ESPN Page 2: The ideal of Kobe is lost forever

arthurracoon

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Intresting article:

Kobe was always a freak. That's what we loved about him.

He was supernaturally smooth, regal, and skilled -- on and off the court. He walked a walk and talked a talk well beyond his years. And in everything he did, he wasn't just driven, he was drive itself, and he was not just fearless, he was fearlessness.

We ate it up. We couldn't get enough.

In an era when we see so many professional athletes as self-indulgent, wayward characters always just one step away from scandal, Kobe looked to us like a squeaky, shining exception to the rule -- too busy, too disciplined and too in love to get in trouble.

At a time when we think too many are too hungry for the Benjamins, he looked like a ball-above-all hunter on a sacred quest for nothing but rings.

We were a sick sport culture, he was the antidote. We were lost, he was the way up and out of the darkness.

We needed this to be true.

We needed to know good citizenship was alive and kicking somewhere. We needed dedication, will and a tireless eye on the prize to be real things in this world.

We didn't know Kobe. (It's impossible to know another person, especially a person in the spotlight, and most especially a person as private and publicly crafted as he was.) It was never about Kobe.

It was the idea of Kobe -- the way Kobe embodied ideas we valued -- we were drawn and dedicated to.

But now he's not an idea, he's a headline. And as of Friday, he's charged with sexual assault.

At best, the exceptional man has become common, base (ruled by his libido and not his head). And at worst, he has become something far uglier, sadder and more detestable than that.

We hear about a thing like this, and we're rattled in the obvious ways and for the obvious reasons: We hope the accusations aren't true, we sympathize with the alleged victim, we worry and wonder about a player we've admired and rooted for these last eight years. The human particulars -- what actually happened in that hotel room in Colorado, how the accuser and the accused are feeling right now, what this must be like for Kobe's wife Vanessa, etc. -- trouble our minds, never to be resolved.

But the freefall swoon of this moment for us comes not from any of this, but from the death of an idea. All that we'd assigned to Kobe, all that we'd thrilled to because he seemed to offer it up so cleanly and clearly, lies in pieces on the floor right now.

We cling to the possibility of his innocence, because we cling to the Kobe idea. We wring our hands at the prospect of his guilt, because we mourn the loss of the idea.

We know nothing's settled yet. We know (and we hope) Kobe might be exonerated. But we know, too, that the noise and muck of the circus these last few weeks has already shattered the Kobe idea, regardless of how things play out from here.

And we remember watching Kobe play before all this, and we tell you there was something pristine about his game, some fuel-efficient precisely calibrated something that made it easy to see past him to the basketball (to the human) virtues he practiced and professed.

His game was noiseless, compact, we say -- you could see it in the tight spiral on his shot, in the short, sharp pop of his jump -- and when you watched it, it seemed you were witness not just to the player but to the natural expression of the virtues themselves. And we were cheered by this, we say. We were hopeful. We believed, despite all the threats and temptations in this modern world, that certain principles persisted.

And then some clip from Friday's press conference comes across the screen, and all the precision of his game stumbles and bumbles into those labored lip curls and choked phrases, and we can barely stand to watch.

We're no innocents, we tell you. We know athletes, just like any of us, are vulnerable to character flaws and bad judgment. And we realize, sadly, that some of them, like some of us, will sometimes give in to terrible impulses. So we're not shocked by what has been alleged and admitted to so far. We're not decrying the fall of western civilization like this is the first or the last time such a thing has or will go down.

But we believe in the remarkable exception.

We believed in the Kobe idea, and now we wonder whether it will resurface, and who it will be named for.

We worry that this might be the last of it, actually, worry that the Kobe idea was so strong, so seemingly impervious, and yet it foundered ...

But we put that thought out of our heads.

You ask us if maybe this is a chance to let go, to find the virtues, to cultivate the idea, somewhere other than in the body and spirit of a baller.

We can't hear you. We're meditating on the game, pondering the idea. And, on a channel so deep within us it is barely noticeable at first, sure enough, a name starts to vibrate in our ears.

LeBron. The LeBron idea. Yes. Surely this one will last forever.
 

elindholm

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I think this article sums it all up.

I completely agree. It sums up the fact that a lot of people need to get a grip. He's an athlete, not the Messiah.

And LeBron James, give me a break. He has already proclaimed himself the Next Great Thing -- how can the public fall in love with him, if they don't get to assist in his greatness?
 

Ryanwb

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Originally posted by elindholm
I think this article sums it all up.

I completely agree. It sums up the fact that a lot of people need to get a grip. He's an athlete, not the Messiah.

And LeBron James, give me a break. He has already proclaimed himself the Next Great Thing -- how can the public fall in love with him, if they don't get to assist in his greatness?

I hate to say it, but I am rooting against LeBron James...only a complete and total failure from James would bring the world back to reality. He signed a 90 million dollar shoe deal before he even played a game against another professional player....what is wrong with that picture? Its not just basketball....baseball and football have the same issues. Basketball atleast has a structured rookie contract that all the other professional sports should follow.
 

Brian in Mesa

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Originally posted by elindholm
And LeBron James, give me a break. He has already proclaimed himself the Next Great Thing -- how can the public fall in love with him, if they don't get to assist in his greatness?

And LeBron has already had mini scandals (Hummer, throwback jerseys, giving money to the OSU RB, etc) before ever playing in an official NBA game...
 

green machine

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Originally posted by Ryanwb
I hate to say it, but I am rooting against LeBron James

Me too. Anybody who already calls themselves "King James" cannot be this humble nice kid that everybody says he is. I personally think James will be a bust, that he does not have the makeup to be a star. Remember when the whole jersey scandle was going on? Didn't he say he thought the guy gave him the jerseys because of his good grades, not because of his athletic performance? Either LeBron lied to everyone or he is a complete moron.

adam
 

KANIDJA

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At the end all is going to be OK. Kobe has too much money to go to jail.

Why are people turniong against KObe? I never liked him because he was so full of himslef. He behaved like he was the king of the world. And there is that Lakers factor. Hate that team. But in my eyes he will, after all of this is history, be the same Kobe he once was for me. With trhe fame and money he has it is hard to turn down all those girls that are throwing themselves at you. 80 % of people cheat on their wives at one point or another. Kobe is no angeln just like we all are not. He saw the cjance, took it and made a mistake. No way in hell do I think he raped her.


Now, he will lose lots of money and respect by people who are over this and who were never tempted like he was and can not understand his behavior. If his wife wants to divorce she is a beautiful young lady that will be able to find another guy and live happilly ever after. He only hurt himself and his family by this act.
Everyone will forget about the incident.

Bojan
 

Brian in Mesa

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Originally posted by KANIDJA
80 % of people cheat on their wives at one point or another.

:confused:

First, I doubt that statistic.

Second, if everyone is doing it, it must be ok, right? Heck, if the President can cheat on his wife (repeatedly)...why shouldn't the common man cheat without hesitation? :roll: Gimme a break.

Third, everyone will not forget. I won't. I am a diehard Lakers fan that will no longer root for #8.
 

Chris_Sanders

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Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
:confused:

First, I doubt that statistic.

Second, if everyone is doing it, it must be ok, right? Heck, if the President can cheat on his wife (repeatedly)...why shouldn't the common man cheat without hesitation? :roll: Gimme a break.

Third, everyone will not forget. I won't. I am a diehard Lakers fan that will no longer root for #8.

And I, for one, respect the fact that you are NOT a hypocrite. I can admire a man who has consistency in his morality...no matter the situation.
 

schutd

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Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
:confused:

First, I doubt that statistic.

Second, if everyone is doing it, it must be ok, right? Heck, if the President can cheat on his wife (repeatedly)...why shouldn't the common man cheat without hesitation? :roll: Gimme a break.

Third, everyone will not forget. I won't. I am a diehard Lakers fan that will no longer root for #8.

Nice way to remind us that you hate Bill Clinton... Sheesh.
 

schutd

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Let me break it down for you all. Crude, lewd, and obnoxious like.

The United States is full of a bunch of star f*ckers. Plain and simple. So many have no real life, that they live it vicariously through the lives of overpaid jackoffs with no respect for how they got where they did.

Am I off base here? Probably, but I am sick and freaking tired of the fascination this country has with celebrity status.

Its pathetic. I am no longer following anything having to do with Kobe Bryant, and I urge you all to do the same.

It aint news. Its basketball. Get a life.
 

Dback Jon

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Originally posted by schutd
Nice way to remind us that you hate Bill Clinton... Sheesh.

Maybe we should remind him that his hero Ronald Reagan and Nancy Davis were screwing around while he was still married to his first wife........

Dwight Eisenhower banged his personal secretary for years - all the time he was in Europe leading the Allies, he was commiting adultery on a daily basis.
 

scotsman13

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yea kobe has a lot of money but then so did mike tyson and yes he went to jail for rape. time will tell what really happened. but from the few things that i am hearing kobe will go to jail and will never play bball again. he is a person who so believed what everyone said about him that he lost sight of the most important fact of all, that he was still human.
 

KANIDJA

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Originally posted by Brian in Mesa
:confused:

First, I doubt that statistic.

Second, if everyone is doing it, it must be ok, right? Heck, if the President can cheat on his wife (repeatedly)...why shouldn't the common man cheat without hesitation? :roll: Gimme a break.

Third, everyone will not forget. I won't. I am a diehard Lakers fan that will no longer root for #8.


Never said it was OK. But Kobe should not be looked at differently than other people that cheat on their spouses (taking into account that charges on rape will be dropped). Did you people forget about our coach and his little relationship..? Whether you like it or not these kinds of things happen in everyday life, and whoever is ignoring the facts is fool in my eyes.
 

SweetD

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Originally posted by KANIDJA
Never said it was OK. But Kobe should not be looked at differently than other people that cheat on their spouses (taking into account that charges on rape will be dropped). Did you people forget about our coach and his little relationship..? Whether you like it or not these kinds of things happen in everyday life, and whoever is ignoring the facts is fool in my eyes.

IMO there is a big difference. I am not saying I condone their actions, but both parties were separated and both parties had grown apart from their spouse(This happens everyday). For some reason there are to many people trying to look for an excuse to support Kobe. IF he had slept with your sister/family member would you be looking for a feel good conclusion.
 

Freddie

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But they were still married, which is adultery.

Technically, there is no difference. :D
 

SweetD

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I am not saying they are not adulterer, they are! I still don't care. I don't know them I don't want to know them and they are only here for my enjoyment to watch a game I pay money for. They are entertainers let them entertain. I have got say this Kobe thing is really get entertaining to see how many love sick Kobe fans are out there.
 

KANIDJA

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I don't think Kobe kidnapped that lady from the Front Desk, threw her in the room and then raped her. Some of this had to be her own will. He might have been drunk and she still went to his room with him.
Don't like to judge anyone because, I, like so many other people do stupid things, but this tells me something about this girl's character.
And please don't get me wrong. I am not on anybody's side. That is only my opinion about the whole incident.
 

Chaplin

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Originally posted by KANIDJA
I don't think Kobe kidnapped that lady from the Front Desk, threw her in the room and then raped her. Some of this had to be her own will. He might have been drunk and she still went to his room with him.
Don't like to judge anyone because, I, like so many other people do stupid things, but this tells me something about this girl's character.
And please don't get me wrong. I am not on anybody's side. That is only my opinion about the whole incident.

I don't know--it appears you have a warped view of rape.
 

SweetD

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Originally posted by KANIDJA
I don't think Kobe kidnapped that lady from the Front Desk, threw her in the room and then raped her. Some of this had to be her own will. He might have been drunk and she still went to his room with him.
Don't like to judge anyone because, I, like so many other people do stupid things, but this tells me something about this girl's character.
And please don't get me wrong. I am not on anybody's side. That is only my opinion about the whole incident.

You don't like to judge anyone except for this girl you don't know and Kobe you don't know(the Sainte). How do you know she was at the Front Desk that night? She may have worked there doesn't mean she was working that night?(I love the media-facts) We don't know so STOP trying to be Kobe's Friend we will not give you any money. :rolleyes:
 
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arthurracoon

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We CANNOT judge either the girl or Kobe. We do NOT know either of them. I could make anyone on this board look like a murderer by pointing out everything that they have done wrong in their life. That is not who you are. You might be a great person, but I could make you out to be a really bad person.

Kobe's image IS tarnished. Live with it. It is not ruined (unless he is charged), just tarnished.

We are ALL responsible for our actions. Kobe is responsible for his. The girl is responsible for hers.

For all we know the girl might have just wanted an autograph...maybe a souvineer, maybe something else...

We don't know what happened. No one will ever know what happened.
 

KANIDJA

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Chaplin, I know exactly what the rape is. You missed my point.

Sweet D, good point. I don't know what happened. And like I said I did not want to judge that girl. Don't know anything about her. Maybe she is nice maybse she isnt. I fir sure know more about Kobe than about her and maybe that is where I am forming more opinion.
Might have a different opinion when all facts come out.
Later.
 

Chaplin

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Originally posted by KANIDJA

Sweet D, good point. I don't know what happened. And like I said I did not want to judge that girl. Don't know anything about her. Maybe she is nice maybse she isnt. I fir sure know more about Kobe than about her and maybe that is where I am forming more opinion.
Might have a different opinion when all facts come out.
Later.

You might at that.

You probably do have a more clear picture of Kobe, but whether that picture is accurate is the question. That picture included a faithful husband 2 weeks ago, now what is it like?
 

SweetD

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Originally posted by KANIDJA
Chaplin, I know exactly what the rape is. You missed my point.
I fir sure know more about Kobe than about her and maybe that is where I am forming more opinion.
Might have a different opinion when all facts come out.
Later.
YOU DON'T Know KOBE you know what his agent/media wants you to!!!! For all you know he drinks Sprit 24/7 while speaking 3 languages and eating a bowl of wheates in his new Nike kicks.
 

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