ESPN's Offseason Powerpoll

[Skkorpion]

Kwame Harris.
David Baas.


These are also, prior to Staley, the two highest picked 49er olinemen in the last five years.

I disagree Skorp

Ok. I stand corrected. All I know is some bodies were helping Frank Gore have a huge year. Can't name them though. Don't usually watch 9er games unless we are playing them.

 

[football karma]

Ok. I stand corrected. All I know is some bodies were helping Frank Gore have a huge year. Can't name them though. Don't usually watch 9er games unless we are playing them.

SF has an interesting O-line stat --

great running game -- Gore led the NFC in rushing with 5.4 yards per carry, and had a very strong team 5.0 average per rush. Top notch stuff.

Yet at the same time -- they allowed 36 sacks. While the absolute number is middle of the pack, when you factor in the sacks allowed per passing attempt, they drop to bottom third of the league. Taken in context of how well they run the ball, to give up sacks at that rate is really poor.

 

[Ronin]

Kwame Harris.
David Baas.


These are also, prior to Staley, the two highest picked 49er olinemen in the last five years.

I disagree Skorp

David Bass really had poor work ethic for the past, but he really impressed the 49ers staff in mini-camp. I think that Bass improvement is one the reason the 49ers are willing to trade Justin Smiley.

Ok. I stand corrected. All I know is some bodies were helping Frank Gore have a huge year. Can't name them though. Don't usually watch 9er games unless we are playing them.

Most of Frank Gore’s runs were to the to the left side, behind Larry Allen, Jonas Jennings.

 

[MlKE49ER]

We could easily be 5-1 in division if it wasn't for the warner fumble in the closing seconds of the rams game in week 3 but he did. Good play by the Rams defense. The first game of the season the cardinals dominated the 49ers until the cardinals went into their prevent to win defense. I am not going to use turnovers and miss tackels as an excuse to losing games. The defense causes turnovers and a player makes a defender miss a tackle. Those are just good plays by the players. When people want to say "if this player didn't turn the ball over here or there, then we would have won the game." Well that is exactlly how teams win a game is by getting turnovers and scoring points off of turnovers. That is also call reaching in a debate. The 49ers have a chance to redeem themselves on Monday night. Until then, 4-0 baby. By the way I do like what the 49ers are doing.

You're right. Good teams win in spite of mistakes, find ways to overcome them. We werent that good of a team.
However, in both teams regards, while turnovers are part of the game, almost without fail the teams who have the least amount of turnovers during the season have winning records.
Both of our team turned over the ball at inopportune times, losing games.
What I liked..or liked seeing was after Gore had the fumbles the first 3-4 (?) games of the year (seemed like forever) Nolan gave him the ball again, immediately.
Of course, it took a new drill Nolan devised, where Gore had to run through the whole team, down the middle of a double row, while players were trying to yank ball out, for him to stop the fumbling. (team had to run laps for each ball Gore fumbled during the drill)

This is a dangerous road to go down when talking to Cardinals fans. Lately, it's rare that the Cards get blown out and we can point to one or two plays in every game that would have meant a W. So many, in fact, it's easy to get to a 10-6 record last year with this sort of thinking.

I think it's best to say that the good teams don't make those kinds of bungles and win the games instead of counting "what ifs."

Suffice it to say, neither team has been particularly good the last couple of seasons.

I agree. My point simply was the loss was as much our undoing as what the Cards brought.
Simply stating that we weren't blown out, that's all..and that I expect a good game come Sept.

 

[MlKE49ER]

SF has an interesting O-line stat --

great running game -- Gore led the NFC in rushing with 5.4 yards per carry, and had a very strong team 5.0 average per rush. Top notch stuff.

Yet at the same time -- they allowed 36 sacks. While the absolute number is middle of the pack, when you factor in the sacks allowed per passing attempt, they drop to bottom third of the league. Taken in context of how well they run the ball, to give up sacks at that rate is really poor.

hmm..lol...thought it was more sacks than that.

When you think about it...16 games..36 sacks=2 1/4 sacks per game.
I can live with that...one sack or so a half.

 

[Redsz]

You have me confused with someone else. I didn't bring up your finish in the division since 2000.

You're right. I saw '49er' in both user names and assumed it was the same user. My bad.

I'll say it again. It's completely ridiculous for anyone to state "We beat you last year, so it will happen again.

I guess Seattle can just save the gas coming south to play us, and just mail in the loss, considering we swept them last year.
By your reasoning, it's a lock that we'll sweep the Seahawks again?

I didn’t say that. But when you are predicting the future you also have to take into consideration recent events. Recently, you have not beaten the Cardinals. Which is a major red flag when predicting that the 49ers could be a playoff team or take the division.

as compared to what? playing you last THREE years? lol. Guess you want to leave out that we swept you for our only two wins that year..for some odd reason.

You mean the same team that had Josh McCown starting at QB three years ago? Not relevant in the slightest.

Heck..why not just bring up our all time head to head?

Because it is totally irrelevant? What does the w/l ratio of the teams from back in 2000 have to with the teams now?

No teams keep the same talent each year.

But hey..lol..considering you brought it up..you're right on one thing. We kept our coach, and are continuing on his program, which is on track. You? New coach..new program. No one knows how either will do.

Tell me, how many new starters will you have on defense? Two? How many on offense? Two? Three at the most?

You’re returning over 70% of your starters on both sides of the ball from last year and your telling me the results from last year are irrelevant? Come on.

Moore and Hayes were almost identical in stats, with Hayes a little ahead.

Gerald Hayes is the MLB in the 4-3 and strongside ILB in the 3-4. A little difficult to compare them because of their responsibilities.

But I would take Hayes over both the 49ers ILB's. Espically over Smith who is entering his 12th year and on the downside of his career.

Moore is clearly ahead of Dansby.

No way is Brandon Moore better than Karlos Dansby. Look for yourself:

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/492918

I think you have Gerald Hayes and Karlos Dansby confused?

Okeafor?? Isn't he a DE??

He is a OLB/DE hybrid player. Can play with his hand down or standing up as an OLB.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133380

Ulbrich and Cain are backups. Moore is the other starter. You're making a big deal about defense.

Well, yeah, it's a pretty big deal isn't it?

My point is: Arizona's LB core > SF LB core.

The D-linemen in the 3-4 don't generate the pass rush. That comes from the backers which is why they are important. And based on the fact that not one of your LB's can generate a legit pass rush, I would consider that a big deal.

Our defense was bad last year. That's why we concentrated on mainly defense this offseason. We were 26th in the NFL on defense. Arizona was 29th. I think we both have some areas to improve..don't you?

The 49ers were last in points per game with 25.8. They also gave up more yds per game than the Cardinals.

So I'm really not sure what you are basing that ranking on?

"All of our draft picks" are not expected to start.

Then what is the point of bring up the number of picks from the 'A' grade draft class?

Who are you talking about? Who we're expecting to start are FA signings, and some draft picks will vie for starting positions. Of course, on that same note..lol...didn't you just sign a lineman that is expected to start? Now THAT is a recipe for disaster, if you ask me.

It could be worse, we could be looking at starting Kwame Harris or a raw Joe Staley at RT.

Sorry, 4-2 comes to mind..not 4-0

Based on current trends it more looks like 6-0 to me!

 

[MlKE49ER]

You're right. I saw '49er' in both user names and assumed it was the same user. My bad.

No biggee

I didn’t say that. But when you are predicting the future you also have to take into consideration recent events. Recently, you have not beaten the Cardinals. Which is a major red flag when predicting that the 49ers could be a playoff team or take the division.

13 pt difference for two games means less than a td per game made the difference. In that regard, last year meant nothing..zip..zero..nada.

Because it is totally irrelevant? What does the w/l ratio of the teams from back in 2000 have to with the teams now?

Because it behooves them, most Card fans want to go back only two years, instead of 3, or 5.
Of course last year is a better indicator than 5 years ago, but unless a team is just rolling over another team (like Niners/Rams for 17 straight) rarely does it carryover..only to fans.
Two years ago, when Smith took over for Rattay, not one of the fielded O line was a starter, and for his last 7 games, he had 6 different O line formations.
That's one of the reasons what happened one year doesn't apply to the next. When both of our teams had as many starter games lost to injury as we did, it's hard to say it's even close to the same matchups.

Tell me, how many new starters will you have on defense? Two?

Likely more. Clements replaces Spencer, Lewis replaces Roman, maybe Fields for Sopoaga. No doubt draft picks Willis will get some playing time, as will McDonald and Moore, at some point.

How many on offense? Two? Three at the most?

Exactly. FA Jackson at WR, Lelie will get some time along side Battle, Hill will get in the rotation, no doubt. I'm surprised Snyder hasn't already taken over for Kwame Harris at RT..expected that during the year last year.
Just when I think Nolan's had it with Harris he goes and has a good game.
Regardless, Joe Staley, hopefully, passes up both Snyder and Harris. (Snyder can play both guard and tackle, and likely will take over at LG once Allen hangs it up, which I hope isn't for a while.)

You’re returning over 70% of your starters on both sides of the ball from last year and your telling me the results from last year are irrelevant? Come on.

What I'm saying is when you give a qb all day to throw the ball AND you have a weak CB and a subpar SS, teams continue to move the ball.
What's key is now we have some depth, which we've not had for a loooong while.

Gerald Hayes is the MLB in the 4-3 and strongside ILB in the 3-4. A little difficult to compare them because of their responsibilities.

But I would take Hayes over both the 49ers ILB's. Espically over Smith who is entering his 12th year and on the downside of his career.


No way is Brandon Moore better than Karlos Dansby. Look for yourself:

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/492918

I think you have Gerald Hayes and Karlos Dansby confused?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/playersort/NFC/LB-TACKLES/2006/regular
92 tackles for Moore compared to 80 for Dansby..however, it appears they're closer in ability than I thought, considering Dansby missed two games.

He is a OLB/DE hybrid player. Can play with his hand down or standing up as an OLB.

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/133380

We blew it letting Okeafor go a few years ago.

Well, yeah, it's a pretty big deal isn't it?

My point is: Arizona's LB core > SF LB core.

The D-linemen in the 3-4 don't generate the pass rush. That comes from the backers which is why they are important. And based on the fact that not one of your LB's can generate a legit pass rush, I would consider that a big deal.

that's why we drafted who we did.
We've gotten better each year, for last 3 years.
I expect that trend to continue this next year.

Our defense was bad last year. That's why we concentrated on mainly defense this offseason. We were 26th in the NFL on defense. Arizona was 29th. I think we both have some areas to improve..don't you?
The 49ers were last in points per game with 25.8. They also gave up more yds per game than the Cardinals.

So I'm really not sure what you are basing that ranking on?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFC/DEF-TOTAL/2006/regular?sort_col_1=4&_1:col_1=4
We gave up 344, Cards gave up 349.

All of our draft picks" are not expected to start.
Then what is the point of bring up the number of picks from the 'A' grade draft class?

Said "all" of our draft picks aren't expected to start. Ideally it's best none HAVE to start, but we will probably throw in a couple before they're ready, by no choice.

Who are you talking about? Who we're expecting to start are FA signings, and some draft picks will vie for starting positions. Of course, on that same note..lol...didn't you just sign a lineman that is expected to start? Now THAT is a recipe for disaster, if you ask me.
It could be worse, we could be looking at starting Kwame Harris or a raw Joe Staley at RT.

lol...sounds like the same rickety boat to me.
Actually, while Harris is not the best, he's not the worst, and not an unknown.
You actually would rather have Levi Brown out there starting, instead of Kwame Harris?
It's not just that Harris got better last year (yeah, I know, had for him to get worse) but Levi Brown has some of the same problems your departed tackle had, which is excessive false start penalties.

Based on current trends it more looks like 6-0 to me!

Me thinks an overall 6-5 lead will happen in Sept.

I'm sure we'll disagree on which team holds that lead

 

[Skkorpion]

Okay. Thread closed. Enough 49er crap.