Is it time to retire the football helmet?

RugbyMuffin

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http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/10381790/Is-it-time-to-retire-the-football-helmet?gt1=39002

As a rugby player I have thought about this situation a lot. Playing both football and rugby, I have played with a helmet, and without a helmet.

It definately creates a different "attitude" towards hitting.

The first thing in rugby we teach ex-football players is not to hit with their head. We tell them 1,000 times before they go out on the field, and they still make their first hit like a football player, then end up with a HUGE knot on there forehead. They usually stop hitting with their heads after that.

I was no exception to that rule, BTW, my first rugby game I shilacked some poor guy, and hit him with the crown of my head. OUCH. That was the last time I did that. I learned to tackle a different way, and then learned how to lay a big hit in a different fashion. It works. It keeps some (not all) the voilence of a "football hit".

So, in my opinion, the "pro" arguement that a helmet would force players to keep there head out of the action. I agree with that.



Where I see a problem with not having a helmet is that in rugby 90% of the time when there is contact, both parties are falling forward. Yes, sounds strange, but that is the situation. When I have the ball in rugby, I understand at that point it is me versus the 15 guys on the other team. There is no blocking in rugby. So, when I am know I am going into contact, I know that I am not breaking 15 tackles and running for the score. I need to keep possession of the ball, by going down to the ground in a controlled fashion so that after I hit the dirt my teammates can drive over me and clear the opposition away from the ball. The end result looks something like this, where I am the guy who had the ball, hit the dirt, had my teammates "ruck over", and clear the ball. (Sidenote: LOL, if you look closely you can see the guy that tackled the player in red is rabbit punching him in the gut. Man I love rugby!)

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Point being I am falling forward, and my opponent is falling foward with me.

In football, it is all about getting every inch you can. So, when a RB hits a pile, he is trying to get that last inch. Sometimes that results in him being put on his back and his head falling backwards and the back of his head hitting the ground with some force. This happens to QB's after they pass as well.

The act of your head snapping back, and the impact to the back of the head in that situation is VERY VERY VERY dangerous when you do not have a helmet on. Not to mention that fact that grassy turf, and artificial surfaces are very hard and unforgiving.

Thus in my opinion the "con" arguement would be that there is incident contact, and a style of the game that cannot be avoided that will cause head injuries that are not cause by one human hitting the other, but by a player hitting the ground in a dangerous fashion. Also, that fact that "fashion" of hitting the ground is unavoidable in football.

It is a good debate, and one I have talked about a lot.
 
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dreamcastrocks

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In a word, no.
 

Early

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When you go down with the ball, get tackled - Is the ball free then? I don't understand that rule at all. Can both teams fight for the ball? Like a kind of fumble?

It's cool in a different way that there are no blocks, that you have to "make blocks" by passing backwards and thereby clear space. In american football you only clear space with true blocking. I guess our version of that is the option play with backwards passing, it kinda reminds alot of rugby
 

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I've heard this argument before, and people who make the argument conveniently forget the very real facts that brought about helmets in the first place. Players were dying on the field. Yes, there are statistics that suggest the hits would be less fierce, but how do you account for the difference simply in how people approach the game? No, take those helmets off, and the first time there's a chance collision where a player cracks his skull and dies, you'd see everyone asking the same question: why'd they get rid of them in the first place?
 
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RugbyMuffin

RugbyMuffin

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When you go down with the ball, get tackled - Is the ball free then? I don't understand that rule at all. Can both teams fight for the ball? Like a kind of fumble?

It's cool in a different way that there are no blocks, that you have to "make blocks" by passing backwards and thereby clear space. In american football you only clear space with true blocking. I guess our version of that is the option play with backwards passing, it kinda reminds alot of rugby

Yes the ball is free, but since "a ruck has been formed" you cannot simply pick the ball up if you are inside said ruck. So, both team form the ruck and trying to push the other team away from the ball. Once one team is far enough over the ball they "lock out" to secure possesion and another player (usally the scrumhalf (kinda like a QB)) comes in and gets the ball out.

Yes, very complicated, yet simple once you play the game.
 
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Not going to happen! If anything, additional protection will come through rule changes.

Also there will be movement to protect the head even more, not less - I envision a HANS system of some sort (like NASCAR) where a guys helmet will be strapped to the shoulder pads, or something.
 
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SoCal Cardfan

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Not going to happen! If anything, additional protection will come through rule changes.

Also there will be movement will be to protect the head even more, not less - I envision a HANS system of some sort (like NASCAR) where a guys helmet will be strapped to the shoulder pads, or something.


At the rate they are wussifying the game, they will soon all turn in their gear and be issued a X-box gamepad.. I hear that's why Jones put in the Monster Big Screen in Dallas. :D
 

LittleDavis

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Interesting debate but no way. These are such different sports. I played MLB in college until I kept getting hip flexors and was advised to give it up and then played hooker in rugby. Rugby was great but not at all the same mindset. The impact is much less violent. The ruck is a slow process and not nearly as violent as a run play up the gut.
 

Early

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Yes the ball is free, but since "a ruck has been formed" you cannot simply pick the ball up if you are inside said ruck. So, both team form the ruck and trying to push the other team away from the ball. Once one team is far enough over the ball they "lock out" to secure possesion and another player (usally the scrumhalf (kinda like a QB)) comes in and gets the ball out.

Yes, very complicated, yet simple once you play the game.

Sounds very strange.... It sounds as there are many situations where the ball is half half as to say... And it sounds like it is easy to cheat and get the ball to your team

if you lose the ball, can you pick it up again and run with it?

This is very hard to understand. In football all 22 players would fall on it instantly and the first one always gets it offcourse.
 
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RugbyMuffin

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Sounds very strange.... It sounds as there are many situations where the ball is half half as to say... And it sounds like it is easy to cheat and get the ball to your team

if you lose the ball, can you pick it up again and run with it?

This is very hard to understand. In football all 22 players would fall on it instantly and the first one always gets it offcourse.

It is relatively easy to cheat since there are 30 players and 1 ref. But in rugby the rules are policed by the players, so to speak.

If you lose the ball in open play anyone, including yourself, can pick it up.

If you lose the ball in a ruck then you are S.O.L. and need to retreat back to your side of the ruck and get ready for when the opposite takes the ball out of the ruck.
 

Doug

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If the NFL follows through with the most recent idea to take away helmets for team practices during the season than I may just stop watching altogether.Why do they want to keep ruining the game.

Yes the athletes are getting bigger,faster,stronger than ever before and you can't say where a guys head is gonna be in a tackle situation or most of the times in my circumstances when a concussion occurs it involves a head and a knee coming together.Like in Tim Tebows last concussion he got.

Many a knee and head have come together and most of the time a knee wins out.Sometimes the knee loses also.A bent knee in the side of the helmet or very back of the helmet is a sure fire way to get a concussion.We must keep trying to improve the helmet but there is no way to lock the brain in position in that helmet so its gonna keep having concussions.

I wore a horse collar for protection like you maybe can remember in the past.Boy I'm giving my time away.Remember Bosworth wearing a horse collar? Many offensive lineman wore them.I even think Conrad Dobler wore one.Many lineman wore them in my day.Not so many if any wear them today.

Sometimes a coach must have full contact scrimmages to see where certain players are at before putting them in a game for the first time for that team.He may not be the head hunter you thought you drafted and may need in the middle of the season as a replacement and if we can't use helmets in practice anymore during the season you eliminate the coach from finding out if that player is ready or not.

Leave the game alone.Its dangerous and always will be.Players sign a paper taking all the risks when they want to play the game.I could'nt be more sorry for all the highschool accidents and the things that are almost just FREAK plays that leaves kids today as quadriplegic and many other head trauma injuries.Thats why the parent needs to be involved in making the decision if there kid is ready physically and mentally to play.In case something does happen.

Many a kid are'nt developed enough in my opinion(as we all grow at different rates and ages) to play the game their dad played and loved at the time the kid wants to play.Muscles just have'nt developed and the kids neck and other areas are in big danger if he does'nt know what he's doing.

As a past player,I just don't want to see our game watered down anymore.TEACH the proper technique of tackling.Not with your head but with your shoulder's.Thats the key.You can still get many shoulder injuries for life too.Nothing about this game is easy.Even old pro's like the CARDINALS regress and start dropping the head trying to make a tackle and they bounce off and many more yards are gained by the runner or reciever.So it's always tough to keep your mind right while playing.Every play is different.

Collisions happen in many different ways and you just can't time them.Its also part of why we love the violent game that it is today.Sorry to admit.
 

cardpa

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Lets go back to these, very manly!
 

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RonF

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Rugby is no game for those who may be claustrophobic. Man, I had an attack just looking at the picture. :)
 

vince56

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The new helmet designs like the ION 4D and Revolution Speed coming out are reducing impact to the head substantially and reducing concussions. No way the NFL ever goes away from a helmet, they'll just keep getting better.

ION 4D:
http://www.schuttsports.com/aspx/Sport/ProductCatalog.aspx?id=787

Revolution Speed:
http://www.riddell1.com/newsite/product_info.php?cPath=104_76&products_id=1605

Several Cardinals wear the Rev Speed this year. Adrian Wilson comes to mind. I haven't seen anyone in the ION 4D yet, but everything I've read says it has superior impact resistance.
 

Milgod

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Well, that explains a lot. :D

Frickin' hookers.....crazy as the day is long.
Tell me about it. I played tight head for the whole of secondary school.

As for the helmet, I think they need to get better, not get rid.

What does annoy me is the constant defending of American Football in this country. 9 out of 10 people I talk to about it would say it is a wussy sport because they wear pads.
 

vince56

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Ask Conrad Dobler what he thinks of a statement like that, Milgod.
 

LittleDavis

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I had two concussions because of helmet to helmet with a 240 lb. fullback. Everything turned white for several seconds and then stars, headaches and nausea. I played many contact sports and football was the greatest force contact I have ever felt. I was only 215 playing LB and getting hit by 300lb guards pulling at full speed and you have to take that force and stand your ground. Playing Hooker in rugby during a scrum is such a different force, more like power lifting than absorbing a reverberating shock of a 300lb man hitting you at full force. Not to say rugby isn't violent but a scrum is more like stand up wrestling. There are a lot of broken bones and missing teeth though.
 

Renz

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If they want to stop players from leading with their head, keep the helmet, but lose the facemask. Players won't put their pretty faces in there if there's a chance they will get their teeth knocked out and noses broken.
 

moklerman

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If they want to stop players from leading with their head, keep the helmet, but lose the facemask. Players won't put their pretty faces in there if there's a chance they will get their teeth knocked out and noses broken.
If the face mask is taken away, won't that leave the face pretty exposed to getting hit by someone leading with their helmet? I would guess that spearing penalties would go way up.

If Dr. Death is given an opportunity to spear Peyton Manning in the face and knock him out of the game/season...
 

Duckjake

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Question. In Rugby How many times a game does a 6'5" 255lb guy who runs a 4.5 hit a 5'11" 225lb guy who runs a 4.4 running full speed? Or how many times does a 6'5" 225lb guy get hit from behind by a 6'3" 300lb guy running full speed?

Or how many times does a 6'2" 215lb guy with his feet off the ground and his arms outstretched get hit by an Adrian Wilson missile?
 

LittleDavis

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There are some big guys in Rugby...the point is that the tackling is different. We all played tackle when we were young. Rarely do you see a full out hit. The angles and objective is different. You aren't necessarily trying to break a tackle. You are continuously trying to move the ball up the field(kind of like soccer).
 

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