Honest question.....who would pay to watch these guys??

[Rats]

This is extremely silly. Dragic is far superior to Jimmer on the basketball court. We're not making the switch to assuage Mormon fans.

You miss the point. Not about Mormon fans it is about Paying fans. They wont pay to come see Goran. People not just Mormons will pay to see Jimmer and he wouldnt cost much. Good business, create a buzz good marketing. Suns have built there presence in the Valley on good marketing. This group under Sarver has sucked at it.

 

[AzStevenCal]

If they win it solves the issue, Jimmer solves the paying fans issue win or lose. You underestimate the Jimmer mania among Mormons as well as NBA fans. The Kings attendance was what it was because of Jimmers 10 minutes. Theys sucked and were thought to be moving but the instant offense he delivered brought what few fans they had.

The Kings were dead last in attendance last season.

Steve

 

[Superbone]

You miss the point. Not about Mormon fans it is about Paying fans. They wont pay to come see Goran. People not just Mormons will pay to see Jimmer and he wouldnt cost much. Good business, create a buzz good marketing. Suns have built there presence in the Valley on good marketing. This group under Sarver has sucked at it.

You miss my point. Fans would much rather watch Goran than Jimmer.

 

[Mainstreet]

If you're talking Track and Field, yes we should be able to staff a pretty effective team. If you're talking about basketball, no amount of running looks to save this group. You usually have to rebound in order to run and I don't think we're going to do that very well.

Steve

After the opponents score a basket, and before they can get back down the court, the Suns will be putting it in their basket. SSOL is back... the speed part... sort of.

Actually in my previous post, I was referencing if the Suns can't score on the fast-break, they will have trouble in the half court (red zone). As you note, rebounding will be an issue as well. I won't even get into shooting woes.

 

[Phrazbit]

The buzz from Jimmer is dead. Whatever miniscule boost they'd see would last about a week, at which point it became obvious that the Suns were like a 15 win team.

And I think its more likely a Dragic Jimmer swap would hurt attendance... pretty bad. I would bet for most ticket holders Dragic is currently their favorite player, and they probably also know Jimmer as that guy who was exciting two and a half years ago in the tournament... and has done nothing since.

Hopefully our policy of getting formerly hyped guys who have proven themselves as busts has come to an end.

 

[Rats]

You miss my point. Fans would much rather watch Goran than Jimmer.

But they wont PAY to see him. Which is the point of this thread.

 

[Rats]

The Kings were dead last in attendance last season.

Steve

They were threatining moving the team and Jimmer plagyed limited minutes. My point stands. Only the Jazz would benefit more in Paying fans than the Suns would do to the Jimmer mania. This question was about Paying fans ...

 

[Phrazbit]

Ugggghhhh... this dumb. Why not sign Adam Morrison while we're at it?

No one is going to shell out money because the Suns traded for Jimmer.

 

[Rats]

Ugggghhhh... this dumb. Why not sign Adam Morrison while we're at it?

No one is going to shell out money because the Suns traded for Jimmer.

They will if he gets 30 minutes a game and 15 shots. He will score 20 a game and attendence would get a boost from the Jimmer buzz restart. I love Goran as a player but he does nothing at the gate. There not going to win regardless but I believe many would pay to see Jimmer score 20 over a Beasley, or a Dragic.

 

[sunsfan88]

Are there a lot of Mormons in Arizona?

 

[Phrazbit]

They will if he gets 30 minutes a game and 15 shots. He will score 20 a game and attendence would get a boost from the Jimmer buzz restart. I love Goran as a player but he does nothing at the gate. There not going to win regardless but I believe many would pay to see Jimmer score 20 over a Beasley, or a Dragic.

Bad teams with bad players do nothing at the gate. No one is going to pay to watch Jimmer toss up a brick barrage in a sad effort to reach 20 a game as the team fails to reach 80 points a night because they have a ball hog point guard who cant pass and is inefficient as a scorer.

 

[slinslin]

Who the heck would pay to watch Jimmer, terrible player.

 

[Rats]

Who the heck would pay to watch Jimmer, terrible player.

Aaahh....not going to convince anyone that doesn't want to even hear the arguement. This was not about Goran or Jimmer it was about the Suns lack of marketing and having a roster full of guys no one will PAY to see. Jimmer was just a guy that I saw was being shopped and could be had cheap. He could be a draw at the gate in a terrible season. PHX is a destination city that NBA fans and sports fans come to. With out a draw no one wants to see the home team with no hype or hope. Only crowds will be when Durant or James come to town. And yes this town has lots of Mormons. Theres a church every mile or so with a basketball court in it.

 

[elindholm]

Aaahh....not going to convince anyone that doesn't want to even hear the arguement.

Everyone's hearing the argument. It's just that no one agrees with you.

You have a much, much higher assessment of Fredette's excitement and marketability than anyone else on the board. I personally find the notion that anyone would pay $50 to watch Fredette jack up a bunch of shots and maybe score 20 points in a blowout loss to be very far beyond absurd.

 

[Phrazbit]

A mormon church every mile? Maybe in Mesa... in the rest of the city the Mormon population is miniscule. And I think Mormons have enough self restraint that they would not have an overwhelming compulsion to shell out cash 41 games a year just because there is some lousy Mormon on the team.

 

[Rats]

Everyone's hearing the argument. It's just that no one agrees with you.

You have a much, much higher assessment of Fredette's excitement and marketability than anyone else on the board. I personally find the notion that anyone would pay $50 to watch Fredette jack up a bunch of shots and maybe score 20 points in a blowout loss to be very far beyond absurd.

And your arguing that they would for a Beasley who we gave a big contract and now cut? Jimmer would be cheap and worth the risk in a crap season. Not so absurd. There arent alot of options other than not spending to see Goran or Goodwin do the sane thing for more money. Sarvers group doesnt get marketing and apparently no one here does. A Jimmer type would create a buzz no one else on this crap roster would create.

 

[elindholm]

And your arguing that they would for a Beasley who we gave a big contract and now cut?

Huh?

A Jimmer type would create a buzz no one else on this crap roster would create.

Does continuing to repeat that make it more true?

 

[Errntknght]

It sounds like you're expecting the Suns to have a good defensive team, but you can't mean that. Yes, they'll be able to pressure the perimeter when they feel like it, but they have possibly the worst C/PF rotation in the league's last 30 years. They'll be killed mercilessly inside.

That's what we are going to need to be in the running for top draft slots but with Gortat it won't be bad enough, thats why I've been harping on the need to get rid of him. That's even more important with Frye coming back, who's a notch above Markieff on the offensive end. Maybe Channing will be more tentative than ever and rusty but its possible the year off did him good. If that's the case and Gortat is here, we have one PF/C combo that's just a little below average. The good news is that the running game is not Channing's cup of tea so he may only get 20 mpg (and he's not better than Markieff on defense.)

I don't expect the Suns to be a good defensive team top to bottom but we may have some line ups that are good. I can't imagine the Morrises or Frye holding up their end even when they try but some pair out of Len, Plumlee and Kravtsov might combine with Bledsoe, Dragic and Tucker to make a good defensive unit and a strong rebounding group as well. They're so inexperienced I'd expected to see plenty of lapses, too.

Another reason I expect the Suns to be uneven defensively is that the running game requires lots of players. On top of that Hornacek is bound to do a good bit of experimentation with lineups. Some of them are almost certain to be poor defensively, especially if they're required to pressure the ball - you can get creamed by screens doing that.

Yet another factor is gambling for steals. I think the Suns are going to poor enough offensively in the half court to make a certain amount of gambling worth while. But I don't know what Hornacek thinks about that - he might believe its such a bad practice that he doesn't want the players to get used to that style of play. Of he might think, like I do, that the players should learn from doing when its likely to pay off - with help from the coaches, teammates and game film. Steals are neutral statistically across the league - meaning number of steals does not correlate positively with number of wins (over eight years it had a slight negative correlation in the NBA.) But that doesn't mean that you can't learn a good gamble from a bad one.

 

[Phrazbit]

And your arguing that they would for a Beasley who we gave a big contract and now cut? Jimmer would be cheap and worth the risk in a crap season. Not so absurd. There arent alot of options other than not spending to see Goran or Goodwin do the sane thing for more money. Sarvers group doesnt get marketing and apparently no one here does. A Jimmer type would create a buzz no one else on this crap roster would create.

Who said anyone would pay to watch Beasley? Putting words in other peoples mouths now... great way to get people to respect your argument...

Beasley was an idiotic signing by an idiotic GM, this Jimmer idea would be a strikingly SIMILAR move. Acquiring a supposedly "low risk" player in a pathetic effort to generate hype while ignore the stark reality that no one cares what a guy did in college if he has done nothing as a pro. Which is the case with both Jimmer and Beasley.

This is not March of 2011 anymore, there is ZERO buzz around Jimmer. If the Suns traded their starting point guard for him there would be groans and laughter.

 

[Phrazbit]

That's what we are going to need to be in the running for top draft slots but with Gortat it won't be bad enough, thats why I've been harping on the need to get rid of him. That's even more important with Frye coming back, who's a notch above Markieff on the offensive end. Maybe Channing will be more tentative than ever and rusty but its possible the year off did him good. If that's the case and Gortat is here, we have one PF/C combo that's just a little below average. The good news is that the running game is not Channing's cup of tea so he may only get 20 mpg (and he's not better than Markieff on defense.)

I don't expect the Suns to be a good defensive team top to bottom but we may have some line ups that are good. I can't imagine the Morrises or Frye holding up their end even when they try but some pair out of Len, Plumlee and Kravtsov might combine with Bledsoe, Dragic and Tucker to make a good defensive unit and a strong rebounding group as well. They're so inexperienced I'd expected to see plenty of lapses, too.

Another reason I expect the Suns to be uneven defensively is that the running game requires lots of players. On top of that Hornacek is bound to do a good bit of experimentation with lineups. Some of them are almost certain to be poor defensively, especially if they're required to pressure the ball - you can get creamed by screens doing that.

Yet another factor is gambling for steals. I think the Suns are going to poor enough offensively in the half court to make a certain amount of gambling worth while. But I don't know what Hornacek thinks about that - he might believe its such a bad practice that he doesn't want the players to get used to that style of play. Of he might think, like I do, that the players should learn from doing when its likely to pay off - with help from the coaches, teammates and game film. Steals are neutral statistically across the league - meaning number of steals does not correlate positively with number of wins (over eight years it had a slight negative correlation in the NBA.) But that doesn't mean that you can't learn a good gamble from a bad one.

Unless Gortat had a "Freaky Friday" incident over the summer and has now had Hakeem's mind transferred into Gortat's body... then there is nothing to worry about.

We have an even worse and less proven roster than we did last year. It would be a miracle if they sniffed 30 wins. After the Butler trade I am expecting possibly shy of 20 wins, our lack of talent at the wings is unmatched by any team in the league, and our lack of talent at both forward positions might be at historic levels.

 

[Superbone]

But they wont PAY to see him. Which is the point of this thread.

I disagree. Quite the opposite. They'd pay more to watch the proven Dragic than the unproven Jimmer. Fredette may never make it in the NBA. Dragic already has.

 

[Superbone]

They were threatining moving the team and Jimmer plagyed limited minutes. My point stands. Only the Jazz would benefit more in Paying fans than the Suns would do to the Jimmer mania. This question was about Paying fans ...

Jimmer mania is long dead.

 

[Superbone]

Everyone's hearing the argument. It's just that no one agrees with you.

You have a much, much higher assessment of Fredette's excitement and marketability than anyone else on the board. I personally find the notion that anyone would pay $50 to watch Fredette jack up a bunch of shots and maybe score 20 points in a blowout loss to be very far beyond absurd.

Bingo!

 

[Rats]

Who said anyone would pay to watch Beasley? Putting words in other peoples mouths now... great way to get people to respect your argument...

Beasley was an idiotic signing by an idiotic GM, this Jimmer idea would be a strikingly SIMILAR move. Acquiring a supposedly "low risk" player in a pathetic effort to generate hype while ignore the stark reality that no one cares what a guy did in college if he has done nothing as a pro. Which is the case with both Jimmer and Beasley.

This is not March of 2011 anymore, there is ZERO buzz around Jimmer. If the Suns traded their starting point guard for him there would be groans and laughter.

I wasnt putting words in anyones mouth. It was a statement that we paid handsomely for a Beasley with his baggage but wouldnt pay a small amount for a chance at reviving Jimmer mania.
I also never said trade Goran for Jimmer....I said send him out for a #1 pick while he has value so you can build for the future. Reading comprehension is your friend. Im done.

 

[Superbone]

Reading comprehension is your friend. Im done.

Everybody understands you perfectly. Thank you.