Conspiracy Theory

[TheCardFan]

Are we all debating something that has already been decided?

KK to the Cardinals was leaked way before it happened. People knew.

Now Murray to the Cardinals is the "worst kept secret" and nearly everyone is saying its true.

Was this all part of the plan...KK and Murray?

When you step back from the fire for a moment...hiring KK was a bold move. He has a very specific offense that has been wildly successful. Do you try to make Rosen fit or do you give him the guy he has been trying to get since high school?

I have been Pro-Rosen from day 1 (wanted him before we drafted him) and feel he was thrown into the worst situation a rookie QB has every dealt with (HC, OC, OL, WR). I still believe he can be a quality NFL starter in the right system. Is this the right system? I don't know.

I want Bosa or Q Williams but for arguments sake...QB is by far the most important position in the NFL. Period.

Knowing what we know now...would you take Patrick Mahomes or Baker Mayfield #1 even if you had Rosen?

I think Mahomes is superior to Murray but I would say Murray is more talented than Mayfield. His only issue is really his size. If Murray was 6-2 like Mahomes, would we be fighting this idea so hard?

This has been the most interesting off-season and draft process I can ever remember for Cardinal fans. We are all invested in winning and doing what makes the team better. I have been 100% convinced this entire time that we would not draft Murray but that choice may already have been made.

Cheers Cardinal Fans and get ready for a wild experience!

 

[Krangodnzr]

I was standing on the sidelines during the Chiefs-Chargers game during week one.

Mahomes looked much bigger in person, I'd guess he's 6'3.

Travis Kelce was uuuuge, as was Eric Fisher. Biggest dude was Kpassagnon.

 

[GuernseyCard]

You can't know what you don't know.

If the Cards knew what Mahomes would become, they would have been all in and the Rosen question is thus moot.

KK's gush about Murray was certainly before he could possibly know that he was our next H-C or that Murray the baseball player would declare for the draft.

And, keep in mind, KK sold himself by coming in and breaking down Rosen on tape. In other words, he sold himself as the guy who could work with the present Cards QBOF.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I would take Mayfield over Murray, btw, I think Mayfield is a better QB and brings it when on the biggest stage so far. Murray didn’t during the Alabama game and that is huge for me. I would take Mayfield or Mahomes over Rosen if we could trade, but wouldn’t likely take Murray.

Fortunately for the Cards staff, KK gets a pro day with Murray and an OTA with Rosen, all before the draft.

 

[DRM08]

You can't know what you don't know.

If the Cards knew what Mahomes would become, they would have all in and the Rosen question is thus moot.

KK's gush about Murray was certainly before he could possibly know that he was our next H-C or that Murray the baseball player would declare for the draft.

And, keep in mind, KK sold himself by coming in and breaking down Rosen on tape. In other words, he sold himself as the guy who could work with the present Cards QBOF.

The day after Kliff was hired, it leaked that Murray was entering the NFL Draft. They both have the same agent.

Cards owner said Kliff was the only coach who wanted to look at Rosen’s film. He did not say Kliff’s analysis of the film was extremely positive. What if it was the opposite and Kliff told them let’s grab Murray? Lol

 

[TheCardFan]

I would take Mayfield over Murray, btw, I think Mayfield is a better QB and brings it when on the biggest stage so far. Murray didn’t during the Alabama game and that is huge for me. I would take Mayfield or Mahomes over Rosen if we could trade, but wouldn’t likely take Murray.

Fortunately for the Cards staff, KK gets a pro day with Murray and an OTA with Rosen, all before the draft.

When are the OTA's?

 

[GuernseyCard]

The day after Kliff was hired, it leaked that Murray was entering the NFL Draft. They both have the same agent.

Cards owner said Kliff was the only coach who wanted to look at Rosen’s film. He did not say Kliff’s analysis of the film was extremely positive. What if it was the opposite and Kliff told them let’s grab Murray? Lol

We don't know precisely what he said, but it would have been a dumb interview strategy to dump on the choice made by the two guys across the table. He didn't have the cachet to take that approach.

Now, if in the lead up to the draft, KK becomes convinced that Rosen can't assimilate and run his system then there's a question as to what they do. Somehow, I think hiring Rodgers former QB coach and O-coordinator is further evidence Rosen is the guy.

 

[DRM08]

We don't know precisely what he said, but it would have been a dumb interview strategy to dump on the choice made by the two guys across the table. He didn't have the cachet to take that approach.

Now, if in the lead up to the draft, KK becomes convinced that Rosen can't assimilate and run his system then there's a question as to what they do. Somehow, I think hiring Rodgers former QB coach and O-coordinator is further evidence Rosen is the guy.

Yes, I would be very surprised if they dump Rosen. If they do it, then I believe it was a conspiracy all along. I put the odds at 95% keep Rosen.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

When are the OTA's?

For us, anytime starting April 1st - don’t think dates have been announced yet though...

https://operations.nfl.com/football-ops/league-governance/2018-19-important-nfl-dates/

 

[Ohcrap75]

If there was an Andrew Luck, Trevor Lawrence type QB prospect in this draft, I would absolutely understand this type of plan. Kyler has a huge upside, but I have so many questions with him that gives him a very low floor as well. The risk isn’t worth the reward in our current situation

 

[Jetstream Green]

I would take Mayfield over Murray, btw, I think Mayfield is a better QB and brings it when on the biggest stage so far. Murray didn’t during the Alabama game and that is huge for me. I would take Mayfield or Mahomes over Rosen if we could trade, but wouldn’t likely take Murray.

Fortunately for the Cards staff, KK gets a pro day with Murray and an OTA with Rosen, all before the draft.

Murray has the quickest release I have ever seen on a QB, yeah it's probably because of his compact short arms but the result is a lightning quick release. I do think this quick release leads some to not notice that he is not very instinctive in processing his information since his ability to get the ball out so quick nullifies that mental delay but it's there when his passes are a tad behind his receivers. I have concerns about him hitting timing routes as a pro, the same obstacle Rosen started doing towards the final games. Murray has one hell of a arm no doubt, and he shows it when he throws deep with actually great accuracy but he does not have Mayfield's accuracy on intermediate and short routes, and those OU wrs need to be on a draft radar because they did make a lot of catches on throws that frankly where high and behind them on more than a few passes. Murray is quicker than Vick but he does not have Vick's football speed, but Vick was built better and would actually take some hits because he knew he could. Murray actually scrambles a little timidly, as he should with his size, looking not to get hit which is smart but as a pro some people might start to get frustrated with this in a game of inches (do you really see a team using him on a QB sneak). I do not see the tight window throws some state he does. His accuracy is above average but it's far from Mayfield accuracy in ball placement. You bet I would take a gamble on him as a late first or second round pick but not number one overall when I still have a guy like Rosen

 

[GatorAZ]

I would take Mayfield over Murray, btw, I think Mayfield is a better QB and brings it when on the biggest stage so far. Murray didn’t during the Alabama game and that is huge for me. I would take Mayfield or Mahomes over Rosen if we could trade, but wouldn’t likely take Murray.

Fortunately for the Cards staff, KK gets a pro day with Murray and an OTA with Rosen, all before the draft.

Mayfield was 0-2 in the CFB Playoff. Mahomes, Trubisky, Goff, Wentz and Rosen didn’t win jack. Drafting a QB high used to mean needing to win big and have and have 3 years experience... Watson is the only guy who has fit that old school criteria for a QB recently.

 

[PACardsFan]

Are we all debating something that has already been decided?

KK to the Cardinals was leaked way before it happened. People knew.

Now Murray to the Cardinals is the "worst kept secret" and nearly everyone is saying its true.

Was this all part of the plan...KK and Murray?

When you step back from the fire for a moment...hiring KK was a bold move. He has a very specific offense that has been wildly successful. Do you try to make Rosen fit or do you give him the guy he has been trying to get since high school?

I have been Pro-Rosen from day 1 (wanted him before we drafted him) and feel he was thrown into the worst situation a rookie QB has every dealt with (HC, OC, OL, WR). I still believe he can be a quality NFL starter in the right system. Is this the right system? I don't know.

I want Bosa or Q Williams but for arguments sake...QB is by far the most important position in the NFL. Period.

Knowing what we know now...would you take Patrick Mahomes or Baker Mayfield #1 even if you had Rosen?

I think Mahomes is superior to Murray but I would say Murray is more talented than Mayfield. His only issue is really his size. If Murray was 6-2 like Mahomes, would we be fighting this idea so hard?

This has been the most interesting off-season and draft process I can ever remember for Cardinal fans. We are all invested in winning and doing what makes the team better. I have been 100% convinced this entire time that we would not draft Murray but that choice may already have been made.

Cheers Cardinal Fans and get ready for a wild experience!

Somehow, I missed this thread. From the start, this is pretty much what I thought could play out. I also thought that once we secured the #1 draft pick, then the KK/Murray package was etched in stone when KK signed on the dotted line. Why bring in an “outside the box” offense & not let the HC pick the QB that would best run it???

 

[PJ1]

Murray at #1 overall? No way. I hope we don't do it and I don't believe it is already decided.

 

[slanidrac16]

I could see KK sitting in his interview and noting he could do this and this with Rosen. Now with Murray PERHAPS he can say I can do this and this and this and this. When you add up all the timelines who knows? I just hate to see Rosen stuck wasting his time at ota’s unless it truly is to see if he is a good option to stick with.

 

[PACardsFan]

This is a very good Thread & there are great posts attached to it. Valid points made everywhere & it’s a crapshoot as to what the Cardinals may actually do. As a Cardinal fan, this will be the craziest draft in our lifetimes. Strap on your seatbelt, this may get crazy.

 

[PJ1]

To be honest all this Murray crap is ruining the draft experience for me. I have been a Cardinal fan long enough to know that when teams start throwing around misinformation to confuse things the Cardinals most often will get screwed or screw themselves. Having the #1 overall pick is a huge responsibility and I don't trust Humpty Dumpty with it at all.

 

[DRM08]

This is a very good Thread & there are great posts attached to it. Valid points made everywhere & it’s a crapshoot as to what the Cardinals may actually do. As a Cardinal fan, this will be the craziest draft in our lifetimes. Strap on your seatbelt, this may get crazy.

Or maybe they just take Bosa. Not such a crazy result.

 

[wkycardsfan]

Maybe I was wrong from the get go but didn't we supposedly go into this HC search looking for an offensive mind that could also groom Rosen? I thought KK was the QB whisperer who was going to change Rosen's career path. Do I remember incorrectly the purpose of the search and what was said when KK was given the job? So how did we go from hiring KK to bring Rosen along to a couple of months later the possibility of trading Rosen and starting all over with another QB?

 

[swagron]

I think this is all much ado about nada. I think they take Bosa (although they should trade down to acquire more pick). If nothing else, this just puts az football in the news.

 

[DRM08]

Maybe I was wrong from the get go but didn't we supposedly go into this HC search looking for an offensive mind that could also groom Rosen? I thought KK was the QB whisperer who was going to change Rosen's career path. Do I remember incorrectly the purpose of the search and what was said when KK was given the job? So how did we go from hiring KK to bring Rosen along to a couple of months later the possibility of trading Rosen and starting all over with another QB?

It has the appearance of a pretty big smokescreen. Not sure if it will work out like they are hoping, which is to get a trade with the Raiders.

 

[Chopper0080]

What needs to be understood is that this has always been connect-the-dot reporting. It came from interview comments from Kingsbury when he wasn't even the Cardinals HC. It came from comments before the Cardinals were even locked into having the # 1 pick. Now, this doesn't mean that it can't be well connected dots, but we all need to remember the genesis of this rumor.

 

[oaken1]

What needs to be understood is that this has always been connect-the-dot reporting. It came from interview comments from Kingsbury when he wasn't even the Cardinals HC. It came from comments before the Cardinals were even locked into having the # 1 pick. Now, this doesn't mean that it can't be well connected dots, but we all need to remember the genesis of this rumor.

wouldnt it be hilarious if murray declared for the draft specifically because of that KK interview and it convinced him he would be the top pick?
The kid has to get enough money to pay back the A's for that bonus they gave him or he isnt gonna play football.

 

[Jetstream Green]

wouldnt it be hilarious if murray declared for the draft specifically because of that KK interview and it convinced him he would be the top pick?
The kid has to get enough money to pay back the A's for that bonus they gave him or he isnt gonna play football.

Here is something which might happen, Murray ends up getting selected outside of the first round after the hype train slows down and the reality of building a roster in the long run comes into play... great kid with the possibility to be huge but with a larger percentage to get a GM fired, because it's one thing for Keim to gamble with KK but another to play Russian roulette with Murray as his first pick overall

 

[ARZCardinals]

KK's record with his offense at Texas Tech wasn't exactly a winning formula (2 winning season in 6 seasons)...not exactly glowing...so I wouldn't exactly listen to everything he's saying right now...
He's about as proven then Steve Wilks...other than KK has some HC experience
Not sure how KK's gotten into the Sean McVey realm, but his coaching record is
8-5
4-8
7-6
5-7
6-7
5-7

not exactly glowing