what he has accomplished over his career is worthy of admiration and praise.
His biggest problem - aside from the obvious roids issue - is that the man who held the greatest record in all of sports happens to be one of the greatest men to ever play baseball. Aaron is the standard bearer when it comes to what a pro athlete should be like. He is loved by everyone. The way he built his records will never, ever be duplicated. Check out his stats and you'll be amazed by facts like: He never once hit more than 47 HR's in a season! He's #3 alltime with a total of 3,771 career hits! He's #1 alltime in RBI's, Total Bases & Extra Base Hits! He's #3 alltime in Runs Scored! He has a career .305 batting average...
Bonds could certainly never really measure up to Aaron as a baseball player, and he certainly whiffs bigtime when compared to Hank as a human being...
There's hardly a baseball fan who wishes it were someone else breaking this record. Griffey would have been huge. A-Rod will one day surpass Bonds and that will be huge too...
But Bonds passing Aaron? Bleh... nobody outside of the Bonds family gives a crap. That is one of the saddest statements about the great game of baseball that has ever surfaced.
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CardShark
DEAL WITH IT!
I don't like anyone that cheated, but especially when it comes to the most sacred records in sports. I'm disgusted by Selig and anyone that could let it go on.
Which in reality was most eveyone in baseball. The owners knew what was going on - to blame it on Selig alone is ludicris.
TucsonDevil
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Aaron's 755 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bond's 755
Henry Aaron as a person/teammate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Barry Bonds as a person/teammate
I was also disappointed to see the San Diego crowd cheering for him. Despite what we hear on ESPN, news reports on Saturday night (from outlets such as CNN, CBS, etc) say the cheering and boos were about even... conspiracy says that ESPN is now showing the clip with lessened boos.
Henry Aaron as a person/teammate >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Barry Bonds as a person/teammate
I was also disappointed to see the San Diego crowd cheering for him. Despite what we hear on ESPN, news reports on Saturday night (from outlets such as CNN, CBS, etc) say the cheering and boos were about even... conspiracy says that ESPN is now showing the clip with lessened boos.
Boo. Go A-Rod. Hit 300 more HR's as soon as you can.
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Congrats to Bonds. A-Rod will beat him, if he can stay healthy. Too bad Griffey got hurt.
That is why it just does not matter... The entire association is just riddled with bad choices, poor player and player union negotiations and I just don't understand how people can say it taints the game, it ruins the history...
He used, he won't admit it, but he used. Was it illegal at the time, nope... all the records that are on the books have one reason or anotehr to doubt them. It is what it is. For such a statistics based game I think the whole thing is a sham... Everything should have an * next to it as it relates to baseball.
Are we so sure that Aaron was clean? Steroid use ran wild in the 50s and 60s and there was no testing ever done about it in baseball. Now I am no saying that Aaron used but no one will really know. What we do know is Bonds never tested positive when testing has been done. He admitted to taking what Balco gave him but swears he did not know they contained HGH.
Now that everyone is up in arms over my statement I just want you to consider one question.
Could Bonds have taken HGH or even steroids without knowing?
If he did not know does that make it any more right or wrong? Please name me one athlete that doesn’t try to use any advantage they can get their hands on. I would bet there is not one professional athlete playing today that does not take some type of supplement to help then get stronger and recover faster. None of them are chemists so they take the word of their nutritionist or such to know if they are safe/legal or not.
Regardless of if you believe he did PHDs or not Bonds is a incredible baseball player. He has accomplished more then any other player has, even players we know that have used PHDs.
Now that everyone is up in arms over my statement I just want you to consider one question.
Could Bonds have taken HGH or even steroids without knowing?
If he did not know does that make it any more right or wrong? Please name me one athlete that doesn’t try to use any advantage they can get their hands on. I would bet there is not one professional athlete playing today that does not take some type of supplement to help then get stronger and recover faster. None of them are chemists so they take the word of their nutritionist or such to know if they are safe/legal or not.
Regardless of if you believe he did PHDs or not Bonds is a incredible baseball player. He has accomplished more then any other player has, even players we know that have used PHDs.
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