How good is Booker?

[Cheesebeef]

He is a good shooter, but to listen to some scouts (or read), you'd think he was a Steve Nash-level shooter. Problem with a lot of people is that they exaggerate the faults of the players they don't like, and do the same thing with the qualities of those they like. I try my best to be objective.

Additionally, remember that even good shooters struggle in the NBA for the first year or two, for the most part. I think Doncic will be a good player. He will be far better than his detractors claim, but probably not as good as his biggest fans think.

I get it. But if we get one of the first three picks, I really think we need to strive for GREAT. In a draft this strong, teams at the top have to be looking for generational talents. I just fear a) the unknown b) lack of athleticism c) okay shooting doesn't scream that kind of talent. I'd hate to be the Pistons who took Darko over Wade, Melo and Bosh.

 

[SirStefan32]

I get it. But if we get one of the first three picks, I really think we need to strive for GREAT. In a draft this strong, teams at the top have to be looking for generational talents. I just fear a) the unknown b) lack of athleticism c) okay shooting doesn't scream that kind of talent. I'd hate to be the Pistons who took Darko over Wade, Melo and Bosh.

Well, I think everyone shares those concerns. I am sure we can come up with concerns with just about every pick. Teams pick a Milicic over Wades and Melos all the time. If Doncic and Milicic were not both white, nobody would draw that comparison. Cavs picket Bennett over Oladipo, Clippers picked Olowokandi over the likes of Vince Carter and Dirk Nowitzki, Memphis picked Thabeet over Harden, Curry, and Derozan, Miami picked Beasley over Westbrook. Doncic is no more likely to be a Darko Milicic than one of the Centers is to be the next Thabeet. If you are the GM, you pick the guy you believe will be the best player. You can't worry that a white guy A is going to be the same as the white guy B. Now, who the hell that guy is, well... I don't know. Glad I am not the GM with a number one or two pick this year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Well, I think everyone shares those concerns. I am sure we can come up with concerns with just about every pick. Teams pick a Milicic over Wades and Melos all the time. If Doncic and Milicic were not both white, nobody would draw that comparison. Cavs picket Bennett over Oladipo, Clippers picked Olowokandi over the likes of Vince Carter and Dirk Nowitzki, Memphis picked Thabeet over Harden, Curry, and Derozan, Miami picked Beasley over Westbrook. Doncic is no more likely to be a Darko Milicic than one of the Centers is to be the next Thabeet. If you are the GM, you pick the guy you believe will be the best player. You can't worry that a white guy A is going to be the same as the white guy B. Now, who the hell that guy is, well... I don't know. Glad I am not the GM with a number one or two pick this year.

It's not that he's white... it's that he's a white Euro who doesn't play against the best athletes in the world, which makes them more difficult to scout... and outside of Dirk, none of them have ended up superstars.

 

[hsandhu]

I guess talk about the euro stiff are now in this thread, so I'll post this.

[

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

McD on the radio today. Disconcerting at 5:00, he's asked about if payton plays well does that address the pg outside the draft, and he doesnt answer. And talks about upgrading the center and pg spot through draft and free agency. I would have expected and wanted him to say yes, payton playing well means we would go big.

He's then asked about ayton being a generational talent and talks about several great players in the draft (he can't mention names).

Good lord, I guess he's got his eyes set on the stiff!!! IT is a free agent this summer as well, maybe sign him, keep payton and make this damn 3 pg thing work. I've defended MCD more than many, but he better not f up this summer.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I guess talk about the euro stiff are now in this thread, so I'll post this.

[

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

McD on the radio today. Disconcerting at 5:00, he's asked about if payton plays well does that address the pg outside the draft, and he doesnt answer. And talks about upgrading the center and pg spot through draft and free agency. I would have expected and wanted him to say yes, payton playing well means we would go big.

He's then asked about ayton being a generational talent and talks about several great players in the draft (he can't mention names).

Good lord, I guess he's got his eyes set on the stiff!!! IT is a free agent this summer as well, maybe sign him, keep payton and make this damn 3 pg thing work. I've defended MCD more than many, but he better not f up this summer.

Why you’re willing to give him the chance to is still a mystery to me...

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

It's not that he's white... it's that he's a white Euro who doesn't play against the best athletes in the world, which makes them more difficult to scout... and outside of Dirk, none of them have ended up superstars.

Porzingis, Giannis, Gasol brothers, Jokic...

 

[hsandhu]

Why you’re willing to give him the chance to is still a mystery to me...

Because they are in the process of implementing the right plan now.

If they end up with ayton,bagley,mpj,jjj after this summer, the building of young talent the last couple seasons, since the emergence of booker as a rookie, would far exceed what I expected. But if they take the euro stiff... I was wrong a moron doesn't learn

 

[Cheesebeef]

Porzingis, Giannis, Gasol brothers, Jokic...

The Gasol brothers and Jokic aren’t/weren’t superstars. All-Stars yes.

Porzingis and Giannis were physical freaks of nature. Most white Euros Arent.. including Donicic. If he was, I’d be more tempted as noted earlier.

Did you really put Jokic up as a superstar?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Because they are in the process of implementing the right plan now.

If they end up with ayton,bagley,mpj,jjj after this summer, the building of young talent the last couple seasons, since the emergence of booker as a rookie, would far exceed what I expected. But if they take the euro stiff... I was wrong a moron doesn't learn

But this is the third plan. Expecting a moron to learn is a Recipe for disaster. Especially since we’ve seen him fail to learn in other areas.. such as selecting coaches, trashing players on their way out the door.

Giving a moron a third chance to define the organization just seems like a terrible idea to me.

 

[hsandhu]

But this is the third plan. You just admitted he was a moron. Morons DONT learn.

What can you do about the failed plans now, we're in the middle of the correct plan that is ONE piece away from being a homerun.

That's where I differ, I'll give him room to learn and not be a moron. He has learned and showed patience by letting the tank play out as some fans/radio guys have been hysterical the last couple years with all the losses, shows some learning not to have made a ******* signing/trade.

And most importantly he has at least gotten the truly intractable moron who will always be a joke, in sarver, to stay with the tank.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

It's not that he's white... it's that he's a white Euro who doesn't play against the best athletes in the world, which makes them more difficult to scout... and outside of Dirk, none of them have ended up superstars.

Gasol brothers would argue with that claim.

 

[Carolinacacti]

Why you’re willing to give him the chance to is still a mystery to me...

Cheese I hope your ready to eat some crow next year.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Cheese I hope your ready to eat some crow next year.

I know I can speak for him. He’s be happy to do so. He’s done it on the cards board. Will you if he’s right?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cheese I hope your ready to eat some crow next year.

Dude... I will eat enough to crow to make me vomit.

There’s a difference between not wanting McD to succeed and thinking he CAN’T.

 

[Cheesebeef]

What can you do about the failed plans now, we're in the middle of the correct plan that is ONE piece away from being a homerun.

That's where I differ, I'll give him room to learn and not be a moron. He has learned and showed patience by letting the tank play out as some fans/radio guys have been hysterical the last couple years with all the losses, shows some learning not to have made a ******* signing/trade.

And most importantly he has at least gotten the truly intractable moron who will always be a joke, in sarver, to stay with the tank.

I just fear he can’t hit a home run.

And I know he’ll strikeout on Coach. That really my bigger fear. Coaching decision sets course for the next 2-4 years. He eats crap on his third one, won’t matter who we draft because people will be begging to get off this team at this point... just like we’ve seen before.

 

[Mainstreet]

@hsandhu

I watched the McDonough video above you presented and here are some of my thoughts and takeaways from the interview as well.

The Suns are going to look to upgrade their team coming out of the All-Star break by searching the G-League and Chinese league to bulk up the tail end of the roster. He said as much in an earlier interview that he would try to upgrade the Suns roster through April.

I wish McDonough would be more specific as to who the "we" are when researching film on players. He does say they having a big scouting staff but I wish I knew more who is doing the scouting besides McDonough.

He says Payton is off to a phenomenal start but he wants to grade him over the remaining games. I think this may be a purposely restrained response because Payton has only played 3 games with the Suns and he will become a RFA after the season. McDonough understandably does not want to be committal and show all his cards just yet especially since the Suns do not want other teams to know who they might select in the draft.

IMO, a little cat and mouse is going on in the interview. The Suns want to upgrade the PG-Center position but do not want to tip their hand on who they might draft.

I like how McDonough keeps everything close to the vest but as a fan it drives me crazy. He hints that the Suns may be a player either in free agency and/or trades when a lot of teams do not have the money to spend and that it will be a buyer's market.

McDonough will offer Booker an extension this summer and he has another opportunity to offer him an extension when he becomes a RFA. He makes it very clear Booker is the core piece of the Suns. He will make every effort to put better players around Booker next season.

Triano will be evaluated in terms of player development... if the young players are getting better... not wins and losses.

Chriss has been playing with a nagging hip injury and hopefully the All-Star break will give him time to heal.

McDonough says the last 23 games will be all about evaluation looking towards the future. Also the Suns do not have any contracts that would prevent them from making some aggressive moves. He feels the Suns are ready for the next step.

This summer here we come.

 

[GatorAZ]

Gasol brothers would argue with that claim.

If not a superstar Pau was pretty damn close. Jokic is on track to be a superstar.

 

[Carolinacacti]

Will you if he’s right?

If you can't take it you better not dish it out. Of course I will take it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

If not a superstar Pau was pretty damn close. Jokic is on track to be a superstar.

A superstar is a guy who can carry his own team, IMO. Pau did that for one or two seasons in Memphis, but they never even won a playoff GAME much less a series and then that was it and then they fell apart. I'm talking about a bona-fide number 1 on a contender. That's a superstar, IMO. Not many of them around, but that's what you're hoping for when you have a #1 pick in a loaded draft.

And Jokic might be on track... or he might not, but he isn't right now and until he is, he ain't!

 

[Cheesebeef]

If you can't take it you better not dish it out. Of course I will take it.

you won't have to. I'm not going to be jumping up and down to serve it.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm curious who the Suns might bring in from the G-League or Chinese League who could help the Suns bottom end of the roster. Lavoy Allen of the NAZ Suns is the only name that readily comes to mind. Of course we are still waiting to see if Alan Williams returns soon.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

It's not that he's white... it's that he's a white Euro who doesn't play against the best athletes in the world, which makes them more difficult to scout... and outside of Dirk, none of them have ended up superstars.

This is completely wrong IMO. If anything I would argue that it is the college players that are at a disadvantage from a scouting standpoint. Sure I can agree that most of the top end athletes go through the college ranks, but they are spread out between so many college teams that it waters down the competition. There is really only a couple games a year where these top college prospects will players against actual pro level competition. Not to mention they are playing against a bunch of 18-20 year olds that aren't fully developed yet too.

Euroleague on the other hand is full of grown ass men that have been playing pro ball for years. Also a lot of these high end athletes that don't make the cut of the NBA go to places like euroleague and thus increase the talent level and level of athleticism in that league. Those same type of players are the guys that top college prospects are playing against, but in euroleague they have gotten older and better over time and that is the type of player that Doncic is going up against. One example off the top of my head is PJ Tucker who wasn't good enough to stick in the NBA out of college, but after he went to Europe for about 5 years he was developed enough to find a role and stick around in the NBA.

 

[GatorAZ]

A superstar is a guy who can carry his own team, IMO. Pau did that for one or two seasons in Memphis, but they never even won a playoff GAME much less a series and then that was it and then they fell apart. I'm talking about a bona-fide number 1 on a contender. That's a superstar, IMO. Not many of them around, but that's what you're hoping for when you have a #1 pick in a loaded draft.

And Jokic might be on track... or he might not, but he isn't right now and until he is, he ain't!

Kobe and KG weren't getting out of the first round with crap around them either. I do think Pau was a great #2 star especially in the Triangle. It would've been interesting how things went down for the Suns and Lakers had the Kwame Brown deal not gone down. The Suns wouldn't have traded for Shaq and Kobe probably would've demanded a trade the next summer. Damnit Jerry West!

 

[SirStefan32]

This is completely wrong IMO. If anything I would argue that it is the college players that are at a disadvantage from a scouting standpoint. Sure I can agree that most of the top end athletes go through the college ranks, but they are spread out between so many college teams that it waters down the competition. There is really only a couple games a year where these top college prospects will players against actual pro level competition. Not to mention they are playing against a bunch of 18-20 year olds that aren't fully developed yet too.

Euroleague on the other hand is full of grown ass men that have been playing pro ball for years. Also a lot of these high end athletes that don't make the cut of the NBA go to places like euroleague and thus increase the talent level and level of athleticism in that league. Those same type of players are the guys that top college prospects are playing against, but in euroleague they have gotten older and better over time and that is the type of player that Doncic is going up against. One example off the top of my head is PJ Tucker who wasn't good enough to stick in the NBA out of college, but after he went to Europe for about 5 years he was developed enough to find a role and stick around in the NBA.

I really don't think people understand how tough Euroleague is. There is a big difference between a good prospect on a team in a small national league and the best player on Real Madrid. Oh, and he's 18.

 

[elindholm]

I really don't think people understand how tough Euroleague is. There is a big difference between a good prospect on a team in a small national league and the best player on Real Madrid. Oh, and he's 18.

But see, the argument is circular. In the highlight clips, Doncic doesn't look like anything special. If this pedestrian teenager is one of the best players in the league, that doesn't say much about the league. But you say, no, it's a great league, and that proves how good he is, and the fact that he's so good proves what a tough league it is, which it turn proves how good he is since he's one of the best in it, which proves that...