Fitz restructures contract

TJ

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Regular season



Career games: Fitzgerald 156, Boldin 156



Receptions: Fitzgerald 846, Boldin 857



Receiving Yards: Fitzgerald 11,367, Boldin 11,344



TD’s: Fitzgerald 87, Boldin 67



Postseason



Games: Boldin 14, Fitzgerald 6



Receptions: Boldin 63, Fitzgerald 42



Receiving Yards: Boldin 980, Fitzgerald 705



TD’s: Boldin 7, Fitzgerald 9



Yeah, pretty smart to pay double for ostensibly the same production!


I expected a fairly limited response from you, something you accused Bucky of earlier.

I know with Fitz, I can work with him on reducing that number and not compromise the image of the franchise. I can probably reduce that to 12, and using your perspective of the situation, that would be more palatable.

As far as the explanations for his productions that you quickly glossed over and called, "excuses," they are anything but. That's reality. Reread my post. If you still think I'm making excuses, then I don't blame you for not having watched a single snap of Cardinal football in four years.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Amazing that fitz's 6 games are almost as good as Boldins 14 games. Didnt expect that

That postseason was the best I can ever remember for a WR - too bad he hasn't shown anything like that since then. It's looking more and more like an aberration. Fitz is an excellent player, but the deification is based on reputation alone at this point.
 

PDXChris

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Regular season

Career games: Fitzgerald 156, Boldin 156

Receptions: Fitzgerald 846, Boldin 857

Receiving Yards: Fitzgerald 11,367, Boldin 11,344

TD’s: Fitzgerald 87, Boldin 67

Postseason

Games: Boldin 14, Fitzgerald 6

Receptions: Boldin 63, Fitzgerald 42

Receiving Yards: Boldin 980, Fitzgerald 705

TD’s: Boldin 7, Fitzgerald 9

Yeah, pretty smart to pay double for ostensibly the same production!

Three years that Boldin was in Baltimore, so all other years they had the same QB. Also leave out last since they both have decent enough QB's.

Boldin's QB
------------
Joe Flacco

Fitz's QBs
------------
Derek Anderson
John Skelton
Max Hall
Kevin Kolb
Richard Bartel
Ryan Lindley
Brian Hoyer



Year Tm G Rec Yds TD
2010 BAL 16 64 837 7
2011 BAL 14 57 887 3
2012 BAL 15 65 921 4
G Rec Yds TD
Totals 45 186 2645 14

Year Tm G Rec Yds TD
2010 ARI 16 90 1137 6
2011 ARI 16 80 1411 8
2012 ARI 16 71 798 4
G Rec Yds TD
Totals 48 241 3346 18


Enough said. Also, Larry have been in the leauge a year less and is three years younger.
 

Brian in Mesa

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Regular season

Career games: Fitzgerald 156, Boldin 156

Receptions: Fitzgerald 846, Boldin 857

Receiving Yards: Fitzgerald 11,367, Boldin 11,344

TD’s: Fitzgerald 87, Boldin 67

Postseason

Games: Boldin 14, Fitzgerald 6

Receptions: Boldin 63, Fitzgerald 42

Receiving Yards: Boldin 980, Fitzgerald 705

TD’s: Boldin 7, Fitzgerald 9

Yeah, pretty smart to pay double for ostensibly the same production!

Welcome to last year:

Fitz vs. Anquan - career stats (very interesting)

Here is what I said in that thread -

Heard Sando or some other expert talking about this recently and he said that Fitz has half as many drops as Q does and nearly half as many fumbles too. I'd have to look up their stats to double check, but the expert said since they have kept a stat for drops - there is a huge difference between the two. Basically, he said Fitz doesn't often drop it if he gets his hands on it.
 

ASUCHRIS

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I expected a fairly limited response from you, something you accused Bucky of earlier.

Because I can accept the reality of the situation when you just spew excuses and nonsense. Fitz ain't worth a 20 million dollar cap hit, and anyone who knows anything about football knows this. You can make any number of excuses about his production, but in the end, results are what matters.

He's not a top 5 WR anymore, maybe not even top 10. His contract is hanging over the franchise like a storm cloud, and we've pushed the problem a year out and made it worse. Forgive me for not busting out the party hats!

I know with Fitz, I can work with him on reducing that number and not compromise the image of the franchise. I can probably reduce that to 12, and using your perspective of the situation, that would be more palatable.

A cap number of 12 million for Fitz would at least be somewhat reasonable, but I'd love for you to look at his contract numbers moving forward and let me know how that can be accomplished.


As far as the explanations for his productions that you quickly glossed over and called, "excuses," they are anything but. That's reality.

Sure buddy...reasons for lack of production (which Cheese so nicely obliterated) are not excuses. Perhaps you should look up the definition of excuse?


Reread my post. If you still think I'm making excuses, then I don't blame you for not having watched a single snap of Cardinal football in four years.

Hot sports take bro! You're right, I haven't watched any Cards football in four years. I see an aging receiver who gets a lot of targets but rarely gets separation. A player who is more respected for who he is than what he does at this point. A guy who has bent the Cards over at every point in negotiations and a guy who probably won't even be considered the best receiver on his team after the next season.

The good news is he's scheduled to have around 20 million a year cap hits moving forward, so we can look forward to his contract holding the team hostage every year until his contract expires!
 

ASUCHRIS

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Three years that Boldin was in Baltimore, so all other years they had the same QB. Also leave out last since they both have decent enough QB's.

Boldin's QB
------------
Joe Flacco

Fitz's QBs
------------
Derek Anderson
John Skelton
Max Hall
Kevin Kolb
Richard Bartel
Ryan Lindley
Brian Hoyer



Year Tm G Rec Yds TD
2010 BAL 16 64 837 7
2011 BAL 14 57 887 3
2012 BAL 15 65 921 4
G Rec Yds TD
Totals 45 186 2645 14

Year Tm G Rec Yds TD
2010 ARI 16 90 1137 6
2011 ARI 16 80 1411 8
2012 ARI 16 71 798 4
G Rec Yds TD
Totals 48 241 3346 18


Enough said. Also, Larry have been in the leauge a year less and is three years younger.

PLEASE stop trotting out the QB excuses - Anquan put up great numbers with Jeff Blake and Josh McCown. How convenient you want to throw out last year, where Anquan had 200 more yards than Fitz.

You also fail to mention targets:

2010-
Fitz - 174
Boldin - 108!

2011-
Fitz - 153
Boldin - 105

2012 -
Fitz - 153
Boldin - 112

The Cards were force feeding Fitz to appease him, and while it helped his individual #'s, it obviously didn't help the team. For what Fitz was being paid, you could have had Anquan and another star.

Glad so many of you are thrilled to pay twice as much for essentially the same production!
 

TJ

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Because I can accept the reality of the situation when you just spew excuses and nonsense. Fitz ain't worth a 20 million dollar cap hit, and anyone who knows anything about football knows this. You can make any number of excuses about his production, but in the end, results are what matters.



He's not a top 5 WR anymore, maybe not even top 10. His contract is hanging over the franchise like a storm cloud, and we've pushed the problem a year out and made it worse. Forgive me for not busting out the party hats!







A cap number of 12 million for Fitz would at least be somewhat reasonable, but I'd love for you to look at his contract numbers moving forward and let me know how that can be accomplished.









Sure buddy...reasons for lack of production (which Cheese so nicely obliterated) are not excuses. Perhaps you should look up the definition of excuse?









Hot sports take bro! You're right, I haven't watched any Cards football in four years. I see an aging receiver who gets a lot of targets but rarely gets separation. A player who is more respected for who he is than what he does at this point. A guy who has bent the Cards over at every point in negotiations and a guy who probably won't even be considered the best receiver on his team after the next season.



The good news is he's scheduled to have around 20 million a year cap hits moving forward, so we can look forward to his contract holding the team hostage every year until his contract expires!


Ugh. The basis of this response is I'm making excuses. You're right. QBs throwing uncatchable passes is an excuse. That's like me saying I should be able to drive to work even though my car has two flat tires. Maybe my boss would accept that "excuse."

BTW--enough of people saying Fitz is "bending the club over a barrel." One hell of an inaccurate embellishment. He's not giving any godfather ultimatums. Instead, he's been more than willing to work with the club in an amiable fashion to make his contract situation easier. If he were threatening to hold out or request a trade; then that's a different story.
 

PDXChris

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PLEASE stop trotting out the QB excuses - Anquan put up great numbers with Jeff Blake and Josh McCown. How convenient you want to throw out last year, where Anquan had 200 more yards than Fitz.

You also fail to mention targets:

2010-
Fitz - 174
Boldin - 108!

2011-
Fitz - 153
Boldin - 105

2012 -
Fitz - 153
Boldin - 112

The Cards were force feeding Fitz to appease him, and while it helped his individual #'s, it obviously didn't help the team. For what Fitz was being paid, you could have had Anquan and another star.

Glad so many of you are thrilled to pay twice as much for essentially the same production!

Jeff Blake and Josh McCown are better than all of the QB's I listed. It is alright though, I am good with Larry and EVERYTHING he brings. You can have Q and his ME attitude.
 

PDXChris

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Ugh. The basis of this response is I'm making excuses. You're right. QBs throwing uncatchable passes is an excuse. That's like me saying I should be able to drive to work even though my car has two flat tires. Maybe my boss would accept that "excuse."

BTW--enough of people saying Fitz is "bending the club over a barrel." One hell of an inaccurate embellishment. He's not giving any godfather ultimatums. Instead, he's been more than willing to work with the club in an amiable fashion to make his contract situation easier. If he were threatening to hold out or request a trade; then that's a different story.

:thumbup:
 

TJ

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Jeff Blake and Josh McCown are better than all of the QB's I listed. It is alright though, I am good with Larry and EVERYTHING he brings. You can have Q and his ME attitude.


100%

I'll add--Fitz played with McCown, as well.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Ugh. The basis of this response is I'm making excuses. You're right. QBs throwing uncatchable passes is an excuse. That's like me saying I should be able to drive to work even though my car has two flat tires. Maybe my boss would accept that "excuse."

TJ - will you at least recognize the "possibility" that a WR can put up decent #'s with bad QB's? Would you say Josh Gordon had a tough QB situation this last season?

Would you say that Fitz should put up more than 950 yards with at least a mediocre QB? There were 24 WR's that put up more than 1k yards...do you think they all have great QB's?

BTW--enough of people saying Fitz is "bending the club over a barrel." One hell of an inaccurate embellishment. He's not giving any godfather ultimatums. Instead, he's been more than willing to work with the club in an amiable fashion to make his contract situation easier. If he were threatening to hold out or request a trade; then that's a different story.

TJ - come on...it's easy not to make a stink when you get godfather deals every time!!! Look at the amount of money Fitz has made with the Cards, how he's been able to get no trade clauses and top dollar every single time! Work with the club in an amiable fashion - "hey Fitz, would you rather have your money right now, or during the season?" What a martyr! It's easy to be a good sport when you get everything you want.
 

ASUCHRIS

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Jeff Blake and Josh McCown are better than all of the QB's I listed. It is alright though, I am good with Larry and EVERYTHING he brings. You can have Q and his ME attitude.

Nice of you to conveniently ignore everything else and focus on which crappy qb's were crappier. No surprise you refuse to address anything else, nothing to stand on.

Yeah, all the nebulous benefits Fitz brings, like...oh yeah, intangibles. Let's pay double the market rate for intangibles and leadership!

Q and his me attitude were obviously very negative the last couple years, taking the Ravens to a championship, and nearly leading the Niners to the Super Bowl, and another championship.

The branding of Q as a me player is somewhere beyond idiotic.
 

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I'll add--Fitz played with McCown, as well.

this kind of goes against your point doesn't it, considering that when he did play with McCown (who sucked), he put up big numbers?

And while playing with the hodge-podge of crap in 2010 and 2011, he still averaged 1300 yards and 7 TDs. And looked like Larry doing it, especially that 2011 season where he somehow had 1400 yards!

Meanwhile, in the next two years, playing with a hodge-podge of crap in 2012 and a QB who put up 4000 yards in 2013, he averaged 870 yards and 7 TDs, while very rarely looking like the guy we've watched previously, no matter who was QB.

What I can't figure out is how you guys are failing to recognize that Larry, in his prime, like all truly dominant WRs was able to produce at high levels no matter who was throwing him the ball. that certainly hasn't happened the last two years and yes, some of that had to do with the QB (at least in 2012), but Larry just didn't look like Larry, making the incredible happen on a regular basis, which is what has almost always elevated him above other WRs.
 

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That postseason was the best I can ever remember for a WR - too bad he hasn't shown anything like that since then. It's looking more and more like an aberration. Fitz is an excellent player, but the deification is based on reputation alone at this point.


I love both WRs.

Dont have a bad thing to say about either one.

Think they are equally excellent in their own ways.

JMHO
 

Shane

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I love both WRs.

Dont have a bad thing to say about either one.

Think they are equally excellent in their own ways.

JMHO

Perfectly stated and how I feel!
 

TJ

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I love both WRs.

Dont have a bad thing to say about either one.

Think they are equally excellent in their own ways.

JMHO

I appreciated Boldin when he was here, but his passive-aggressiveness rubbed me the wrong way. We did the right thing in trading him. If we were to re-sign him, I'd be more than happy to do so, but I think there is still some mutual disdain for one another.
 

BigRedRage

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I appreciated Boldin when he was here, but his passive-aggressiveness rubbed me the wrong way. We did the right thing in trading him. If we were to re-sign him, I'd be more than happy to do so, but I think there is still some mutual disdain for one another.


I couldnt car eless about his contract issues he had here. Boldin as a football player only: love the guy.
 

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Breaking News: Peterson and Floyd will be playing on new teams in 2015

What does this have to do with Adrian Peterson and Malcolm Floyd? Thanks for you odd prediction though.

Unless you are talking about our players, then you are way off since Michael Floyd is under contract through 2015 and Patrick Peterson will just be franchised if he does not have a new deal.
 
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I actually agree with TJ up to a point. I'd like to get into the "excuses" part of it, but first I'll say that Fitz wouldn't even be worth that amount of money even if he were producing at the top of his game. WR's don't take teams to SB's. Even Jerry Rice doesn't take those teams to SB's without Montana and Young (along with all the HOFers on both offense and defense). Even Megatron with a better QB than ours doesn't take his team to the SB. It just doesn't happen.

What I really wanted to look at was the so-called excuses people make for his lack of production last year. I'm only talking about this past year, if ya'll want to keep arguing about QB's that's another argument entirely (and further enhances the point that no WR in history is worth that kind of money). I don't think Fitz had hammy or lack of separation issues because of age. For one thing, as Duckjake continually points out, Fitz is relatively slow and has always been relatively slow. Even with Warner it's not like he had uber separation in those playoffs where he smoked everyone. He was catching it in a crowd of 2 or 3 guys. That's what he does, so let's stop arguing that his age is making him slow--he's always been somewhat slow.

Regarding the hammy issues: I think that's more a product of how he was being used than an indication of age. He was running a lot more shorter, crisper-cutting routes, lining up all over the field, and cutting often-times in directions opposite to the direction he's used to cutting. Furthermore, he was blocking more than I've ever seen him block. By far. To do that you have to continually plant and basically do lunges with your hips, even on a whimpy block that isn't effective. He did both those things all year long. I'm not saying he never blocked before, but certainly not as much as he did this past year and certainly not near the line of scrimmage, around the tackles, like he did this year, many times picking up linebackers and safeties. Those two things combined--the different route trees and excessive blocking at the line of scrimmage--will wear on anyone's hammy's. I had also read his route trees had break-off points depending on the defensive scheme, sometimes breaking off upfield, sometimes continuing perpendicular to the line of scrimmage, which Fitz said was new to him (it's similar to the route tree's the Pats use in that respect). All of that combined will take a toll if you aren't used to being used that way. He still manned up and played injured and continued his blocking assignments.

Having said all that no WR is worth that kind of money, regardless of how he was playing. What I don't think is cool though, is the people who had little problem with his contract until we got decent again this past year. When he was the main guy putting butts in seats it was okay, because everyone was making bank off him, but now that he isn't the sole reason for it the contract needs to be tore up.
 

WisconsinCard

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Even if the cap makes a big jump, it still doesn't make sense to pay Fitz as a top 10 player. He's barely a top 10 receiver at this point. At a 20 million dollar plus cap hit, Fitz is simply not worth it, even if the cap goes up.

Ya I get all of that I was thinking more along the lines, if he were to retire or be cut the dead money won't hurt as much.

There is also the possibility of drafting some replacements for our "big cap" guys, which means rookie pay scale players (QB and DD) gives you more money to pay the vets. Of course that could be a pipe dream if lower tier pay guys out perform their contracts a la PP21.
 

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can't DD just redo his contract? why so much talk about replacing him all of the time? There are other options beyond getting rid of a player. The guy still plays very well, is a team captain and has become a bonafide leader within the locker room. He is part of all the culture change that happened here and still at worst above average at his position.

But I am a DD fan. I dont want him to go until he is no longer playing at a high level. I imagine he has zero interest in leaving as well. I bet if his contract is becoming an issue, he will fix it.
 

WildBB

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can't DD just redo his contract? why so much talk about replacing him all of the time? There are other options beyond getting rid of a player. The guy still plays very well, is a team captain and has become a bonafide leader within the locker room. He is part of all the culture change that happened here and still at worst above average at his position.

But I am a DD fan. I dont want him to go until he is no longer playing at a high level. I imagine he has zero interest in leaving as well. I bet if his contract is becoming an issue, he will fix it.

I think most of them are of the opinion they've earned what they got.

It's rare to have athletes give up $$.

That said the NFL is a little different in that the owners have an out, unlike baseball. Texas is still paying part of A. Rod's 25M yr. contract.
 
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