Hello Dark Side, My Old Friend...

[kerouac9]

Meh on "needing all the draft capital." Same record every year. Another refrain of "keeping powder dry." By that rationale we never would have gotten Chandler Jones.

As to moving up to get a pass rusher and whether he has the stones to do so, it's merely a hypothetical exercise.

Nonsense. The Cards gave up one draft pick (and a busted prospect) for Chandler Jones. Not a 2- or 3-for-1.

 

[Stout]

In the last 5 years Only 3 “ prolific “ pass rushers were drafted high.Nick Bosa, Myles Garrett and Von Miller drafted 2nd, 1st and 2nd respectively.
All the others were draft 11 or below. The leading sack leader over the last 5 years? T.J.Watt and he was drafted 30th. JJ was drafted 11th. Chandler Jones 21st. Chris Jones 37th.

Point is a good to great pass rusher can be found a little farther down in the draft. Nobody really knows until they actually do it. Arguably Chris Jones would have been a great 1st pick and had he been the first pick the Chiefs would have gotten blasted by the pundits… but not now.

How do we know Darius Robinson isn’t the next Chris Jones or Arron Donald? But isn’t that what we hope for? Trading up and giving up draft picks guarantees nothing.

Hitting on the draft is a wonderful thing . And when you do your team thrives. A couple of good drafts in a row gives you the financial leeway to fill the gaps needed with higher quality players. The downside a successful draft is usually hitting on 25-30% of your picks which means it takes time.

This defense was so bad last year ( a lot because of injuries) that we were easy to scheme against. So adding 1 quality edge rusher was not going to suddenly turn this defense around. Let’s hope the free agents added to the d-line, the returning injured players and the draft help improve the run defense which will help scheme a pass rush.

I get what you're saying and don't disagree. My frustration is people treat draft picks and cap space like the holy grail and untouchable these days, and just expect we'll get star players our of the draft. Just because other teams have found good edge players later in no way guarantees Monti will. He's already whiffed big time on it once, while doing eff all else to help the position, so...?

 

[Stout]

Nonsense. The Cards gave up one draft pick (and a busted prospect) for Chandler Jones. Not a 2- or 3-for-1.

They gave up a 2nd round pick, and you said they needed all their draft capital in the next few years. Not hard to do the math in thinking you'd be against a similar trade.

Draft picks aren't holy. If we could trade a 2nd right now for a proven pass rusher like CJ that won't break our cap, you do it. If we could secure Parsons for a load of picks, do it. No use stashing picks and ignoring talent.

 

[kerouac9]

They gave up a 2nd round pick, and you said they needed all their draft capital in the next few years. Not hard to do the math in thinking you'd be against a similar trade.

Draft picks aren't holy. If we could trade a 2nd right now for a proven pass rusher like CJ that won't break our cap, you do it. If we could secure Parsons for a load of picks, do it. No use stashing picks and ignoring talent.

Well, listen to what I say instead of making assumptions. I'm fine giving up a draft pick for a player you know can play in the NFL.

I'm shaky on the idea of giving up 3 magic beans for one REALLY magic bean. Assuming a top 15 pick has a 60% chance of becoming an above-average starter and a top 25 pick has a 50% chance of becoming an above-average starter, you're looking at creating big holes in your roster down the road.

I was against the Hollywood Brown trade because it was clear to me that he wasn't likely to provide more value than the first-round pick we gave up potentially could.

 

[Stout]

Well, listen to what I say instead of making assumptions. I'm fine giving up a draft pick for a player you know can play in the NFL.

I'm shaky on the idea of giving up 3 magic beans for one REALLY magic bean. Assuming a top 15 pick has a 60% chance of becoming an above-average starter and a top 25 pick has a 50% chance of becoming an above-average starter, you're looking at creating big holes in your roster down the road.

I was against the Hollywood Brown trade because it was clear to me that he wasn't likely to provide more value than the first-round pick we gave up potentially could.

Okay, cool.

I was fuming at the Hollywood Brown trade. Such a garbage Keim move.

 

[slanidrac16]

I get what you're saying and don't disagree. My frustration is people treat draft picks and cap space like the holy grail and untouchable these days, and just expect we'll get star players our of the draft. Just because other teams have found good edge players later in no way guarantees Monti will. He's already whiffed big time on it once, while doing eff all else to help the position, so...?

I think we are seeing things the same but from a different angle. But trading up and giving up draft capital in no way guarantees a bullseye.
Let’s give MO a little time to prove himself. If Robinson turns out to be the next Chris Jones ( I’m not suggesting for one minute he will) we will all be calling MO a god.
I do understand your view to make every move possible right now with the desire to be better right now.