More trades coming for Suns and Knicks?
By Chad Ford
NBA Insider
Send an Email to Chad Ford Tuesday, January 6
Updated: January 6
10:46 AM ET
Stunned.
That's the only way to describe my reaction when sources told me on Monday morning that the Suns had sent Stephon Marbury, Penny Hardaway and Cezary Trybanski to the Knicks for Antonio McDyess, Charlie Ward, Howard Eisley, Maciej Lampe, the draft rights to Milos Vujanic, two first-rounders, including an unprotected Knicks' first this year, and cash.
The trade meant many things that were essentially inconceivable two weeks ago.
Within a space of two weeks, Isiah Thomas found a way to trade two players who were thought to be virtually untradeable -- Clarence Weatherspoon and Howard Eisley -- and a number of spare parts -- Antonio McDyess, Charlie Ward, Maciej Lampe -- and somehow parlayed them into the all-star point guard for whom Knicks fans had been clamoring the last few years and two of the better backup guards in the league in Hardaway and Moochie Norris.
Within a span of roughly 100 games, the Suns have gone from being the popular pick in the 2002 preseason as the worst team in the West to earning the title of best up-and-coming team in the league after pushing the Spurs to the brink in the first round of the playoffs last spring back to where we all thought they would be -- at the bottom of the well in the West.
In a league where things like the luxury tax, salary cap and long-term financial obligations really matter, the Knicks agreed to send roughly $16.8 million in guaranteed contracts to Phoenix while agreeing to take on roughly $123 million in salaries from two players. When Suns GM Bryan Colangelo calls those numbers "staggering," he's not kidding. I did a quick search through trades over the past five years and could not find a trade even close to that $100+ million disparity.
That also means that the Suns are on the verge of one of the biggest cap-clearing jobs in NBA history. Before Monday's trade, their payroll stood at around $66 million this year and was projected to fall at around $58 million in 2004. Currently their cap number is number is $61 million (once they dump Charlie Ward), and in the summer of 2004 it could be as low as $36 million. Add in the cash the Knicks threw in, and the Suns netted roughly $10 million extra from the trade this season, and slashed $22 million from payroll next year.
Knicks GM Isiah Thomas wants to make more moves, but he's running out of trade bait.
Say what you will about Isiah Thomas, but he did more in two weeks than Scott Layden was able to get done in two-plus years. The difference? Sources claim Layden had numerous offers on the table but was paralyzed with fear about ever pulling the trigger. He felt his leash was short and he couldn't afford to make another big mistake via trade. He also was under pressure from owner James Dolan to start cutting costs, which would've made a deal like the one Thomas pulled off impossible.
Thomas feels no such pressure. Dolan empowered him to go out and remake the team in his image, at whatever the cost. Thomas hasn't hesitated. Whatever you think about the huge amount of salaries the Knicks swallowed ($92.8 million in guaranteed salaries in '04-05; $83.98 million in guaranteed salaries in '05-06) or the fact that Thomas mortgaged the future to make this trade, there's no question Thomas has made this team much more talented -- on paper anyway.
With that said, Isiah better be right. Having an owner with unlimited funds is both a blessing and a curse. Only two other owners in the league, Mark Cuban and Paul Allen, probably had the wherewithal to pull the trigger on a trade like this. The ability to transcend the salary cap obviously creates jealousy among other GMs. But Thomas is quickly painting himself into a corner. He was able to make the trade he did because he had two players (McDyess and Ward) with expiring contracts.
Now that the trade is complete, the Knicks' flexibility has virtually vanished. Word is Thomas wants to give Kurt Thomas an extension, meaning Michael Doleac, Frank Williams, Michael Sweetney, Othella Harrington and Cezary Trybanski are the only guys left on the Knicks' roster who could be trade bait to a team looking to reduce its payroll. Combined, those five are due $8.8 million this year and $7.8 million next season. If Thomas tries to package them in a deal to get another big-time player (and word is that's exactly what he's trying to do) virtually every player on his team will be locked into a long-term deal. If this team fails to jel or compete for an championship, Thomas' wiggle room is gone, and he'll be stuck with very few options, much like Layden was the past few seasons.
The Suns better hope Kobe loves the desert. As I wrote on Monday, the Suns, with a little more maneuvering, should be able to make a strong push for Bryant next summer when he hits free agency. Before this trade, Kobe could talk about leaving the Lakers all he wanted, but where were the viable alternatives?
The Clippers? They have a nice core with Elton Brand and Corey Maggette, but if Kobe really wanted to flee the limelight, changing locker rooms in the Staples Center probably doesn't get it done. The Jazz? They have the cash, but somehow I don't think they'd have the stomach to bring in Kobe, even if he is acquitted of all charges. The Nuggets? Again, Kiki would love to have him, but it's a bit of PR nightmare considering Kobe's legal problems occurred in Colorado. The Spurs? They're not close to having enough cap room to pursue him. Kobe would have to take a $10 million a year pay cut to play for any team over the cap.
That leaves the Suns as, in my mind at least, the best alternative to the Lakers if Kobe decides to bolt. No, the Suns won't sign him if he's still enmeshed in his legal woes. But if his name is cleared by then, I think the Colangelo's won't balk. Kobe had a spotless past before the latest incident. If he can prove he was set up, I think it's pretty safe to say that he won't be causing in more problems.
If Kobe doesn't come to Phoenix, the other free-agent options out there aren't nearly as attractive. The Suns made this move with the idea that it would give them the flexibility to make a move or two to put them in contention for an NBA title. If they can't land a player of Kobe's caliber, however, I'm not sure that a core of Amare Stoudemire and Shawn Marion and a number of nice role players will be enough to get them there anytime soon.
The Suns are quickly catching up to the Mavericks and Pistons as the NBA's premiere embassy for international players. With Zarko Cabarkapa, Leandrinho Barbosa and Maciej Lampe in the fold, Milos Vujanic on the way and Italian coach Mike D'Antoni at the helm, expect the Suns to start resembling the Mavs and Kings offensively.
By the way, having D'Antoni as the coach of the Suns certainly doesn't hurt the team's chances of landing Kobe. Rumor has it Kobe wears No. 8 in honor of D'Antoni, who was a superstar in Italy when Kobe lived there as a kid. "I don't know," D'Antoni told the Sacramento Bee. "It sounds good. It's a great story. Kobe grew up there. We were killing people (on the basketball floor), killing his dad. We had a lot of fun. I've known Kobe forever. ... Maybe if he ever goes with a retro jersey from Italy, I can get some royalties."
Colangelo: "This was a fantasy deal"
Suns GM Bryan Colangelo could see the writing on the wall, and he didn't like what he saw.
"Basically we were a team with very few options," Colangelo told Insider on Monday. "We had so much long term money committed to Stephon, Penny and Shawn that we didn't have the flexibility to reshape the team the way we needed to. Now, we have lots of options."
Colangelo was nearing the end of his rope with the 12-22 Suns. He had already fired coach Frank Johnson, but the firing hadn't done much to stem the losing. The difficult decision before him was to either ride this thing out with the guys he had and hope they turned into a championship team or to take a once-in-a-lifetime deal -- move Marbury and Hardaway, clear $20 plus million off the books, go under the cap for the first time in awhile, pick up two draft picks and two top international prospects, and start fresh while keeping your two best young players -- Marion and Stoudemire -- together.
"It was really a fantasy trade for us," Colangelo said. "Losing Stephon is hard and means will likely take a step back this year, but when you look at the numbers and the financial flexability the trade really gave us, it was staggering. Combine that with all of the young prospects we received and it was a once in a lifetime deal. I honestly believe that our future is now brighter than it has ever been."
How can that be, considering the Suns gave away a 26-year-old all-star point guard and got nothing but Howard Eisley, expiring contracts, two young prospects and draft picks in return?
Start with the money. There has been serious pressure from owner Jerry Colangelo to get under the tax threshold for some time. The Suns payroll now stands at around $61 million, still $4 million over the projected $57 million threshold for the luxury tax. If possible, the Suns would like to make another move that allowed them to get below the threshold. They'd also like to get a little further under the cap for next summer, to give them more money to pursue a top-flight free agent. Even if they can't make a deal, the team netted nearly $10 million this season and saved $20 million next year by making the trade.
Then figure in Colangelo's love affairs with Lampe and Vujanic. "We really liked him in this year's draft," Colangelo said of Lampe. "I think he has the potential to be a very good center in the league. He's only 18, so you have to be patient, but we think he's got a bright future." Considering the Suns' other options at center are Jahidi White and Jake Voskuhl, expect Lampe to get the playing time he didn't receive in New York.
Colangelo, who visits Italy frequently, also is high on Vujanic, who happens to be playing in Bologna. "I'm really intrigued by his talent," Colangelo said. "He's got all the tools to be a really good point guard."
Colangelo said that he hasn't explored what it will take to get Vujanic to the Suns next season. Vujanic turned down a contract from the Knicks last season to play in Bologna and has hinted that he'll stay in Italy next season as well. However, Vujanic's biggest concern with the Knicks was playing time. He saw a logjam there at point guard and didn't want to mired at the end of the bench. Given the Suns' need, it appears that the opportunity is there for him to get significant playing time next season.
Don't count out Barbosa either as the possible point guard of the future for the Suns. Colangelo said that Barbosa would get the opportunity to win the starting point guard position this season. He had 27 points Monday night in his first start of the season, which could bode well for his future with the team. "We've seen enough of him to believe that he's got a bright future and has the talent to be a player in the league," Colangelo said. "I think we'll use the rest of the season to see what he can bring us."
Colangelo also didn't rule out re-signing McDyess when he hits the free-agent market this summer. "We've obviously always liked him and think, if he's healthy he could be a nice player for us," Colangelo told Insider. "I think we're going into the situation with Antonio with an open mind. We want to see how his knee holds up and whether he can regain the All-Star form he's played in the past."
Will Gugliotta be the next Sun to go?
Just hours before the Knicks, Suns trade went down, more rumors were flying that the Jazz and Suns were talking about a deal that would send Tom Gugliotta and draft picks to the Jazz. In return, the Suns would net more cap space. Now with the Suns within four million of getting under the $57 million luxury tax and two more first-round draft picks to work with, you have to believe that the Suns will be even more motivated to make this deal happen.
Tom Gugliotta
Power Forward
Phoenix Suns
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
20 2.8 2.2 0.9 .316 .750
The Jazz are roughly $8.7 million under the salary cap right now, meaning they can absorb a lot more salary than they have to send out in return. Since Gugliotta is in the last year of his contract, there are no long-term financial ramifications for the Jazz making the trade. They are essentially paying for draft picks.
Two different scenarios have been flying around. One has the Suns swapping Gugliotta ($11.9 million this year), the Knicks first-rounder and a Cavs first-round pick (top 13 protected) owned by the Suns to Utah for Keon Clark ($5 million this year). That move would shave seven million off the Suns' books immediately and get them well under the luxury-tax threshold for the season. Considering that teams that are under the threshold get substantial rebates from the league as well, the move could end up netting the Suns somewhere between $15 and $20 million.
The other scenario has the Suns sending Gugliotta, Jake Voskuhl ($1.5 million), Casey Jacobsen ($1 million) and the Knicks first-rounder to Utah for Clark and DeShawn Stevenson ($1.6 million). That trade gives Utah a couple of young players in Jacobsen and Voskuhl who could actually help the team without cutting deeply into their cap space for next season. What's the advantage for the Suns in the second scenario? Stevenson also becomes a free agent this summer. If the Suns waive him, they clear another $2.5 million under the cap, which they could use to help them lure a player like Kobe to Phoenix.
Continued.................
By Chad Ford
NBA Insider
Send an Email to Chad Ford Tuesday, January 6
Updated: January 6
10:46 AM ET
Stunned.
That's the only way to describe my reaction when sources told me on Monday morning that the Suns had sent Stephon Marbury, Penny Hardaway and Cezary Trybanski to the Knicks for Antonio McDyess, Charlie Ward, Howard Eisley, Maciej Lampe, the draft rights to Milos Vujanic, two first-rounders, including an unprotected Knicks' first this year, and cash.
The trade meant many things that were essentially inconceivable two weeks ago.
Within a space of two weeks, Isiah Thomas found a way to trade two players who were thought to be virtually untradeable -- Clarence Weatherspoon and Howard Eisley -- and a number of spare parts -- Antonio McDyess, Charlie Ward, Maciej Lampe -- and somehow parlayed them into the all-star point guard for whom Knicks fans had been clamoring the last few years and two of the better backup guards in the league in Hardaway and Moochie Norris.
Within a span of roughly 100 games, the Suns have gone from being the popular pick in the 2002 preseason as the worst team in the West to earning the title of best up-and-coming team in the league after pushing the Spurs to the brink in the first round of the playoffs last spring back to where we all thought they would be -- at the bottom of the well in the West.
In a league where things like the luxury tax, salary cap and long-term financial obligations really matter, the Knicks agreed to send roughly $16.8 million in guaranteed contracts to Phoenix while agreeing to take on roughly $123 million in salaries from two players. When Suns GM Bryan Colangelo calls those numbers "staggering," he's not kidding. I did a quick search through trades over the past five years and could not find a trade even close to that $100+ million disparity.
That also means that the Suns are on the verge of one of the biggest cap-clearing jobs in NBA history. Before Monday's trade, their payroll stood at around $66 million this year and was projected to fall at around $58 million in 2004. Currently their cap number is number is $61 million (once they dump Charlie Ward), and in the summer of 2004 it could be as low as $36 million. Add in the cash the Knicks threw in, and the Suns netted roughly $10 million extra from the trade this season, and slashed $22 million from payroll next year.
Knicks GM Isiah Thomas wants to make more moves, but he's running out of trade bait.
Say what you will about Isiah Thomas, but he did more in two weeks than Scott Layden was able to get done in two-plus years. The difference? Sources claim Layden had numerous offers on the table but was paralyzed with fear about ever pulling the trigger. He felt his leash was short and he couldn't afford to make another big mistake via trade. He also was under pressure from owner James Dolan to start cutting costs, which would've made a deal like the one Thomas pulled off impossible.
Thomas feels no such pressure. Dolan empowered him to go out and remake the team in his image, at whatever the cost. Thomas hasn't hesitated. Whatever you think about the huge amount of salaries the Knicks swallowed ($92.8 million in guaranteed salaries in '04-05; $83.98 million in guaranteed salaries in '05-06) or the fact that Thomas mortgaged the future to make this trade, there's no question Thomas has made this team much more talented -- on paper anyway.
With that said, Isiah better be right. Having an owner with unlimited funds is both a blessing and a curse. Only two other owners in the league, Mark Cuban and Paul Allen, probably had the wherewithal to pull the trigger on a trade like this. The ability to transcend the salary cap obviously creates jealousy among other GMs. But Thomas is quickly painting himself into a corner. He was able to make the trade he did because he had two players (McDyess and Ward) with expiring contracts.
Now that the trade is complete, the Knicks' flexibility has virtually vanished. Word is Thomas wants to give Kurt Thomas an extension, meaning Michael Doleac, Frank Williams, Michael Sweetney, Othella Harrington and Cezary Trybanski are the only guys left on the Knicks' roster who could be trade bait to a team looking to reduce its payroll. Combined, those five are due $8.8 million this year and $7.8 million next season. If Thomas tries to package them in a deal to get another big-time player (and word is that's exactly what he's trying to do) virtually every player on his team will be locked into a long-term deal. If this team fails to jel or compete for an championship, Thomas' wiggle room is gone, and he'll be stuck with very few options, much like Layden was the past few seasons.
The Suns better hope Kobe loves the desert. As I wrote on Monday, the Suns, with a little more maneuvering, should be able to make a strong push for Bryant next summer when he hits free agency. Before this trade, Kobe could talk about leaving the Lakers all he wanted, but where were the viable alternatives?
The Clippers? They have a nice core with Elton Brand and Corey Maggette, but if Kobe really wanted to flee the limelight, changing locker rooms in the Staples Center probably doesn't get it done. The Jazz? They have the cash, but somehow I don't think they'd have the stomach to bring in Kobe, even if he is acquitted of all charges. The Nuggets? Again, Kiki would love to have him, but it's a bit of PR nightmare considering Kobe's legal problems occurred in Colorado. The Spurs? They're not close to having enough cap room to pursue him. Kobe would have to take a $10 million a year pay cut to play for any team over the cap.
That leaves the Suns as, in my mind at least, the best alternative to the Lakers if Kobe decides to bolt. No, the Suns won't sign him if he's still enmeshed in his legal woes. But if his name is cleared by then, I think the Colangelo's won't balk. Kobe had a spotless past before the latest incident. If he can prove he was set up, I think it's pretty safe to say that he won't be causing in more problems.
If Kobe doesn't come to Phoenix, the other free-agent options out there aren't nearly as attractive. The Suns made this move with the idea that it would give them the flexibility to make a move or two to put them in contention for an NBA title. If they can't land a player of Kobe's caliber, however, I'm not sure that a core of Amare Stoudemire and Shawn Marion and a number of nice role players will be enough to get them there anytime soon.
The Suns are quickly catching up to the Mavericks and Pistons as the NBA's premiere embassy for international players. With Zarko Cabarkapa, Leandrinho Barbosa and Maciej Lampe in the fold, Milos Vujanic on the way and Italian coach Mike D'Antoni at the helm, expect the Suns to start resembling the Mavs and Kings offensively.
By the way, having D'Antoni as the coach of the Suns certainly doesn't hurt the team's chances of landing Kobe. Rumor has it Kobe wears No. 8 in honor of D'Antoni, who was a superstar in Italy when Kobe lived there as a kid. "I don't know," D'Antoni told the Sacramento Bee. "It sounds good. It's a great story. Kobe grew up there. We were killing people (on the basketball floor), killing his dad. We had a lot of fun. I've known Kobe forever. ... Maybe if he ever goes with a retro jersey from Italy, I can get some royalties."
Colangelo: "This was a fantasy deal"
Suns GM Bryan Colangelo could see the writing on the wall, and he didn't like what he saw.
"Basically we were a team with very few options," Colangelo told Insider on Monday. "We had so much long term money committed to Stephon, Penny and Shawn that we didn't have the flexibility to reshape the team the way we needed to. Now, we have lots of options."
Colangelo was nearing the end of his rope with the 12-22 Suns. He had already fired coach Frank Johnson, but the firing hadn't done much to stem the losing. The difficult decision before him was to either ride this thing out with the guys he had and hope they turned into a championship team or to take a once-in-a-lifetime deal -- move Marbury and Hardaway, clear $20 plus million off the books, go under the cap for the first time in awhile, pick up two draft picks and two top international prospects, and start fresh while keeping your two best young players -- Marion and Stoudemire -- together.
"It was really a fantasy trade for us," Colangelo said. "Losing Stephon is hard and means will likely take a step back this year, but when you look at the numbers and the financial flexability the trade really gave us, it was staggering. Combine that with all of the young prospects we received and it was a once in a lifetime deal. I honestly believe that our future is now brighter than it has ever been."
How can that be, considering the Suns gave away a 26-year-old all-star point guard and got nothing but Howard Eisley, expiring contracts, two young prospects and draft picks in return?
Start with the money. There has been serious pressure from owner Jerry Colangelo to get under the tax threshold for some time. The Suns payroll now stands at around $61 million, still $4 million over the projected $57 million threshold for the luxury tax. If possible, the Suns would like to make another move that allowed them to get below the threshold. They'd also like to get a little further under the cap for next summer, to give them more money to pursue a top-flight free agent. Even if they can't make a deal, the team netted nearly $10 million this season and saved $20 million next year by making the trade.
Then figure in Colangelo's love affairs with Lampe and Vujanic. "We really liked him in this year's draft," Colangelo said of Lampe. "I think he has the potential to be a very good center in the league. He's only 18, so you have to be patient, but we think he's got a bright future." Considering the Suns' other options at center are Jahidi White and Jake Voskuhl, expect Lampe to get the playing time he didn't receive in New York.
Colangelo, who visits Italy frequently, also is high on Vujanic, who happens to be playing in Bologna. "I'm really intrigued by his talent," Colangelo said. "He's got all the tools to be a really good point guard."
Colangelo said that he hasn't explored what it will take to get Vujanic to the Suns next season. Vujanic turned down a contract from the Knicks last season to play in Bologna and has hinted that he'll stay in Italy next season as well. However, Vujanic's biggest concern with the Knicks was playing time. He saw a logjam there at point guard and didn't want to mired at the end of the bench. Given the Suns' need, it appears that the opportunity is there for him to get significant playing time next season.
Don't count out Barbosa either as the possible point guard of the future for the Suns. Colangelo said that Barbosa would get the opportunity to win the starting point guard position this season. He had 27 points Monday night in his first start of the season, which could bode well for his future with the team. "We've seen enough of him to believe that he's got a bright future and has the talent to be a player in the league," Colangelo said. "I think we'll use the rest of the season to see what he can bring us."
Colangelo also didn't rule out re-signing McDyess when he hits the free-agent market this summer. "We've obviously always liked him and think, if he's healthy he could be a nice player for us," Colangelo told Insider. "I think we're going into the situation with Antonio with an open mind. We want to see how his knee holds up and whether he can regain the All-Star form he's played in the past."
Will Gugliotta be the next Sun to go?
Just hours before the Knicks, Suns trade went down, more rumors were flying that the Jazz and Suns were talking about a deal that would send Tom Gugliotta and draft picks to the Jazz. In return, the Suns would net more cap space. Now with the Suns within four million of getting under the $57 million luxury tax and two more first-round draft picks to work with, you have to believe that the Suns will be even more motivated to make this deal happen.
Tom Gugliotta
Power Forward
Phoenix Suns
Profile
2003-2004 SEASON STATISTICS
GM PPG RPG APG FG% FT%
20 2.8 2.2 0.9 .316 .750
The Jazz are roughly $8.7 million under the salary cap right now, meaning they can absorb a lot more salary than they have to send out in return. Since Gugliotta is in the last year of his contract, there are no long-term financial ramifications for the Jazz making the trade. They are essentially paying for draft picks.
Two different scenarios have been flying around. One has the Suns swapping Gugliotta ($11.9 million this year), the Knicks first-rounder and a Cavs first-round pick (top 13 protected) owned by the Suns to Utah for Keon Clark ($5 million this year). That move would shave seven million off the Suns' books immediately and get them well under the luxury-tax threshold for the season. Considering that teams that are under the threshold get substantial rebates from the league as well, the move could end up netting the Suns somewhere between $15 and $20 million.
The other scenario has the Suns sending Gugliotta, Jake Voskuhl ($1.5 million), Casey Jacobsen ($1 million) and the Knicks first-rounder to Utah for Clark and DeShawn Stevenson ($1.6 million). That trade gives Utah a couple of young players in Jacobsen and Voskuhl who could actually help the team without cutting deeply into their cap space for next season. What's the advantage for the Suns in the second scenario? Stevenson also becomes a free agent this summer. If the Suns waive him, they clear another $2.5 million under the cap, which they could use to help them lure a player like Kobe to Phoenix.
Continued.................
