I just watched the tape again, and...

[slanidrac16]

Most of us were realistic about this year, just hoping to see improvement and a competitive team. Nobody can deny we have both. It won't take a monumentous improvement for this team to get 7 to 9 wins, which most of us would have been thrilled with back in August.
The rest of the season hinges on Josh and the offense. If all of a sudden this offense starts to come anywhere near what Dennis Green envisions, this could be a very exciting November and December.
Please note: I did not mention the "P" word, since I promised not to do that until we reached .500, if ever. But just to be in the hunt come week 14 or 15 would be a huge improvement over the last few years, where by this time we were talking about who we were going to draft.

 

[Russ Smith]

Most of us were realistic about this year, just hoping to see improvement and a competitive team. Nobody can deny we have both. It won't take a monumentous improvement for this team to get 7 to 9 wins, which most of us would have been thrilled with back in August.
The rest of the season hinges on Josh and the offense. If all of a sudden this offense starts to come anywhere near what Dennis Green envisions, this could be a very exciting November and December.
Please note: I did not mention the "P" word, since I promised not to do that until we reached .500, if ever. But just to be in the hunt come week 14 or 15 would be a huge improvement over the last few years, where by this time we were talking about who we were going to draft.

Totally agree with you and Pete, if the offense clicks, look out. My fear is if it continues to struggle, we could see a defensive letdown.

Hopefully that last drive gave Josh some confidence to go downfield and make more plays . If so this could be 1998 all over again with the offense suddenly clicking like we all expected earlier.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Obendajio

damnit, it's obafemi ayanbadejo! you people need to play more fantasy football...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I could, but then I would also have to rate the quality of the protection from their respective O-lines and the pressure taken off the QBs from the running game.

the chargers oline has always stunk. the browns have never had a run game. next.

 

[Cheesebeef]

the chargers oline has always stunk. the browns have never had a run game. next.

it also neglects to mention that in Brees second year - first full year as a starter - he had his team at 6-2 at this point also.

And why the hell would we WANT to compare JOsh to Couch - Couch was awful, and never really got better.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I'm honestly fed up with these statistical comparisons because they're completely misleading. All we need to look at is the fact that we're 3-5 and near last in the league in nearly ever passing category. It's only a matter of time before THIS _Guy gets involved and brings up Shaun King's stats after his first eleven starts.

 

[BACH]

the chargers oline has always stunk. the browns have never had a run game. next.

Try and do a 180 on that one. the chargers have LT and the Brown had a pretty good O-line in front of Couch.

My point is... The three QBs have the same number, but for some reason people think McCown's numbers should be better because he's got better receivers. That might be true, but why doesn't Brees have better production - he had LT and Couch had a better O-line than both Brees and McCown.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Try and do a 180 on that one. the chargers have LT and the Brown had a pretty good O-line in front of Couch.

My point is... The three QBs have the same number, but for some reason people think McCown's numbers should be better because he's got better receivers. That might be true, but why doesn't Brees have better production - he had LT and Couch had a better O-line than both Brees and McCown.

maybe b/c the receivers have a more direct effect on the passing game than do either the rb or the line. though i'd be inclined to say that the line might be just as important as wrs. the lt argument is considerably less weighty.

 

[Russ Smith]

Try and do a 180 on that one. the chargers have LT and the Brown had a pretty good O-line in front of Couch.

My point is... The three QBs have the same number, but for some reason people think McCown's numbers should be better because he's got better receivers. That might be true, but why doesn't Brees have better production - he had LT and Couch had a better O-line than both Brees and McCown.

Hang on, you were talking about a comparison of the first X games, I think 10 for their careers. Couch's first 10 games he played for an OL that allowed him to be sacked 56 times, in 15 games, 14 starts. Now I would bet that a lot of that was because he was a rookie, but since we're not allowed to blame some of OUR OL problems on Josh, we can't blame Cleveland's on Couch either to be consistent.

Add in that Couch did that in 1999 and the year before the Browns OL didn't EXIST because they were a first year franchise. Was the first OL in the new Browns history really any better than ours?

Per CNNSI.com the 1999 Browns starting OL was.....

LT Roman Oben
LG Jim Pyne
C Dave Wohlabaugh
RG Everett Lindsay
RT Steve Zahursky

Outside of having a future OL coaching star, I'm not sure it's fair to say that OL was better than ours. They allowed over 60 sacks, their starting RB's averaged 3.5 and 3.0 YPC respectively, 29th in passing yards, 31st in rushing yards, 2-14 record overall. They replaced 3 starters on the OL the next season per CNNSI again.

Not a big Couch fan myself but his first 10 games were under MUCH worse conditions than Josh' have been, first year franchise, no RB's, Chris Palmer as coach, thrown to the wolves.

 

[Duckjake]

damnit, it's obafemi ayanbadejo! you people need to play more fantasy football...

Or as we say in South Texas: Olahomey! Ayebendejo!

Speaking of knowing the players I impressed my son today when he was playing Madden 2002 by identifying all the Cardinal players by their jersey number.

 

[This_Guy]

Not a big Couch fan myself but his first 10 games were under MUCH worse conditions than Josh' have been, first year franchise, no RB's, Chris Palmer as coach, thrown to the wolves.

Yet it still compares a rookie starting in his first week in the league for an expansion team to a 3rd year QB with at least 1 if not 2 pro bowl caliber receivers.

 

[Redheart]

One of those recievers has played ONE game this season, and he was NOT 100%.

The other "Pro-Bowl" receiver is a ROOKIE playing in his FIRST year.

Sheesh. That is just and ABSURD point.

 

[This_Guy]

One of those recievers has played ONE game this season, and he was NOT 100%.

The other "Pro-Bowl" receiver is a ROOKIE playing in his FIRST year.

Sheesh. That is just and ABSURD point.

Boldin has played in two games, and you could make a good argument that those were McCown's worst games.

That, and both Fitz and Boldin have gone up and made GREAT adjustments to poor passes or balls thrown into coverage, would you not agree?? I can cite a good number of examples off the top of my head....

You are kidding yourself if you think Fitz and Boldin haven't helped McCown's numbers, while Couch top 2 receivers Kevin Johnson and Darrin Chiavirini (who?) were not as helpful to Couch's statistics.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

The roughing the passer penalty on the interception was ridiculous, and Fitzgerald pushed off. Enough said.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

The roughing the passer penalty on the interception was ridiculous, and Fitzgerald pushed off. Enough said.

First, welcome to all who said thank you.

Second, to the gentleman who asked about Feely's last pass, it was not tipped. It looks like it slipped out of his hand.

Third, to the Devil, Boldin was CLEARLY interfered with on the interception. So the roughing-the-passer penalty is a moot point. If they had called the interference, it would have been the same result.

And, Fitz barely touched the DB on the last Cardinal touchdown. He'll get away with that 10 time out of 10. Just like DBs still get away with illegal contact after 5 yards.

 

[AzCards21]

The roughing the passer penalty on the interception was ridiculous, and Fitzgerald pushed off. Enough said.

Let's just forget the facemask on Boldin. And let's just ignore the two block in the back penalties that weren't called. I didn't see anything Fitz did that Irvin didn't make a career out of.

You're a fan of who?

 

[ajcardfan]

The roughing the passer penalty on the interception was ridiculous, and Fitzgerald pushed off. Enough said.

Whoopty-fricking-doo.

There's not a team in the NFL that can't give you a list of bad calls against them longer than your arm. And, it's only the halfway point of the season.

 

[Russ Smith]

You are kidding yourself if you think Fitz and Boldin haven't helped McCown's numbers, while Couch top 2 receivers Kevin Johnson and Darrin Chiavirini (who?) were not as helpful to Couch's statistics.

Speaking of Couch, if he has his surgery and his arm heals I wonder if he'll get a look from Green next year? Supposedly the Bears decided he's just not healthy and his agent is sending him to Dr Andrews for either surgery or more rehab.

 

[BACH]

Per CNNSI.com the 1999 Browns starting OL was.....

LT Roman Oben
LG Jim Pyne
C Dave Wohlabaugh
RG Everett Lindsay
RT Steve Zahursky

Outside of having a future OL coaching star, I'm not sure it's fair to say that OL was better than ours. They allowed over 60 sacks, their starting RB's averaged 3.5 and 3.0 YPC respectively, 29th in passing yards, 31st in rushing yards, 2-14 record overall. They replaced 3 starters on the OL the next season per CNNSI again.

Not a big Couch fan myself but his first 10 games were under MUCH worse conditions than Josh' have been, first year franchise, no RB's, Chris Palmer as coach, thrown to the wolves.

Okay, that's not the list that I got. I've got Lomas Brown and Orlando Brown at tackles according på TSN magazine from that year.

 

[slanidrac16]

First, welcome to all who said thank you.

Second, to the gentleman who asked about Feely's last pass, it was not tipped. It looks like it slipped out of his hand.

Third, to the Devil, Boldin was CLEARLY interfered with on the interception. So the roughing-the-passer penalty is a moot point. If they had called the interference, it would have been the same result.

And, Fitz barely touched the DB on the last Cardinal touchdown. He'll get away with that 10 time out of 10. Just like DBs still get away with illegal contact after 5 yards.

First, I didn't say thanks, so A heartfelt belated thanks.

Third, I can confirm. I watch that play 10 times in slow motion and the defender had his arm wrapped around Boldins head BEFORE the ball arrived. CLEARLY a blown call.

Fourth, Fitz had his arms and hands in front of him while running(like everybody does). The defender allows the "cushion" to reduce to a contact point as he is in a slow pack peddle. Fitz stops, turns then leaps. The defenders backward momentum didn't allow him to react to what Fitz was able to do going forward. No call, and that was the right call.

 

[Redheart]

Boldin has played in two games, and you could make a good argument that those were McCown's worst games.

That, and both Fitz and Boldin have gone up and made GREAT adjustments to poor passes or balls thrown into coverage, would you not agree?? I can cite a good number of examples off the top of my head....

You are kidding yourself if you think Fitz and Boldin haven't helped McCown's numbers, while Couch top 2 receivers Kevin Johnson and Darrin Chiavirini (who?) were not as helpful to Couch's statistics.

Neither player is playing anywhere close to pro-bowl level. One is a rookie who was hurt through-out preseason and probably is STILL not 100%. The other has just come back from major knee surgery, and still has not played a FULL game and is definitely not 100%

I said it was it was an absurd comparrison and that was being kind.