Has whiz used up his good faith from the superbowl?

[Fiasco]

This poll is a Fiasco.

touche!!!

 

[Krangodnzr]

The program as a whole is losing credibility with me.

The player acquisition chain is broken; Whisenhunt's regime has had 4+ years to find some young pass rushers and they've consistently failed. Is it Whisenhunt or do we still need a front office overhaul?

I find it funny that Graves is so bullet proof in this organization. He came in during Coach Mac's regime and has not gotten any of the fallout for any of the failure.

IMO this team needs to kick Graves to the curb and bring in a GM that will take charge and run the football program and leave Whisenhunt to coaching only.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

No DC in history could fix this defense, there's just too many holes and a plethora of horrible talent that would never warrant a good product. The defensive woes come straight from the FO and Whiz, they don't seem to understand that defense is actually a part of the game, and you 'need' it to win. Would Haggans, Lenon and Porter be starting for any other team? Probably not..Yet they are supposed to be the core of the defense, especially in a 3-4 where the LB's do practically everything.

They could go a long way by not starting ex-Steeler has been's game after game.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The program as a whole is losing credibility with me.

The player acquisition chain is broken; Whisenhunt's regime has had 4+ years to find some young pass rushers and they've consistently failed. Is it Whisenhunt or do we still need a front office overhaul?

I find it funny that Graves is so bullet proof in this organization. He came in during Coach Mac's regime and has not gotten any of the fallout for any of the failure.

IMO this team needs to kick Graves to the curb and bring in a GM that will take charge and run the football program and leave Whisenhunt to coaching only.

The inherent problem with the above is that any GM worth a lick of salt is going to want his own Coach in there sooner, rather then later.

Graves should have been excommunicated after the DG fiasco. Now, I fear we ride with him until Wiz dies.

 

[Krangodnzr]

The inherent problem with the above is that any GM worth a lick of salt is going to want his own Coach in there sooner, rather then later.

Maybe. We've seen the worst of Whisenhunt (last year) and the best (almost Super Bowl win). IMO he still has never had an elite roster to work with. He's had some tools (Warner and the passing game) but we haven't been a top ten team, talent wise, since he's been here.

Look at the great teams in the league, and what you see is that they have a top notch football guy in charge. We've never had that and I'd like to see a change at the top. This won't happen without severe repercussions (losing seasonS).

Graves should have been excommunicated after the DG fiasco. Now, I fear we ride with him until Wiz dies.

Agreed. I agree, the only way Graves gets the hook is if Whisenhunt fails miserably.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Maybe. We've seen the worst of Whisenhunt (last year) and the best (almost Super Bowl win). IMO he still has never had an elite roster to work with. He's had some tools (Warner and the passing game) but we haven't been a top ten team, talent wise, since he's been here.

Look at the great teams in the league, and what you see is that they have a top notch football guy in charge. We've never had that and I'd like to see a change at the top. This won't happen without severe repercussions (losing seasonS).

I'm with you Krang, just saying it's not a likely scenario where a new GM comes in and doesn't want to mold the team in his image... and to be honest, I'm even wavering on that. The idea that Wiz solely looked at Pittsburg coordinators for defense still scares me and his never ending love affair with awful Ts and the Grimm reaper of offensive live talent... and his maddening play calling the last two seasons... yeah... I'm definitely on the fence with Wiz these days.

 

[Seandonic]

First of all, Grimm should be gone. He sucks! He can take Levi Brown out the door with him...if he can get him to actually move.

Secondly, I think it's been proven by now that most of the success of the Warner led Cardinals was due to...Warner. That thought and the one and a quarter years that have followed do not warrant the distrust of Whiz yet though (IMHO).

I believe that a team in the position that the Cards were in when Warner left needs a solid two years to rebound. I know that in this now, now, now society that is hard to swallow for many people but it's just what has to happen.

With that in mind I think the Cards are right on course to truly be contenders in 2012 (year 3 of the rebuild). All they really need to do next off-season is find through FA or the draft a LT and a 3-4 OLB. The rest of the team including the young corners, new D-coordinator, interior O-line, new QB, and young LB's will have had time to gel and grow together through a learning year (this one).

Patience is the key this year. If next year the Cards aren't a markedly improved team then Whiz should be shown the door.

 

[D-Dogg]

I'm with you Krang, just saying it's not a likely scenario where a new GM comes in and doesn't want to mold the team in his image... and to be honest, I'm even wavering on that. The idea that Wiz solely looked at Pittsburg coordinators for defense still scares me and his never ending love affair with awful Ts and the Grimm reaper of offensive live talent... and his maddening play calling the last two seasons... yeah... I'm definitely on the fence with Wiz these days.

In Whis I Guess?


(that's where I find myself a lot of the time)

 

[D-Dogg]

Whis can stay, but Grimm needs to take his fat haunches and just follow Springsteen around and get the eff off the team.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

More and more I'm believing that the superbowl had very little to do with Ken Whizenhunt and was almost entirely Warner.

Today's play calling was infuriating. Particularly abandoning the run at the end when we had a lead.


Has whiz exhausted the good faith Kurt got him by taking us to the superbowl?

WHIZ is NOT the O-coordinator. He relays the plays from the booth.

 

[CtCardinals78]

WHIZ is NOT the O-coordinator. He relays the plays from the booth.

To think Whiz has no input on the offensive playcalling is a little naive. This offensive play calling looks exactly the same as last year. He may not be calling the calls directly, but I bet he's helping with the game planning. Everyone was so excited about the additions this offseason. This just goes to show that QUALITY is more important to quantity.

 

[English on tour]

yeah we blew it yesterday, but there was a time we couldnt even get close to blowing a chance to win on the road. Lets forget last year and give the man the chance he deserves without polls like this just yet.... just my thoughts

 

[Catfish]

When Ken Whizenhunt arrived in Arizona, he stated that "We will play tough, smart, disciplined football". After half a decade of Whiz and company, I will say that we do play tough, (occasionally), actually probably more than not. But the smart, and the disciplined part has NEVER figured into the equation.

It is extremely hard to say we are a disciplined bunch when we continue to be among the most penalized teams in the league. The fact that we continue to make the SAME mistakes that get us penalized over and over, game after game, and season after season, is tribute to a general failure of the entire coaching staff to REALLY address this issue. To top that off, it is mostly the same players making the same mistakes that lead to these penalties-----a sure sign that we are not really taking action to correct this as a team.

As for smart football, I will point to the fact that we continue to turn running backs out into the league who excell when given a chance with another team, after being mostly considered failures while with the Cardinals. The latest is Timmy Hightower. He could not be trusted by the coaching staff to play without fumbling. This cost him the ability to make a difference in game after game, nearly always producing a costly fumble that caused a halt to our running game. This problem was NEVER fixed as long as Timmy was here, yet Mike Shannahan has seemingly cured that problem in one lockout shortened off-season. I find it remarkable that Shannahan as much as said that this is a fixable problem when he was questioned about Timmy's propensity to put the ball on the ground. Shannahan said that he would simply continue to give the ball to Timmy in practice and have the defense attempt to rip the ball away until he quits fumbling. He never said anything about taking him out of games for doing so. It seems quite strange that Shannahan seems to have fixed a problem that has plagued our coaching staff for several years now.

We also try to be a pass first team, even when running the ball seems to be called for. Right now, especially, the defense could use any help they can get to stay off the field while the offense uses up clock. Yet, even with the game on the line, and knowing that Beanie has already rushed for nearly 100 yards, (nearly all in the 2nd half), we only gave him 14 carries. This would look to be just fine, except that we REALLY needed to keep possession of the ball as much as possible to put this game away in the 4th quarter. Failing to run the ball more with Beanie when the game was on the line, (knowing that he was having a breakout game), is not very smart in my opinion.

Thus far, I fail to see just how the 'smart', and 'disciplined' parts of Whizenhunt's statement have been addressed or even considered. At least that much of Whiz' credo seems to be 'empty promise' in my opinion.

 

[Mitch]

When Ken Whizenhunt arrived in Arizona, he stated that "We will play tough, smart, disciplined football". After half a decade of Whiz and company, I will say that we do play tough, (occasionally), actually probably more than not. But the smart, and the disciplined part has NEVER figured into the equation.

It is extremely hard to say we are a disciplined bunch when we continue to be among the most penalized teams in the league. The fact that we continue to make the SAME mistakes that get us penalized over and over, game after game, and season after season, is tribute to a general failure of the entire coaching staff to REALLY address this issue. To top that off, it is mostly the same players making the same mistakes that lead to these penalties-----a sure sign that we are not really taking action to correct this as a team.

As for smart football, I will point to the fact that we continue to turn running backs out into the league who excell when given a chance with another team, after being mostly considered failures while with the Cardinals. The latest is Timmy Hightower. He could not be trusted by the coaching staff to play without fumbling. This cost him the ability to make a difference in game after game, nearly always producing a costly fumble that caused a halt to our running game. This problem was NEVER fixed as long as Timmy was here, yet Mike Shannahan has seemingly cured that problem in one lockout shortened off-season. I find it remarkable that Shannahan as much as said that this is a fixable problem when he was questioned about Timmy's propensity to put the ball on the ground. Shannahan said that he would simply continue to give the ball to Timmy in practice and have the defense attempt to rip the ball away until he quits fumbling. He never said anything about taking him out of games for doing so. It seems quite strange that Shannahan seems to have fixed a problem that has plagued our coaching staff for several years now.

We also try to be a pass first team, even when running the ball seems to be called for. Right now, especially, the defense could use any help they can get to stay off the field while the offense uses up clock. Yet, even with the game on the line, and knowing that Beanie has already rushed for nearly 100 yards, (nearly all in the 2nd half), we only gave him 14 carries. This would look to be just fine, except that we REALLY needed to keep possession of the ball as much as possible to put this game away in the 4th quarter. Failing to run the ball more with Beanie when the game was on the line, (knowing that he was having a breakout game), is not very smart in my opinion.

Thus far, I fail to see just how the 'smart', and 'disciplined' parts of Whizenhunt's statement have been addressed or even considered. At least that much of Whiz' credo seems to be 'empty promise' in my opinion.

Great post, my dear friend---and I will add this---this is one of the softest teams in the NFL, hands down. This is not a tough football team by any stretch of the imagination. This team is a meltdown waiting to happen.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

To think Whiz has no input on the offensive playcalling is a little naive. This offensive play calling looks exactly the same as last year. He may not be calling the calls directly, but I bet he's helping with the game planning. Everyone was so excited about the additions this offseason. This just goes to show that QUALITY is more important to quantity.

"Naive" ?

Of course he's involved in game planning and we are working off his playbook, but the assumption by many is that he is making the calls; we have an o-coordinator in the booth who has that job.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Sorry but this is beyond stupid. Whiz is, by far, the best coach we have ever had. Do you guys not remmember what our franchise was like prior to him????

 

[Duckjake]

Sorry but this is beyond stupid. Whiz is, by far, the best coach we have ever had. Do you guys not remember what our franchise was like prior to him????

Yeah, we were reminded of it last season.



Seriously, CKW needs to stay as HC. Unless the wheels really fall off. Turning over coaches constantly is a major reason why the franchise was like it was prior to him.

 

[football karma]

Seriously, CKW needs to stay as HC. Unless the wheels really fall off. Turning over coaches constantly is a major reason why the franchise was like it was prior to him.

yep

good grief

all I know is this: the Cardinals have found their QB for the next 5-7 years.

Once you have a QB, everything else can be fixed relatively quickly. This team will be competitive this year, which in the NFC West means a very good chance at winning the division.

thinking at this point that a new coach will somehow make things better is silly.

 

[kerouac9]

I can say that the honeymoon might be over with the AZR. Press is questioning his choices to run the ball and the lack of discipline w/r/t penalties. With the fans I don't think it really matters with the home schedule we have.

 

[conraddobler]

Pounding on the stupid things this team does, DOES NOT = wanting the coach fired.

It = JUST FIX IT...

With this team wanting a new coach is like wanting that hot looking waitress until you find out she's a he.

 

[Cheesebeef]

here's my biggest issue with Wiz. His greatest weakness just seems to be a lack of holding players accountable for the most part.

Last season, we had two of the the worst OLB in the league... they were both HANDED starting jobs again this season with no proven players brought in to even challenge them.

Last season, we had horrific O-line play from both of our T. In the off-season... again, no one was brought in to even challenge these guys and I would be STUNNED if Bridges was ever given a shot to supplant Brown.

Last season, Wilson was just down-right terrible in coverage... yet no one was brought into the challenge him... even when he got injured in the pre-season and there were Safeties available out there, no one STILL was brought in to back him up.

Those five positions are KILLER positions on this team.

It seems like the only player held accountable for anything is Deuce with his weight... not his play. That doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

Wiz said his biggest problem last year was that he relied on guys from the past for a little longer than he should have, his emotions getting the best of him... well... what's changed? Apparently, not much unfortunately at this point.

 

[Rab]

I'm not near ready to call for Whiz to be fired, because I do think he has helped changed the culture of Arizona Cardinals football. I do, however, think that Whiz received too much of the credit. I do believe that Kurt Warner bailed the coaching staff out of a lot of bad situations, and it kind of speaks to how great Warner was for the last 2 1/2 years of his career.

As has been mentioned, Whiz has said a lot of things that I just don't believe anymore. "We will be a disciplined team". "We are commited to running the football." A lot of the issues the Cardinals had when Whiz came aboard are still problems today. Lack of a run game, horrible offensive line, and undisciplined defense. Not much has been done to correct these issues. Competition for positions is fine, but I don't like the way he handled Patrick Peterson in camp and preseason, though guys like Porter, who didn't have a great year, was pretty much given the job this year again. I've never liked the way he's handled the RB situation, both with Beanie and Timmy while he was here.

The year they went to the Super Bowl, they were an above average 9-7 team who feasted off a horrible division to make to the playoffs and got hot at the right time. In part I thought it was because they finally got the run game going which opened up Warner to Fitzgerald. Not once did I ever feel it was because of the coaching. Warner really was the coach on the field.

I like Whiz, I want to keep Whiz, but I hope he starts learning from some of these mistakes. At first I chalked it up to him being a new HC, but at some point, that faded. I do think he has potential to be a really good coach. I just hope it happens sooner than later.

 

[conraddobler]

I'm not near ready to call for Whiz to be fired, because I do think he has helped changed the culture of Arizona Cardinals football. I do, however, think that Whiz received too much of the credit. I do believe that Kurt Warner bailed the coaching staff out of a lot of bad situations, and it kind of speaks to how great Warner was for the last 2 1/2 years of his career.

As has been mentioned, Whiz has said a lot of things that I just don't believe anymore. "We will be a disciplined team". "We are commited to running the football." A lot of the issues the Cardinals had when Whiz came aboard are still problems today. Lack of a run game, horrible offensive line, and undisciplined defense. Not much has been done to correct these issues. Competition for positions is fine, but I don't like the way he handled Patrick Peterson in camp and preseason, though guys like Porter, who didn't have a great year, was pretty much given the job this year again. I've never liked the way he's handled the RB situation, both with Beanie and Timmy while he was here.

The year they went to the Super Bowl, they were an above average 9-7 team who feasted off a horrible division to make to the playoffs and got hot at the right time. In part I thought it was because they finally got the run game going which opened up Warner to Fitzgerald. Not once did I ever feel it was because of the coaching. Warner really was the coach on the field.

I like Whiz, I want to keep Whiz, but I hope he starts learning from some of these mistakes. At first I chalked it up to him being a new HC, but at some point, that faded. I do think he has potential to be a really good coach. I just hope it happens sooner than later.

That's a great post, and I agree that Whiz has the potential to be a very good coach.

I don't like the political way he treats players, you seem to get multiple chances if you've ever played for the Steelers but if not then you have to prove yourself three times over.

I think there's a better way to treat the players like men and with respect without sacrificing being demanding.

I'd like better assistants, I'd like more consistentcy of messages and actions meshing together, in general less team politics more what have you done for me lately.

We need more team leaders that can play lights out to keep the others in line, the coach can't do it all, it's about who you bring on to your team, it's a lot of things this orgnaization could improve on.

 

[MrYeahBut]

That's a great post, and I agree that Whiz has the potential to be a very good coach.

I don't like the political way he treats players, you seem to get multiple chances if you've ever played for the Steelers but if not then you have to prove yourself three times over.

I think there's a better way to treat the players like men and with respect without sacrificing being demanding.

I'd like better assistants, I'd like more consistentcy of messages and actions meshing together, in general less team politics more what have you done for me lately.

We need more team leaders that can play lights out to keep the others in line, the coach can't do it all, it's about who you bring on to your team, it's a lot of things this orgnaization could improve on.

You know Conrad, I've just got this queasy feeling in my stomach that the way PP21 is being handled just isn't right. Can't put my finger on it, but something seems amiss. I dunno, maybe I'm just paranoid.


.

 

[Rab]

You know Conrad, I've just got this queasy feeling in my stomach that the way PP21 is being handled just isn't right. Can't put my finger on it, but something seems amiss. I dunno, maybe I'm just paranoid.


.

I completely agree with this statement, and the above statement about the way he handles his players.