It's more or less happening as I was told

[AzStevenCal]

I don't know what everyone is concerned about. Sarver will sit back and let Josh Byrnes, his new GM, make all the future decisions. And I don't think there's a snowball's chance in Phoenix that the NBA will allow Sarver to relocate the team.

Steve

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ginobili? More like Calderon.

Right now Dragic isn't even good enough to be a starter. People are blinded by his fluke 4th quarter against the Spurs.

FLUKE, like Delk's 51 etc...

Dragic right now is clueless how to run the offense. He has 3 plays:

1. Dribble forever and drive to the basket to throw up a wildshot or actually make a good pass.
2. Dribble forever and take a bad jumpshot with a defender in his face.
3. Pass the ball to Barbosa who executes play #2.

For the most part in the playoffs Dragic was lucky to get his shots a yard close to the rim.

Listen I don't hate Dragic but he is clearly not STAR potential. You can say that about Curry, Rose, Rondo, Westbrook, Jennings, Collison etc but not Goran Dragic.

i explicitly stated that i didn't think he had superstar potential. i said in a best case scenario (which I don't believe ever happens) his CEILING is ginobili. again, i DO NOT see that happening, just stating what his TOP ability would allow. in other words, he can't become a jordan, lebron, duncan, wade, nowitzki, etc. level talent.

 

[slinslin]

I don't know what everyone is concerned about. Sarver will sit back and let Josh Byrnes, his new GM, make all the future decisions. And I don't think there's a snowball's chance in Phoenix that the NBA will allow Sarver to relocate the team.

Steve

Um the NBA will do anything for money. Teams that make a profit is way more important to David Stern and the NBA than tradition.

 

[slinslin]

Funny how Sarver wants to emulate the Spurs and thinks you don't need focal superstars but the Spurs had Robinson, Duncan, Parker and Ginobili all focal superstars surrounded by role players.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Um the NBA will do anything for money. Teams that make a profit is way more important to David Stern and the NBA than tradition.

Personally, I think you're making my case for me. The NBA is concerned about money and image and Phoenix makes more sense in both regards. They made their point with Seattle and I doubt you'll see them do that again. Also, San Diego is no Oklahoma City. It is the capitol of the fickle sports fan. Phoenix has been a very viable franchise and if it starts to look shaky it will be blamed on the owner not the city, IMO.

Steve

 

[slinslin]

Personally, I think you're making my case for me. The NBA is concerned about money and image and Phoenix makes more sense in both regards. They made their point with Seattle and I doubt you'll see them do that again. Also, San Diego is no Oklahoma City. It is the capitol of the fickle sports fan. Phoenix has been a very viable franchise and if it starts to look shaky it will be blamed on the owner not the city, IMO.

Steve

So? Do you know what happened to the Sonics?

None of what you said matters.

 

[joeshmo]

So? You initially offer 16M$ and then offer 32M$? That is just plain stupid business to raise your offer by 100%.

I know this is a football analogy but what you are talking about I assume is not out of the realm of possibility in any sports contracts. Marcelius Wiley was on the radio this morning and back in 2000 when he visited the Chargers their offer went from 20 mill to 40 mill within a matter of hours once the bidding started happening. I know for certain that happens in 99% of negotiations in football. Again that is just football but I assume that probably happens in any sport or high dollar negotiations.

 

[Gaddabout]

It should be noted Warrick's PER ranking was No. 34 for power forwards in 20 minutes a game last year. He actually had a lower defensive rebounding number than Amare. He's slightly better on the offensive boards.

Hollinger's most recent scouting report:

Scouting report: Warrick is a quick power forward with long arms but a thin frame. He's a below-average defensive player because he lacks the strength to battle against big power forwards on the blocks. Despite good leaping ability, he's also a mediocre rebounder and shot blocker. He needs to improve his pick-and-roll defense and should be doing better given his quickness and length. If he did, it would help offset his lack of physicality in the paint.

Offensively, he loves to set up at the elbows, especially on the right, and either shoot a jumper or make a quick drive and draw a foul. He'll also post up against smaller players when he gets a switch and can be effective shooting short-range hooks despite a lack of muscle. He can finish under the basket but tends to pick up traveling violations while winding up before he rises for the shot.

 

[jagu]

Ginobili? More like Calderon.

Right now Dragic isn't even good enough to be a starter. People are blinded by his fluke 4th quarter against the Spurs.

FLUKE, like Delk's 51 etc...

Dragic right now is clueless how to run the offense. He has 3 plays:

1. Dribble forever and drive to the basket to throw up a wildshot or actually make a good pass.
2. Dribble forever and take a bad jumpshot with a defender in his face.
3. Pass the ball to Barbosa who executes play #2.

For the most part in the playoffs Dragic was lucky to get his shots a yard close to the rim.

Listen I don't hate Dragic but he is clearly not STAR potential. You can say that about Wall, Curry, Rose, Rondo, Westbrook, Jennings, Collison etc but not Goran Dragic. He will never be a top 10 PG. I just named 7 and then there still is Rondo, Nash, Paul, Williams, Harris, Billups and future rookies.

I don't really make him into a superstar. Of course he isn't as bad as you make him out to be. Then again , someone who hangs off the jock of Amare and thinks he is the perfect basketball player probably cannot assess talent that well.

Dragic when he came into games did extremely well last year. He was flat out dominant many times on the court last year, not just the Spurs game. He has more to grow into but his court vision is pretty damn good now and he showed little fear in the playoffs. That with his size and defensive ability makes him a very good point guard. The only reason he passes to Barbosa is that he was the only other playmaker on the court with him at the time. It's not like he has many other offensive options on the court with him other than three point shooters who are stagnant.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

That's actually a good question. I suggest it should be Mark West running point with Sarver and a numbers cruncher in the background. West is actually very capable. He's a stockbroker by trade in his post-NBA career and very well-respected by the players and other GMs.

I wouldn't do that if I were Sarver either.

 

[slinslin]

Even when we lose Jason Richardson for nothing we won't be a FA player next season either now due to the signings of Frye and Warrick..

 

[elindholm]

Funny how Sarver wants to emulate the Spurs and thinks you don't need focal superstars but the Spurs had Robinson, Duncan, Parker and Ginobili all focal superstars surrounded by role players.

Of the Spurs' current big three, only one was a lottery pick. I agree with your position in general, but don't undercut yourself by ignoring facts in order to exaggerate your point.

 

[AzStevenCal]

None of what you said matters.

That's harsh. Just curious, does that apply to everything I've ever said or just my most recent post?

Steve

 

[slinslin]

That's harsh. Just curious, does that apply to everything I've ever said or just my most recent post?

Steve

Because everything you said applied to the Sonics as well but they were moved.

 

[slinslin]

Of the Spurs' current big three, only one was a lottery pick. I agree with your position in general, but don't undercut yourself by ignoring facts in order to exaggerate your point.

Yeah but only because foreigners were still wild cards at that time.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Because everything you said applied to the Sonics as well but they were moved.

Not so. There is no Oklahoma City sitting in the wings. OKC demonstrated following the Katrina devastation that they could easily support an NBA team. Also, the economy has turned and IMO Stern will not make the same mistake in Phoenix that he made in Seattle. I really believe that despite the OKC success story that if Stern could do it all over again he wouldn't have played hard ball with the city. And just because they screwed up and let one city lose a viable franchise does not mean they'll do it again.

Also, Phoenix has been a very successful franchise and that only changed once Sarver took the reins. It's a lot easier to look at this franchise and determine it's a problem of ownership. And I'll say it again, San Diego is not Oklahoma City.

Steve

 

[Go Devils]

"Moving"??? C'mon man... get real... Like, where? Kansas City? St Louis? Tampa Bay? Cincinnati? Las Vegas?

No f'n way...

San Diego... If they will build a real arena I would not bet against it happening.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Also, Phoenix has been a very successful franchise and that only changed once Sarver took the reins. It's a lot easier to look at this franchise and determine it's a problem of ownership. And I'll say it again, San Diego is not Oklahoma City.

Steve

This has to be a typo. They have been successful under Sarver too.

 

[Mainstreet]

sarver: "baaaaaaa, baaaaaaa, baaaaaaa"

(we need a sheep emoticon)

If you have read my posts in the past you would find that I have been one of the harshest critics of Sarver. I can't criticize Sarver on these two moves (Frye and Warrick) when I think they were logical in the light of Amare leaving.

 

[Mainstreet]

I know this is a football analogy but what you are talking about I assume is not out of the realm of possibility in any sports contracts. Marcelius Wiley was on the radio this morning and back in 2000 when he visited the Chargers their offer went from 20 mill to 40 mill within a matter of hours once the bidding started happening. I know for certain that happens in 99% of negotiations in football. Again that is just football but I assume that probably happens in any sport or high dollar negotiations.

You're on target especially with an unstable market and teams having lots of money to spend.

 

[AzStevenCal]

This has to be a typo. They have been successful under Sarver too.

I'm sorry, we were speaking about the hypothetical future that could lead to a franchise relocation. It's hard to sit in judgement of this franchise right now because this economy is so bad. I know they made some money this year but my understanding is they've lost money the previous few years.

Steve

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'm sorry, we were speaking about the hypothetical future that could lead to a franchise relocation. It's hard to sit in judgement of this franchise right now because this economy is so bad. I know they made some money this year but my understanding is they've lost money the previous few years.

Steve

The made money the year before as well with Shaq.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The made money the year before as well with Shaq.

You could be right, it's not something I pay a lot of attention to. I could have sworn that someone posted something to the contrary on this right after the playoffs but perhaps I misunderstood. Still, we were talking about a future where the team has become financially strapped.

Steve

 

[dreamcastrocks]

You could be right, it's not something I pay a lot of attention to. I could have sworn that someone posted something to the contrary on this right after the playoffs but perhaps I misunderstood. Still, we were talking about a future where the team has become financially strapped.

Steve

The Suns have always been this way, even with Colangelo. For some reason, Colangelo was never willing to go for broke with the Suns like he ironically did for the Diamondbacks.

 

[Gaddabout]

You could be right, it's not something I pay a lot of attention to. I could have sworn that someone posted something to the contrary on this right after the playoffs but perhaps I misunderstood. Still, we were talking about a future where the team has become financially strapped.

It hasn't been financially strapped because, for the most part, the Suns have made extended playoff runs. This has offset the luxury tax they've paid every year since Sarver's owned the team. This team will be the first year the Suns haven't paid the luxury tax since it was instituted, but they will still probably need a few home games in the playoffs to make a profit.

BTW, the Spurs biggest secret has been in their ability to make savvy long-term investments in foreign players. It's cost-effective and has set themselves up to improve in years when they haven't had great draft position. For example, they drafted Ginobli with the 57th pick in 1999 and were fine to let him mature in Italy for three years before bringing him over (when he decided to give the NBA a try).

The problem is MULTIPLE teams have been paying attention and adopted this strategy, the Suns among them. They actually probably should have waited on Dragic, but I think he ended up getting more playing time than anticipated.

That draft strategy still works for the Spurs but the days of getting the hidden gems are probably over. Overseas scouting has become a point of emphasis for everyone. Every team has their own overseas scouting report. When the Spurs first committed to it only them, the Suns and the Lakers (as I recall) had anyone committed full time to scouting over seas. And the Lakers/Suns were primarily focused on big men while the Spurs saw great backcourt talent, so we know who was smarter back then.