Final draft thoughts

[football karma]

I have been really warming up to a Collins / Simmons 10 year combo. That Could...... I REPEAT COULD...... Look a lot like a 6'5" more athletic version of Wagner and Chancellor.

i get that ILB is a lower value position

but i also think much of the Seahawks defensive excellence of a few years past was in large part due to Bobby Wagner and KJ Wright playing three downs all the time and not having to compromise between pass D and run D.

i also think that in the NFC West where the three other teams offenses are run-oriented with play action off of that mean you need three down LBs with speed and range

 

[DVontel]

i get that ILB is a lower value position

but i also think much of the Seahawks defensive excellence of a few years past was in large part due to Bobby Wagner and KJ Wright playing three downs all the time and not having to compromise between pass D and run D.

i also think that in the NFC West where the three other teams offenses are run-oriented with play action off of that mean you need three down LBs with speed and range

I would say having arguably the best CB in the league, best safety, & another great safety had more to do with that.
Funny thing is, Wagner & Wright still played at a high level after the LOB departures, but their defense turned into a mess. Why? Because a lack of good CB & EDGE play. Which are instrumental to top defenses than off-ball LBs are.

 

[Cheesebeef]

No it's not bad at all. As I said I like Pugh. But that's why I find it hard to get excited about him. I see a high floor, low ceiling guy like Pugh.

at this point, Keim adding a Pugh-level player in the first round would be like hitting a home run. Sadly.

 

[DVontel]

Guys like Fred Warner & Bobby Wagner weren’t first rounders either.

Please let’s not reach for a ILB in back-to-back years. Please God.

 

[Chopper0080]

i get that ILB is a lower value position

but i also think much of the Seahawks defensive excellence of a few years past was in large part due to Bobby Wagner and KJ Wright playing three downs all the time and not having to compromise between pass D and run D.

i also think that in the NFC West where the three other teams offenses are run-oriented with play action off of that mean you need three down LBs with speed and range

I am just going to put this out there and people can do with it what they will.

We drafted a position-less player with tremendous athleticism in Isaiah Simmons last year and it was a struggle for him to fit in the defense and with Vance's vision.

Now we are discussing an off-ball LB from a 3-3 defense and installing him at either ILB in a 3-4 or EDGE in a 3-4 under the same DC who struggled with Simmons.

I feel some deja vu to last year. Love the player, but am very worried about the fit.

 

[DVontel]

Picking Collins over AVT would just be Simmons over Wirfs all over again.

 

[Chopper0080]

Best case scenario for me in rounds 1 and 2.

1 - Jaylen Waddle WR Alabama
2 - Payton Turner EDGE Houston

 

[BritCard]

I am just going to put this out there and people can do with it what they will.

We drafted a position-less player with tremendous athleticism in Isaiah Simmons last year and it was a struggle for him to fit in the defense and with Vance's vision.

Now we are discussing an off-ball LB from a 3-3 defense and installing him at either ILB in a 3-4 or EDGE in a 3-4 under the same DC who struggled with Simmons.

I feel some deja vu to last year. Love the player, but am very worried about the fit.

I'm not worried about the fit. Less so than Simmons anyway. You will recall my long threads about Simmons pre draft and how he didn't have the experience or instincts at ILB to play right away. I still think he would be a better SS than an ILB.

I don't see that with Collins. He had 51 snaps as a pass rusher, 216 as a gap filling MLB and 197 snaps in coverage last year. I think he will be ok either way.

 

[cardncubfan]

I suspect that the CARDS have a few post-draft deals close to worked out.

CB and DL would not surprise me:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/cornerback/available/

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/defensive-tackle/available/

We could bring back Justin Bethel & Josh Mauro & reminisce about the good old days.

 

[QuebecCard]

The dude is a dude. It's way too safe for that position with our depth both inside and out. You draft dudes like him in Round 2 to 4.



This is brilliant. I wish I would have thought of it. And I agree.

At 16, I would go for more upside IMO.

Who offers that? Collins, Parsons, Smith, Waddle, Farley, Horn, and like 5 others that could still be available.

And I would again reiterate that we really need a corner. If we don't get one in round one....... we better be angling to trade up in round 2 because the entire league will see a CB pick coming from us if we don't already have one.

I'm all for CB but people thinking that any available at #16 are plug-and-play are IMO kiddin' themselves.

There are no PP21 talents in this draft. We at best are getting a DRC who was selected at #16 and took half a season to settle in our pass defence and screwed up in coverage in the Super Bowl.

 

[QuebecCard]

We could bring back Justin Bethel & Josh Mauro & reminisce about the good old days.

And we can put aside nostalgia and do better.

 

[QuebecCard]

Picking Collins over AVT would just be Simmons over Wirfs all over again.

Yes and we made the right call last year.

 

[cardncubfan]

A player I am not counting on but would love in round 2 is Quinn Meinerz OL. Interior guy who can play OG or C. Nasty and tough. Very resilient. Could sit a year if needed and it would be fine.

+1

He's one of my favorite players in this draft.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Picking Collins over AVT would just be Simmons over Wirfs all over again.

You place AVT at wirfs level?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Best case scenario for me in rounds 1 and 2.

1 - Jaylen Waddle WR Alabama
2 - Payton Turner EDGE Houston

Congrats. A name (turner) I’ve not even heard yet this offseason.

 

[DVontel]

You place AVT at wirfs level?

Yea I think AVT will be elite/at least great at G.

 

[Chopper0080]

Congrats. A name (turner) I’ve not even heard yet this offseason.

He was in the Jordan Smith area of EDGE players that I like to wait to get some official numbers on. Nice player and looked good at the Senior Bowl. Has kinda checked all of the boxes. I prefer long-limbed EDGE players and I think he could be a nice option with Jones and Golden.