Fakers at Suns 7:00 FSN AZ and ESPN

[Louis]

My two cents:

1. No defender in the NBA would've stopped Kobe tonight.

2. More PT for Strawberry. Please!

3. Moving Marion had made a dramatic (albeit positive) impact on Amare.

4. Suns need a reliable shooter more than they need a wing defender.

 

[Kody Rumin]

I liked what I saw out there. It's tough to take a loss, but it was as bittersweet of a loss as it gets, because Shaq looked pretty good out there. It was nice seeing a few offensive boards for once!

I haven't read through all this thread since I don't have an entire day to kill, but I hope people aren't overreacting to one loss. For people who have played basketball, you know there is a difference to playing with the same guys every day, and playing with a new guy who changes your game up a lot. It takes a few games to adjust to it. Overall though, I'm happy with what I saw.

 

[nashman]

Its the first game for Shaq, if anyone honestly thinks he knows the system already thats just silly. They played well and will only get better as he and the Suns learn to play together a little more. And as someone said earlier Kobe hit alot of contested shots, tough shots that good defense was played on. The Lakers are playing well and have been in their groove, the Suns were basically coming back from a week without playing AND incorporating a new player. If anything Lakers fans should be concerned that we almost beat them in this situation. Its really to bad this last matchup didn't come a few weeks from now when Shaq actually knows what hes doing out there. The Suns are gonna be fine and should be a very exciting rest of the season and playoff run, with a little luck health wise we have a legitimate title shot this year, and that alone is worth being excited about. I love the toughness Shaq brings a little attitude and some hard fouls is what this team needed, and I think its only gonna get better.

 

[D-Dogg]

If anything Lakers fans should be concerned that we almost beat them in this situation.

No. I thought we'd lose the game because the matchups were in your favor. I also said Amare was going to go off (he did).

But we have both Bynum and Ariza on the shelf...Bynum for defense, rebounding and fixing the matchup issues and Ariza for defense and spacing.

I fully expected a loss...b2b game on the road in a hyped up building with nobody to match up with Amare. I'm very happy with the win.

 

[elindholm]

You're the second Laker fan who has made a big deal about Ariza's defense. I don't recall his ever having that reputation before. I guess now that Brown is gone, you need someone to fill the role of "marginal Laker contributor whose defense all fans must over-hype for no reason."

I'll give you the spacing issue, of course.

 

[Ode to Ocho]

You're the second Laker fan who has made a big deal about Ariza's defense. I don't recall his ever having that reputation before. I guess now that Brown is gone, you need someone to fill the role of "marginal Laker contributor whose defense all fans must over-hype for no reason."

So I'm guessing you don't watch basketball? Ariza is a fantastic defender, with ridiculous length, speed and height. It's not like he completely shut down Allen Iverson in the 4th quarter after AI dropped 50 in the first 3 quarters against Fisher/Farmar. Oh, wait, Ariza did do that.

 

[Chaplin]

So I'm guessing you don't watch basketball? Ariza is a fantastic defender, with ridiculous length, speed and height. It's not like he completely shut down Allen Iverson in the 4th quarter after AI dropped 50 in the first 3 quarters against Fisher/Farmar. Oh, wait, Ariza did do that.

Overrating your own players? We're all guilty of that, and the above post just proves that point.

 

[D-Dogg]

You're the second Laker fan who has made a big deal about Ariza's defense. I don't recall his ever having that reputation before. I guess now that Brown is gone, you need someone to fill the role of "marginal Laker contributor whose defense all fans must over-hype for no reason."

I'll give you the spacing issue, of course.

huh? that's one of his major points. Especially team defense and attacking passing lanes.


Phil:

“He’s a 6-8 athletic, active guy,” Lakers coach Phil Jackson said before their game against the Indiana Pacers. “His specialty is probably defense. He’s an all-around player, but defensively, with the athleticism — he’s tough.”

Orlando paper:

Remember Trevor Ariza?

Remember how last season he was a slashing, athletic forward who could change games with his hustle, defense and rebounding?

An Ariza chat transcript when he was in orlando:

Josh (Fla): Trevor your defense has always been intense. Where did you learn it and do you model your defensive play afer anyone in particualr?

Trevor Ariza: I learned how to play defense in high school from coach Ed Azeam at West Chester High School. At any level you go to defense is going to keep you on the court, so I just took that to heart.

 

[Ode to Ocho]

No. I thought we'd lose the game because the matchups were in your favor. I also said Amare was going to go off (he did).

But we have both Bynum and Ariza on the shelf...Bynum for defense, rebounding and fixing the matchup issues and Ariza for defense and spacing.

I fully expected a loss...b2b game on the road in a hyped up building with nobody to match up with Amare. I'm very happy with the win.

Yeah Amare KILLED the Lakers on the boards. Shaq's fat butt can't really be ignored in the paint which allowed Amare to crash the boards pretty hard.

But I'm not concerned about the points Amare put up. He only shot 13/24 (which is about 8% lower than his season FG%) and only shot 3/8 when Gasol was guarding him. If/when Bynum comes, those rebounding issues will be resolved.

Personally, I expected the Lakers to win this game. The hype was unreal and there was no way Kobe was going to lose a game like this on national TV. The whole 'back to back' excuse is just that, an excuse. The Lakers had 6 days rest over the break. Phoenix is only about an hour flight from LA and the starters sat the 4th quarter against Atlanta. The Lakers had absolultely no reason to be tired against Phoenix.

 

[Ode to Ocho]

Overrating your own players? We're all guilty of that, and the above post just proves that point.

How am I overrating Ariza again? Do you want the video of him shutting down Allen Iverson in the 4th quarter this season?

 

[D-Dogg]

Overrating your own players? We're all guilty of that, and the above post just proves that point.

Underrating other team's players? We're all guilty of that, and the above post just proves that point.





Really though, Ariza did exactly what the dude said...he and Kobe combined to lock down AI after AI went off most of the game.

Ariza isn't a great 1 on 1 defender, but he is a disruptive force in team defense and simply kills passing lanes. He's very athletic and can show and recover well, and has good length (not like Tayshaun Prince, but good).

His primary attributes are defense and slashing.

 

[Chaplin]

Underrating other team's players? We're all guilty of that, and the above post just proves that point.





Really though, Ariza did exactly what the dude said...he and Kobe combined to lock down AI after AI went off most of the game.

Ariza isn't a great 1 on 1 defender, but he is a disruptive force in team defense and simply kills passing lanes. He's very athletic and can show and recover well, and has good length (not like Tayshaun Prince, but good).

His primary attributes are defense and slashing.

1 GAME? You're basing your entire argument on some defense he played on Allen "Turnover Machine" Iverson? Tell me you have more than that. Maurice Evans had more pedigree as a lock-down defender than Ariza does right now. He's a decent player, but he's not some great 1st-team defender like you're making him out to be. He's Trenton Hassell.

You Laker fans--unbelievable.

 

[D-Dogg]

1 GAME? You're basing your entire argument on some defense he played on Allen "Turnover Machine" Iverson? Tell me you have more than that. Maurice Evans had more pedigree as a lock-down defender than Ariza does right now. He's a decent player, but he's not some great 1st-team defender like you're making him out to be. He's Trenton Hassell.

You Laker fans--unbelievable.

No, I base it off of every game I've seen him play thus far and he's FAR better than Mo Evans on defense.

I also didn't say he was a lock-down defender, did I? I only mentioned that he (and Kobe) shut down AI. Ariza's team defense and disruptive activity in the passing lanes is something I value very highly.

You also don't get 1st team defender playing 16 minutes a game as a team defender type of player. But he's damn good at defending. Better than Mo or that slob Cook we traded to get him.

 

[Folster]

Yeah Amare KILLED the Lakers on the boards. Shaq's fat butt can't really be ignored in the paint which allowed Amare to crash the boards pretty hard.

But I'm not concerned about the points Amare put up. He only shot 13/24 (which is about 8% lower than his season FG%) and only shot 3/8 when Gasol was guarding him. If/when Bynum comes, those rebounding issues will be resolved.

Personally, I expected the Lakers to win this game. The hype was unreal and there was no way Kobe was going to lose a game like this on national TV. The whole 'back to back' excuse is just that, an excuse. The Lakers had 6 days rest over the break. Phoenix is only about an hour flight from LA and the starters sat the 4th quarter against Atlanta. The Lakers had absolultely no reason to be tired against Phoenix.

I'm glad you used if. A lot of Laker fans assume that he will return and be back at the top of his game. First of all, he had a fairly serious knee injury. It was announced last night that he is just barely going to start running in the pool in the coming weeks. He was first expected to be back at the end of March, now I hear that has been pushed back until early April. If early April holds true, then that only gives him a handful of games. It by no means is a given that Bynum will return and automatically be back to his double double form.

 

[Ode to Ocho]

1 GAME? You're basing your entire argument on some defense he played on Allen "Turnover Machine" Iverson?

"Turnover Machine" is one of the best scorers in the history of the NBA. But no, nobody is basing the argument off one game, it was just empirical evidence of what Ariza is capable of.

Tell me you have more than that. Maurice Evans had more pedigree as a lock-down defender than Ariza does right now.

Haha. Maybe you should watch a basketball game that doesn't involve the Phoenix Suns. I think their lack of defense is skewing your perception or something. Mo Evans? Hahahah.

He's a decent player, but he's not some great 1st-team defender like you're making him out to be. He's Trenton Hassell.

Ariza is a decent player with ridiculous defensive ability. He's only 22. No one said anything about 1st-Team defense either.

You Laker fans--unbelievable.

Pot meet kettle.

 

[DeAnna]

Shaq is a fan-effing-tastic passer.

Something I don't think he ever got credit for...really great passer.

Really? I counted 3 bad passes for turnovers.

 

[D-Dogg]

Really? I counted 3 bad passes for turnovers.

Really. I will clarify though, low post passer. He's no magic johnson passing on the break...but he knows how to hit cutters and pop the double team like few big men can. If he still has that skill, you'll fall in love with it.

Since Bynum is almost as good passing, I don't miss it so much.

 

[jbeecham]

Really. I will clarify though, low post passer. He's no magic johnson passing on the break...but he knows how to hit cutters and pop the double team like few big men can. If he still has that skill, you'll fall in love with it.

Since Bynum is almost as good passing, I don't miss it so much.

Shaq had 2 nice low post passes last night. One to Barbosa for a layup and another to Diaw. At least 2 of his 3 turnovers came on outlet passes and that'll improve as he gets more familiar with his teammates. It also would've helped if Barbosa would've come back for the ball instead of sprinting down court when he was the only PG in the game. I'm sure Shaq will learn that when Nash is out, he's better off making the outlet pass to Hill or Diaw if LB starts sprinting.

 

[nashman]

Its funny no one seems to point out the Lakers played one of their best games of the season, and the Suns didn't even play that well. Raja had 0, Barbosa was off for the most part, and Diaw just sucked last night. We played average at best and they played one of their best games and barely beat us. Call me an optimist but we have way more room to improve than the lakers do.

 

[jbeecham]

We have a lot of room to improve, but so do the Lakers if they get Bynum back. I don't think they'll become more efficient offensively than they were last night, but Bynum will give them a different look and he should be able to grab more rebounds than Pu Gas (3) did last night. It'll also make the Lakers harder to defend in the paint and possibly get us into more foul trouble.

The Suns kept the game as close as they did because they weren't giving up as many 2nd chance points like they used to. We also had 9 more offensive rebounds, although somehow we only took 1 more shot than the Lakers.....which is confusing to me.

 

[D-Dogg]

Its funny no one seems to point out the Lakers played one of their best games of the season, and the Suns didn't even play that well. Raja had 0, Barbosa was off for the most part, and Diaw just sucked last night. We played average at best and they played one of their best games and barely beat us. Call me an optimist but we have way more room to improve than the lakers do.

No, you didn't play average at best. Nash, Amare and Hill were lights out.

The Lakers defense was terrible, and rebounding was poor..that improves when Bynum and Ariza return.

 

[jbeecham]

No, you didn't play average at best. Nash, Amare and Hill were lights out.

The Lakers defense was terrible, and rebounding was poor..that improves when Bynum and Ariza return.

13-24 for Amare is an average game for him. He's had a lot of games over the last month where he'll go 11-14 or something similar. I think Amare would admit there were 4-5 shots that he normally would make that just didn't go in last night. Nash was 9-17, not exactly lights out either, but pretty good. Grant Hill had a great 1st half, but kind of disappeared in the 2nd half....still 8-13 overall is excellent from him. Diaw & Barbosa both shot under 50% and our team shot well below our average from 3pt land 5-16 for 31%.....usually were around 38% or better.

 

[D-Dogg]

13-24 for Amare is an average game for him.

Those rebounds weren't. Nor those blocks...he and Shaq were block partying all night.

 

[jbeecham]

Actually Amare is averaging 2.3 blocks per game this year so 3 blocks isn't that uncommon for him, he's had games with 4-6 blocks this year. His rebounding was better than normal and he has had some good rebounding games since Marion was traded......Shaq was also a factor in him getting those rebounds. He also played 42 minutes last night, which is a lot higher than his 33mpg average this season.

 

[D-Dogg]

Actually Amare is averaging 2.3 blocks per game this year so 3 blocks isn't that uncommon for him, he's had games with 4-6 blocks this year. His rebounding was better than normal and he has had some good rebounding games since Marion was traded......Shaq was also a factor in him getting those rebounds. He also played 42 minutes last night, which is a lot higher than his 33mpg average this season.

Didn't realize his blocks were that high.

That is a HUGE minutes addition, but he's young and can roll with it. As I figured, he was a monster last night.