How long do you rest Diaw?

[Lefty]

I think they should sit him out until he is completely 100% healthy. If that means a week or two, so be it.

 

[elindholm]

Hell, at this point I say bench him until next year. I've had it with him.

 

[TheHopToad]

I think Boris should be the new student for Dan D'Antoni. Coach Dan should start writing him some notes...

 

[SO91]

Yeah...like work out and stop eating you fat-ass!! I know, probably uncalled for, but I'm still on a high and intoxicated from the game

 

[cly2tw]

health and confidence are what Diaw is lacking.
But I'm sure with health comes back confidence. He will earn his contract.

 

[Gaddabout]

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[jenna2891]

Hell, at this point I say bench him until next year. I've had it with him.

 

[dodie53]

bring diaw off the bench.. start KT or james jones depending on the line-up of the opponent

 

[HooverDam]

Don't fret because Boris didn't dominate one of the best teams in the league. The last thing he needs is a shot to his ego by being moved to the bench. Coach D has a huge luxury in the fact that he has LB and KT more than willing to come off the bench, so having Boris start but probably play less minutes is the way to go until he's 100%. If the Suns are going to win it all, Boris will be important, his rebounding, scoring and especially passing are all important.

 

[NastyOne]

Diaw really needs to be moved in the offseason to a team under the cap.

The best we could hope for is trading him with the Cavs & Suns own pick to someone under the cap with a lotto selection.(Hopefully somewhere in the 12-15 range)

This way we can take a bigman with ATL's pick and our future PG in Acie Law with our other pick.

If no teams are interested in that deal just dump him for a 2nd rounder to someone under the cap.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Hell, at this point I say bench him until next year. I've had it with him.

Yeah...like work out and stop eating you fat-ass!! I know, probably uncalled for, but I'm still on a high and intoxicated from the game

Diaw really needs to be moved in the offseason to a team under the cap.

The best we could hope for is trading him with the Cavs & Suns own pick to someone under the cap with a lotto selection.(Hopefully somewhere in the 12-15 range)

This way we can take a bigman with ATL's pick and our future PG in Acie Law with our other pick.

If no teams are interested in that deal just dump him for a 2nd rounder to someone under the cap.

What fickle fans we are. Just this time last week, there were a lot of us that was claiming that Diaw was back.

I'm not making excuses for Diaw, as he did not have a good game. This attitude that we have though when players have a bad game or two is disappointing though. First James Jones, then Burke, then Banks, then Marion, and now Diaw. How many of these players really suck?

 

[NastyOne]

Don't fret because Boris didn't dominate one of the best teams in the league. The last thing he needs is a shot to his ego by being moved to the bench. Coach D has a huge luxury in the fact that he has LB and KT more than willing to come off the bench, so having Boris start but probably play less minutes is the way to go until he's 100%. If the Suns are going to win it all, Boris will be important, his rebounding, scoring and especially passing are all important.

Thats the thing though, Boris has shown that he can play against Dallas and play very well at that.

Dallas really doesnt have a answer for Boris Diaw when Boris actually wants to show up.

Their centers cant keep him infront of them and he can post up their smaller players, so basically whoever is guarding him he can get to the rim at will in a one on one situation against them.

I've never seen a player get to the rim so many times for a good look at the basket and still kick the ball out to someone else just because he felt the smallest amount of defensive pressure on him.

And we need his scoring, Rebounding and passing? Scoring? Rebounding? Boris is a weak rebounder and i'd rather count of James Jones for making a basket over Diaw at this point.

Not to mention hes a horrible defender that was getting lit up by everyone he guarded last night.

Right now Diaw is the most useless player in the Suns top 8.

If D'Antoni wants to wake him up bench him and give his minutes to Piatkowski and Rose until he finally realizes his potential and starts playing with some fire.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Thats the thing though, Boris has shown that he can play against Dallas and play very well at that.

Dallas really doesnt have a answer for Boris Diaw when Boris actually wants to show up.

Their centers cant keep him infront of them and he can post up their smaller players, so basically whoever is guarding him he can get to the rim at will in a one on one situation against them.

I've never seen a player get to the rim so many times for a good look at the basket and still kick the ball out to someone else just because he felt the smallest amount of defensive pressure on him.

And we need his scoring, Rebounding and passing? Scoring? Rebounding? Boris is a weak rebounder and i'd rather count of James Jones for making a basket over Diaw at this point.

Not to mention hes a horrible defender that was getting lit up by everyone he guarded last night.

Right now Diaw is the most useless player in the Suns top 8.

If D'Antoni wants to wake him up bench him and give his minutes to Piatkowski and Rose until he finally realizes his potential and starts playing with some fire.

Wow, those are some rose colored glasses you are wearing. Yes, Boris didn't have a good game, we agree on that. What did you want him to do, beat his man off of the block? Couldn't, why? Amare was dominating the ball last night in the post and rightfully so. He was on fire. Why WOULD you give it to Diaw last night?

Second, you are right that Diaw got lit up for a stretch there, but guess what, so was Marion. If you have ever seen footage of Dirk, you know not to force Dirk to the left. Marion was doing it all night long, and we watched Dirk tee off against Marion too.

Third, you are complaining about Diaw kicking the ball out of the paint....... if you haven't noticed, thats what makes him special. How many other big men in the league that are willing to pass like that? His passing threat is what makes him as good of a player has he is. You take that away from him, and he is just an average player.

Again, let's stop over-reacting to this game.

 

[CardNots]

All I want to remember is how Diaw came to play in the playoffs last year. He was a nightmare matchup. No way we trade him.

 

[elindholm]

What fickle fans we are. Just this time last week, there were a lot of us that was claiming that Diaw was back.

I wasn't one of them.

This attitude that we have though when players have a bad game or two is disappointing though. First James Jones, then Burke, then Banks, then Marion, and now Diaw. How many of these players really suck?

Well, Burke sucks, of course, but he's on a minimum contract, so it doesn't matter. I always thought Jones was cheap enough that he was worth keeping even while he was struggling. Banks was obviously a mistake, but the Suns are stuck with him because they are too thin in the backcourt. Marion is a special case, but I don't think anyone says he sucks -- just that his weaknesses are unusually costly for a max-contract player.

What did you want him to do, beat his man off of the block? Couldn't, why? Amare was dominating the ball last night in the post and rightfully so.

Did we watch the same game? While Diaw was on the floor, there were several times that he did beat his man off the block, only to pass it back out upon reaching the rim. And when he wasn't doing that, he was sabotaging the offense with lazy, telegraphed passes.

Second, you are right that Diaw got lit up for a stretch there, but guess what, so was Marion. If you have ever seen footage of Dirk, you know not to force Dirk to the left. Marion was doing it all night long, and we watched Dirk tee off against Marion too.

Not exactly. Nowitzki scored some of the time against Marion, but he also missed several. He lit up Diaw effortlessly. The experiment of having Diaw guard Nowitzki was worth trying, but it was a dismal failure. The reason Diaw didn't play late in the game was that there was no one he could guard.

Third, you are complaining about Diaw kicking the ball out of the paint....... if you haven't noticed, thats what makes him special. How many other big men in the league that are willing to pass like that?

No. His passing makes him special, but only to the extent that he gives the Suns a better shot. If he passes up a layup in order to reset the ball up top or throw it out of bounds, that's not unselfish. It's weak.

His passing threat is what makes him as good of a player has he is. You take that away from him, and he is just an average player.

Being afraid of the basket isn't a skill.

Again, let's stop over-reacting to this game.

It wasn't this game. He's been doing the same thing for three out of his four years in the league. It was last year that was the fluke, not last night.

 

[az1965]

It wasn't this game. He's been doing the same thing for three out of his four years in the league. It was last year that was the fluke, not last night.

I'm afraid of this... if we don't see improvement from him in the playoffs, I say we move him, that is if there are any takers.

 

[NastyOne]

I wasn't one of them.



Well, Burke sucks, of course, but he's on a minimum contract, so it doesn't matter. I always thought Jones was cheap enough that he was worth keeping even while he was struggling. Banks was obviously a mistake, but the Suns are stuck with him because they are too thin in the backcourt. Marion is a special case, but I don't think anyone says he sucks -- just that his weaknesses are unusually costly for a max-contract player.



Did we watch the same game? While Diaw was on the floor, there were several times that he did beat his man off the block, only to pass it back out upon reaching the rim. And when he wasn't doing that, he was sabotaging the offense with lazy, telegraphed passes.



Not exactly. Nowitzki scored some of the time against Marion, but he also missed several. He lit up Diaw effortlessly. The experiment of having Diaw guard Nowitzki was worth trying, but it was a dismal failure. The reason Diaw didn't play late in the game was that there was no one he could guard.



No. His passing makes him special, but only to the extent that he gives the Suns a better shot. If he passes up a layup in order to reset the ball up top or throw it out of bounds, that's not unselfish. It's weak.



Being afraid of the basket isn't a skill.



It wasn't this game. He's been doing the same thing for three out of his four years in the league. It was last year that was the fluke, not last night.

Thank you! Very well said.

Diaw last night was beyond frustrating to watch.And its been this way all season.

The guy has so much skill for a player his size but he has no heart whatsoever.

I've never seen someone with the skill to get into the paint at will but never wants to finish.

Anytime Diaw feels any kind of pressure under the rim he'll always kick the ball out to someone else and put the load back on another teammates shoulders.

He blew atleast 2 chances at easy layups last night because he didnt want to take it hard all the way to the rim and rather pass the ball even though there was no way the guy guarding him would've blocked/altered his shot.

And on Defense it wasnt just Dirk destroying him last night, it was Josh Howard and Stackhouse too. He couldnt stop anyone from scoring on him.Thats why he was taken out of the game and never cameback, not because he had 4 fouls.

All of Diaw's problems have nothing to do with his skill level, these are problems that result from him being a lazy SOB that doesnt play with any fire and most of the time looks like he just playing the game for a paycheck.

D'Antoni needs to nip this in the butt right now and send a message to Boris by benching him for a game or two.

If that doesnt work then trade him in the offseason before he kills his value even more.

Either way he needs to wake the hell up, cause he has the skill and opportunity that should make him a hellva player in this lineup.

 

[azirish]

BASE YEAR CONTRACT

Boris is not going anywhere this summer. Deal with it.

I told everyone that extending Boris last summer was a mistake, although it was more due to the way the market works than an expectation he would decline. But before talking about trading him, I think the Suns are going to have to have long talk with him about the off season.

1. He cannot take a month off this summer. He was not in top condition at the start of the season and it has been an issue all season.

2. He has to focus on getting stronger. Strength is huge when it comes to playing defense. Rebounding is often more about strength than height or even jumping ability. Strength is a huge plus when attacking the basket since most contact is not called.

3. He has to practice shooting free throws. He's averaging only 65.3%, which makes him reluctant to force opponents to foul him. Amare has shown that working on free throws can make a huge difference.

4. He needs to improve his outside shooting and extend his range. Right now he hits 32.4% for three, but getting into the 38% plus range would force opponents to come out to cover him.

5. He needs to work on keeping his dribble low and protecting the ball in the lane.

All of this stuff can be worked on over the summer. Unfortunately, we need it now.

 

[Covert Rain]

It's not too late for Diaw by any stretch. He shows flashes of the old Diaw. It's consintency. He reminds me of how I felt about James Jones for most of the year. Flashes but would dissapoint.

We still have 14 games for Diaw to tune up. It's not like he has lost his skills. The one thing about Diaw I don't see this year is the confidence he showed last year. I think Diaw is going to come to play come playoff time. I really do.

 

[elindholm]

I told everyone that extending Boris last summer was a mistake

Damn, your selective memory is something else. Last time you made this claim, I refuted it by quoting your own words. If you want to keep up your schtick of claiming present-day omniscience over all matters, go ahead, but please don't keep saying "I told you so" when, in fact, you didn't. It's an insult to the intelligence of everyone else on this board.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I wasn't one of them.

Well, Burke sucks, of course, but he's on a minimum contract, so it doesn't matter. I always thought Jones was cheap enough that he was worth keeping even while he was struggling. Banks was obviously a mistake, but the Suns are stuck with him because they are too thin in the backcourt. Marion is a special case, but I don't think anyone says he sucks -- just that his weaknesses are unusually costly for a max-contract player.

Did we watch the same game? While Diaw was on the floor, there were several times that he did beat his man off the block, only to pass it back out upon reaching the rim. And when he wasn't doing that, he was sabotaging the offense with lazy, telegraphed passes.

Not exactly. Nowitzki scored some of the time against Marion, but he also missed several. He lit up Diaw effortlessly. The experiment of having Diaw guard Nowitzki was worth trying, but it was a dismal failure. The reason Diaw didn't play late in the game was that there was no one he could guard.

No. His passing makes him special, but only to the extent that he gives the Suns a better shot. If he passes up a layup in order to reset the ball up top or throw it out of bounds, that's not unselfish. It's weak.

Being afraid of the basket isn't a skill.

It wasn't this game. He's been doing the same thing for three out of his four years in the league. It was last year that was the fluke, not last night.

This post is about as one sided as it gets. Yes, we did watch the same game, and he only beat his man a couple of times. Diaw only played a grand total of 19 minutes in game that featured 2 OT's because of his foul trouble, but also because he did not have a good game defensively. You act like he dominated the ball all game, and instead of making layups, he was making lazy passes and turning the ball over. Diaw had 0 turnovers last night.

Dirk scored at will against Marion as well. When Marion was playing good defense, it was when he was playing Josh Howard, and at times Jason Terry. Marion was allowing Dirk to go left, and he scored just as much on Marion as he did on Diaw last game. Even if Marion "made" it harder for Dirk to score, he still scored at will.

We agree that there are times that he needs to be more agressive, but claiming that he is afraid of the basket is "weak". Try to see both sides of a point, because when you are on end of a spectrum, you are usually wrong about things.

 

[azirish]

Damn, your selective memory is something else. Last time you made this claim, I refuted it by quoting your own words. If you want to keep up your schtick of claiming present-day omniscience over all matters, go ahead, but please don't keep saying "I told you so" when, in fact, you didn't. It's an insult to the intelligence of everyone else on this board.

There were two issues. How high was too much and should the Suns wait. You can quote my stuff on the first, but are ignoring the stuff I said on the second.

My argument was simple. I did not see any point in extending Diaw at a premium price because I did not believe he would get an above the MLE offer. I felt he was worth above the MLE, but for anyone to make such an offer it would mean offering so much they could be sure the Suns wouldn't match.

I pointed out that there were only three teams with "free" above the MLE (not needed to re-sign existing players) and that most teams would realize Boris is too much a product of the Suns system.

Over and over people were saying "JJ, JJ, JJ" on the fear that he would get some really stupid GM to give hims a really outrageious offer... I would then list the free agents I thought would have greater attractiveness to teams with lots of cap space.

I did not oppose an above the MLE. I thought they went a bit higher than they should have, though in retrospect they were a lot higher than they should be.

So as you said, I did not oppose resigning Boris. I just opposed how much they paid him. I did not see a necessity to sign since it seemed unlikely he'd get an offer for more than was being discussed. Why extend if that's all the player will get anyway and you are locked in?

Perhaps this is too nuanced for your taste.

 

[elindholm]

Diaw only played a grand total of 19 minutes in game that featured 2 OT's because of his foul trouble, but also because he did not have a good game defensively.

I'm pretty sure he had three fouls in the first half. That left 24+5+5=34 more minutes of potential playing time during which he picked up only one foul. His minutes were not limited to 19 by foul trouble.

You act like he dominated the ball all game

I never said any such thing.

and instead of making layups, he was making lazy passes and turning the ball over. Diaw had 0 turnovers last night.

You're right, I was too specific when using the term "turnover." I meant, more generally, "play that is significantly detrimental to the offense." He had plenty of those.

Dirk scored at will against Marion as well.

I'm sorry, but that just isn't true. Nowitzki shot 11-28 from the field, far below his average. Who was guarding him for those 17 misses? Marion, for most of them. Who was guarding him on the final plays at the end of regulation and the second overtime? Marion. I'm not saying Marion did a super job (although it was pretty good), but it was a hell of a lot better than Diaw's effort.

Try to see both sides of a point, because when you are on end of a spectrum, you are usually wrong about things.

Are you making an observation about me in particular, or did you just conveniently invent this aphorism on the spur of the moment?

 

[elindholm]

I did not oppose an above the MLE. I thought they went a bit higher than they should have,

As did many on this board...

though in retrospect they were a lot higher than they should be.

Yes, we can all see that now. You aren't the only one with 20-20 hindsight, just the only one to brag about it.

So as you said, I did not oppose resigning Boris. I just opposed how much they paid him. I did not see a necessity to sign since it seemed unlikely he'd get an offer for more than was being discussed. Why extend if that's all the player will get anyway and you are locked in?

Sure, I agree. I made the same argument about Marion when he was extended many years ago.

Perhaps this is too nuanced for your taste.

Or yours. What you've explained now, which is an accurate representation of your position last summer, is a lot tamer than your original claim of "I told everyone that extending Boris last summer was a mistake."

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I agree with Eric. Diaw is obsolete now that Amare is back.

His little kick out everytime he has a path to the lane being referred to a "skill" is about the funniest damn thing I have read on this board.

Honey, well I do have ED, I am soft as a frosty and can't finish the job, that's what makes me special.