Game Thread: Suns vs. Grizzlies

[Yuma]

Wow, Amare still did not an assist.

Hard to get an assist when you are attacking the basket for a dunk!! Amare has been finishing plays, not starting them. Tonight he got to the line a bunch!! I don't want him passing the ball. I want him trying to finish and getting the opposing players in foul trouble like he was doing tonight.

 

[dyle_ph1]

Originally posted by Yuma
Hard to get an assist when you are attacking the basket for a dunk!! Amare has been finishing plays, not starting them. Tonight he got to the line a bunch!! I don't want him passing the ball. I want him trying to finish and getting the opposing players in foul trouble like he was doing tonight.

Eventually he needs to start passing the ball when teams double team him though. That's something that would add another dimension to his game. It's as important as developing a mid rang jumper.

 

[Yuma]

Jake Voskuhl just gets no respect for the referees. He's been absolutely hammered going to the basket on multiple occasions tonight with no call.

Speaking of that, how about that foul on the Matrix when the Memphis player tried to do a spin move, fell without being touched, and Marion got a foul call!!

 

[PhiLLmattiC]

Matrix Revolutions was hot! The rest of the suns is blah. Good win though I guess.

 

[Yuma]

Eventually he needs to start passing the ball when teams double team him though. That's something that would add another dimension to his game. It's as important as developing a mid rang jumper.

I can't remember them doubling him at all tonight. They double Marbury more than Amare, who I don't think they doubled at all. His mid range jumper, Amare's, looked better tonight.

 

[dyle_ph1]

Originally posted by PhiLLmattiC
Matrix Revolutions

I heard it sucked...but I'm still going to watch it though. I've invested too much time on the first two movies to not watch the third one

 

[PhiLLmattiC]

I think if you watched the first two u won't be disappointed.

 

[Yuma]

I think I was the only guy on the board who appreciated the philosophy in the Matrix, and the sequel. I will definatly enjoy the third one, even if everyone thinks it sucks. I am waiting for the Lord Of The Rings final episode!!! That will rock!!

 

[scotsman13]

yuma you are not the only one who is into the philosophy of the matrix, and the even more hiden philosophy of reloaded.

as far as the game. wow this was the closest i have seen to the type of basketball that got me hooked on the suns in the first place a long time ago. i really liked white, amare and marion front line. i think that is going to bring out a lot of problems with teams in time.

 

[elindholm]

Fantastic showing by White. If he continues to do something close to what he did tonight, I will very happily admit that I was wrong to criticize the Suns' last two trades. You can all call me on it; I won't object.

However -- it's only one game. I'm not going to look over 200 old Wizards box scores, but I'd guess that this is one of White's very best games in the last three years. He played with a lot of energy and confidence, and I was surprised at how well he moved. Keeping that up on a regular basis will be another matter.

But for now, I have no problem saying, "So far, so good!"

 

[PhiLLmattiC]

Darn, I was hoping we'd stick to the matrix talk. None of my friends have seen it yet.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Revolutions absolutely rocked

Reloaded focused on Nietzche. Revolutions focuses on Kharma, Buddism, and a heavy dose of Christianity.

The action scenes are some of the best ever created.

If you liked the other movies you will enjoy it.

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by elindholm
Fantastic showing by White. If he continues to do something close to what he did tonight, I will very happily admit that I was wrong to criticize the Suns' last two trades. You can all call me on it; I won't object.

However -- it's only one game. I'm not going to look over 200 old Wizards box scores, but I'd guess that this is one of White's very best games in the last three years. He played with a lot of energy and confidence, and I was surprised at how well he moved. Keeping that up on a regular basis will be another matter.

But for now, I have no problem saying, "So far, so good!"

I couldn't agree more.

 

[PhiLLmattiC]

Originally posted by Chris_Sanders
Revolutions absolutely rocked

Reloaded focused on Nietzche. Revolutions focuses on Kharma, Buddism, and a heavy dose of Christianity.

The action scenes are some of the best ever created.

If you liked the other movies you will enjoy it.

Amen.

 

[Chaplin]

One thing that is really bothering me is the crap I'm hearing about how Jake is better suited coming off the bench. That's a load. This was one of his worst games so far this season--I thought he was doing just fine as the starter.

If you want to bring him off the bench, fine, but he's played well as a starter and now he hasn't played well off the bench--I'm sick of FJ's smug attitude of how Jake is so much better off the bench. That's a load of crap, and a demotion to Jake, while outwardly he may say it's no big deal, will certainly affect his mind and his play.

 

[elindholm]

That's true -- the coaching staff's insistence that Voskuhl isn't "starter quality" is getting annoying. White did outplay him tonight, but it remains to be seen whether that will be a long-term trend.

Either way, Voskuhl doesn't seem to have been bothered by it during his time with the team, which is a credit to his attitude. And I didn't think he looked that bad tonight. He had some trouble finishing (thanks to some questionable no-calls), but he was active and had seven rebounds in only 21 minutes.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

I really don't think it has anything to do with being starter quality. It has more to do with the instant energy Jake can provide off the bench. Some players will take time to warm up, making our bench have lulls. When you have a player like Jake, who can get up and do all the these things for your second unit, it is a nice luxury.

I haven't watched Jahadi play much, but I don't think his game is as energy oriented as Jake's.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Just like last year...FJ still stands for F****** Joke.

It just drives me crazy as we are now in our third season with Frank Johnson and we STILL can't solve a zone defense.

In fact, Zone defenses only empower his stupid idea of playing Marion at PF. Do you ever get the feeling that Frank thinks this is a college team? His solution to the zone defense is to run Gonzaga's offense. 4 guys on the outside with one guy in the middle. Pass the ball back and forth on the outside.

Well except even guys in college do rub cuts in that offense.

 

[elindholm]

The Suns' general tendency to stand around on offense was not as bad as usual tonight, but it's still pretty strong. And I think that's why a zone defense is so effective against them. Most of the time, the Suns simply refuse to move without the ball. There were a couple of times late in tonight's game when they did, including against the zone, and they got good looks out of it. But, for whatever reason, the old habit is almost guaranteed to come back.

And I think it isn't going to take me long at all to get sick of Vinnie Del Negro saying, "That's great to see," every time anyone on the Suns does anything good.

 

[jbeecham]

The Suns looked like they picked up a few plays from the Jazz game and used them tonight. I remember 2-3 plays where we threw the ball into the post and had someone cut to the hoop for a quick pass and layup/dunk. I was really impressed with Jahidi's offense. His defense looks like it needs some work, but he's a big body down there and he takes up space. I think he had a tough assignment tonight in guarding Gasol because Pau is so mobile and can play outside. I think Voshkul is a better matchup for guarding Pau. I also think Voshkul shouldn't have been demoted for a guy who hadn't played a game or even had a practice with the team.

 

[Errntknght]

What was all that talk about Jahidi's stone hands... the Suns have had a half dozen centers with much worse hands than his. Hey, did you notice that Miller didn't go for any more jumpers with White in the vicinity after that block... I suppose the fact that White half came down on him was more significant than the block itself.

I agree that it was a bad, bad move by FJ to start him in place of Jake... let him earn it on the floor. Hopefully, Jake won't let it bother him or even better use it as a goad to push himself. We still need Jake to perform at his best... and White has been injured a lot so far in his career, don't forget. Let's hope that's all in the past because he's a force inside and I think the whole team will take heart from that. Imagine being beaten by your man a few times and then thinking 'jeez, if I can just herd him into Jahidi one time he'll stop wanting to get by me!' That's got to buck a guy up.

 

[Joe Mama]

Zarko would really help against those zone defenses. I am by no means an expert in the X's and O's (or players names or numbers... whatever the coach uses), but I have watched a few teams that were able to bust the zone defense.

The best thing to have against the zone is obviously a couple of guys who can shoot the ball lights out from outside. Maybe Zarko and Barbosa could do that, but we don't really know yet. The other thing that helps is taking a tall guy with long arms around the free-throw line and having him either pass the ball to slashing players (that's probably a reach with the Phoenix Suns) were shoot the ball over the zone.

Does anybody know if White has a shot outside of numeral 5 ft. from the basket?

Golden State should be a good test Monday. Eric Dampier has been a monster inside so far, and Richardson and Nick Van Exel just returned.

Joe Mama

 

[sly fly]

I'm not an FJ apologist, but every move he makes is met with criticism on this board.

THE SUNS WON THE FREAKIN GAME LAST NIGHT, GUYS!

They had the lead from start to finish, and the move to insert Jahidi White into the starting lineup paid off big-time.

Jake Voskuhl doesn't give a rat's ass if he starts. He knows he's earned minutes, and those won't go away. It was nice to see Jake NOT having to worry about his foul situation down the stretch.

Busting a zone defense isn't up to FJ. Players need to penetrate and move to the right spot. They've been taught this since junior high. As soon as Marion puts the ball on the floor instead of spotting up... it will make FJ look like a genius.

 

[sly fly]

Originally posted by Joe Mama
Zarko would really help against those zone defenses. I am by no means an expert in the X's and O's (or players names or numbers... whatever the coach uses), but I have watched a few teams that were able to bust the zone defense.

Hate to say it, but Zarko is a deer in the headlights.

Talented... Yes.

Scared... You'd better believe it.

I've seen that look before. He needs to be brought along slowly.

A 4-hour session in the weight room everyday wouldn't hurt, either.

 

[matt_whitlock]

Jake Voskuhl doesn't give a rat's ass if he starts. He knows he's earned minutes, and those won't go away. It was nice to see Jake NOT having to worry about his foul situation down the stretch.

Exactly. It sounds to me like everybody has been so conditioned by one of our shooting guards desperately wanting to start and only talking about his offense in interviews that people here think there aren't any team players left in this world. Jake Voskhul is a team player, and you need players like him to be successful in this league. Last year, we had Bo Outlaw and Jake Voskhul who could inject this team with some energy. Now, if we don't have Jake Voskhul coming off the bench, and we start off the game slow, who is going to come in and energize us? Penny Hardaway? I don't think him zombi-ishly running around the court is going to do it? Tom Gugliota? Well, he did attempt that left handed dunk last night.... but probably not. Casey Jacobsen? No, if anything the other 4 guys on the court have to play with less energy to make up for his jerky, fish-like, out-of-control movements he makes out there.

So, it's Jake Voskhul.

The good thing is, of all the people who could get upset about Jake coming off the bench, we're the only ones upset about it. Jake knows he can compete at starter quality, but he's a scrappy player who you want coming off the bench.

I think everybody here would agree that you don't want to start off a game shooting jump shots and passing the ball around the perimeter until the shot clock expires. With Jake in there, you can't really pound it downlow to him, cause he doesn't have many moves in the post. Now with Jahidi, we can really start the game off correctly. Yeah, we have Amare in there at the power forward, which is good, but now we have somebody who Amare could screen away for and still get down in the post. It helps.