Jake Plummer was one win from the Super Bowl

[football karma]

The killer INT was the one before the first half -- and if Cardinal fans have seen that throw once out of Plummer, they have seen it a hundred times--

the throw just after everyone says to themselves -- "An interception here would be a disaster" -- and then viola.

Going into the half down two TDs lets the Broncos keep some semblance of the game plan -- but going down three TD's changes everything.

Jake made just enough plays to keep Denver vaguely in the game (seem familiar everyone?) -- but that weak armed floater on the out pattern just before the half was inexcusable.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

But there's four things you can't take away from Jake:

1. His heart and leadership on the field.
2. Toughness
3. Big play ability

He has several of the intangibles that a great QB must have.

Unfortunately for Plummer, he's just not a very good decision-maker.

And, "close but no cigar" doesn't cut it in football. The cardinals don't understand that because we haven't even sniffed the playoffs in a few years.

But if you think you'll be happy with a team that "consistently makes the playoffs" I think your wrong.

After a couple of seasons of that, you'll be saying, "man, I'd trade a couple of 6-10s for a ring".

That's why Jake will never be a great QB. Maybe not even very good. Because when you get to that level of the playoffs, pretenders like him get smoked out and exposed. He'll never get a ring, and I'm glad the cards jettisoned him.

 

[Duckjake]

But if you think you'll be happy with a team that "consistently makes the playoffs" I think your wrong.

I think we would for awhile. It's been so long without any postseason that it would probably take longer for most of us to get spoiled.

Still amazing that the Cardinals have won 15 of 48 games since Plummer left and won 15 of the last 48 games before Plummer left.

 

[Duckjake]

Amazing Ben's getting such great coaching but Maddox and Batch aren't.

At some point people are going to have to admit Ben has a LOT to do with the Steelers record the last 2 years. It's a great team, but what he's doing is unprecedented for a young QB.

Just like today, Cowher on 3rd and in FG range lets Ben throw, TD, Shanahan in the same situation, runs the ball and kicks the FG.

Cowher made the second round of the playoffs with Maddox. He made the AFC Championship twice with Kordell Stewart. IMO the guy gives everybody who plays for him great coaching.

BTW: In Dan Marino's second season the Dolphins were 14-2 and made the Super Bowl. What Roethlesberger has done is amazing but he'll have to be the winning QB in Detroit for it to be unprecedented. Oddly enough the two teams Miami beat to get to the Super Bowl were Pittsburgh and Seattle.

Pretty good Company though.

 

[Russ Smith]

Cowher made the second round of the playoffs with Maddox. He made the AFC Championship twice with Kordell Stewart. IMO the guy gives everybody who plays for him great coaching.

BTW: In Dan Marino's second season the Dolphins were 14-2 and made the Super Bowl. What Roethlesberger has done is amazing but he'll have to be the winning QB in Detroit for it to be unprecedented. Oddly enough the two teams Miami beat to get to the Super Bowl were Pittsburgh and Seattle.

Pretty good Company though.

he's the first QB in NFL history to start in the conference championship his first 2 seasons. That's what I meant by unprecedented.

 

[Redrage]

When Jake threw the Int on the out i looked at my dad and we both laughed. It seemed like he threw that same pick in every other game. Poor route by the receiver though.

 

[Stout]

Wow, first game I've seen Jake play in a long time. I think only his jersey's changed. Yeah, all those Jake lovers...step up and love now. The guy is just a bonehead. He's got guts, heart, and a tremendous will to win. He just doesn't have the QB brains to do it.

 

[jstadvl]

I'll step up.

the one Int. was a killer. The second was him not seeing the flat, as mentioned, and trying to do too much.The fumbles? Who do you blame?
The guy did some incredible things with tremendous defensive pressure on him today. Could he have played better? Yes. Does Peyton Manning suck because he made some of the same mistakes the week before? Go on, I dare you.
As mentioned by Derm,and some others, Plummer doesn't play D.
He could have played better, but didn't. Man, the AFC championship game!
Denver seemed confused, and beat, much of the day. Hats off to the Steelers.
The donkies will be back, just like the Pats and Colts. And they'll all have the same QB's at the helm.
His brains helped get them to this point. 'Nuff said? I think so.

 

[CardShark]

Yes Jake had a bad game with the int's, but the fumbles I would put squarely on his line not giving him protection. In reality, Pittsburghs defense is too good for the Broncos. They are faster and more aggressive. I've said before that Pittsburgh is not the team the Broncos should want to face, even at home. I thought Denvers defense would give them more of a chance than they did today. They seemed very ineffective against this type of team. I really don't think much of the Broncos receivers. They never really seemed to get open and the interception at the sideline was in part because the receiver didn't really go to the ball. He might of at least been able to knock it down. Hell, push the defender and take the penalty rather than just watching him catch it. If that was Boldin, it would 've been a whole lot tougher pick than it was. Lelie had one great catch and Moore is too old. The other pick was in part due to a great leap by the defender. It's easy to say that Jake shouldn't have made those throws, but Big Ben got away with making some throws he shouldn't have just as every QB in the league has. It was Plummers abilities COMBINED with the other elements of the Broncos team that got them to the AFC Championship game. Would he have done any better if he didn't have the flu, I don't know.

Cohwer is the coach I wish the Cards had. He really knows how to build a tough, sound and talented team. He and his staff know how to gameplan as well. They said they would contain Jake in the pocket and they did for the most part, reminiscent of the Cards gameplan for Michael Vick. They know he can be lethal when he's able to roll out and vulnerable in the pocket. The right team won today.

 

[Duckjake]

he's the first QB in NFL history to start in the conference championship his first 2 seasons. That's what I meant by unprecedented.

Sorry, you didn't mention that in your post.

There are a lot of similarities between the Steelers teams the last two years and the Dolphins in '83-'84. Solid defense, tough ground game without a marquee RB, 26-6 record, QB play far above what you would expect from a second year starter- Marino and Ben averaged a phenominal 9.0 and 8.9 yards per attempt.

Marino threw for 7,294 yards and 68 TD's with only 23 INT's his first two years in the NFL. Now that's a performance that may never be matched.

 

[Stout]

the one Int. was a killer. The second was him not seeing the flat, as mentioned, and trying to do too much.The fumbles? Who do you blame?
The guy did some incredible things with tremendous defensive pressure on him today. Could he have played better? Yes. Does Peyton Manning suck because he made some of the same mistakes the week before? Go on, I dare you.
As mentioned by Derm,and some others, Plummer doesn't play D.
He could have played better, but didn't. Man, the AFC championship game!
Denver seemed confused, and beat, much of the day. Hats off to the Steelers.
The donkies will be back, just like the Pats and Colts. And they'll all have the same QB's at the helm.
His brains helped get them to this point. 'Nuff said? I think so.

Each of his interceptions were balls that NO QB should throw. They were a 'doh, you mean more than ONE defender can be in the area' and a 'doh, you mean I can't throw it like a slowball to a covered receiver?'. They were bad interceptions. The fumbles he can get a bigger pass for but, like McCown, where's the ball security when you're getting hit. Manning didn't play NEARLY as bad as Jake, and had about twice as much pressure. Manning was running for his life on almost every play, and he still didn't play as bad as Jake. I mean, it's same old Jake. He'll get exposed in the playoffs, and never, ever go to the big dance.

 

[duckfallas]

This was probably the best chance Plummer will ever have to get to the bowl. Even if he had played well, his team would have lost because the Steelers kicked Denver's ass in every way possible. I hope Bettis gets his ring. He deserves it.

 

[Russ Smith]

It's interesting to look at the posts on the Broncosfreak board, half are get a new QB we'll never get to the Super Bowl with Jake, and the other half are he didn't drop INT's and give up one 3rd down play after another, the defense did.

Something about Jake is polarizing, you either defend him to the end, or you want no part of him.

I haven't found the quote to verify it but someone mentioned that Shanahan was asked after the game about some of his conservative playcalls yesterday and said he'd been doing that all year and he only threw 7 INT's so obviously that's why I do that. In other words, I don't trust the guy.

I really feel Denver's biggest need right now is a pass rusher, either DT or DE, they really ought to package their 2 first rounders with say a 3rd, and try to get up to get one of Williams, Hali or more likely Kiwi.

 

[Russ Smith]

The killer INT was the one before the first half -- and if Cardinal fans have seen that throw once out of Plummer, they have seen it a hundred times--

.

It was basically the same throw Ben made that was nearly picked by Champ, but Ben's throw had a bit more velocity. FWIW, Ward admitted that he grabbed Baileys arm to prevent him from making the pick, that's why he dropped it he only had 1 free arm. Great play, at worst you get a PI penalty, at best you get away with it, and catch the ricochet.

 

[john h]

he's the first QB in NFL history to start in the conference championship his first 2 seasons. That's what I meant by unprecedented.

Big Ben looks great. Pittsburg is a multi dimensional team with outstanding coaching. Best talent evaluators in the NFL. Everyone can look good on a "TEAM" like this. That was one of the best coaching plans I have witnessed in an NFL game (Steelers vs Denver). Denver looked even worse than the Cards in this game.

 

[conraddobler]

I still like Jake, still think he's fun to watch, he's never boring that's for sure.

I'm glad he's not our QB and at the same time I'm somewhat ticked we haven't majorly upgraded that area yet.

DG's biggest gift to the franchise, not drafting Big Ben... Whooooooa am I glad we passed on THAT GUY!

 

[Pariah]

I still like Jake, still think he's fun to watch, he's never boring that's for sure.

He sure did get out of a ton of sacks in the 4th Q. I thought for sure they had him dead-to-rights a few times and he just "snaked" out of it.

 

[conraddobler]

He sure did get out of a ton of sacks in the 4th Q. I thought for sure they had him dead-to-rights a few times and he just "snaked" out of it.

He did didn't he, still I think he was still tired from the flu or he's getting older cause he didn't fire out with the usual urgency the does down by 14.

Honestly I wanted him to at least make it close but he wasn't on yesterday. Does anyone doubt though that in that situation he's about the best hope you could have?

 

[Pariah]

in that situation he's about the best hope you could have?

You've got to remember, even 7 years (?) later, anyone who plays QB in Denver is still playing in the shadow of John Elway, who was hands-down the best come from behind QB in NFL history, IMO (and I can't stand him...but I gotta give him his due). So, while Jake may have been the best hope for Denver today, you know everyone in that stadium was thinking one of two things:

1. Elway never would have put us in this position
2. Even if he did, he would have gotten us out of it

Denver is arguably the toughest place in the league to be a QB because of Elway's legacy.

 

[Russ Smith]

He did didn't he, still I think he was still tired from the flu or he's getting older cause he didn't fire out with the usual urgency the does down by 14.

Honestly I wanted him to at least make it close but he wasn't on yesterday. Does anyone doubt though that in that situation he's about the best hope you could have?

He's the certainly got the most experience at digging a hole and then trying to get out of it

I guess Jake is still one win away from the Super Bowl.

 

[conraddobler]

He's the certainly got the most experience at digging a hole and then trying to get out of it

I guess Jake is still one win away from the Super Bowl.

I can still like watching a guy play cause of his heart and it helps a ton if he's not your own QB who's out there digging a hole for your own team.

He's a study in a flawed QB, someone with almost everything you want but he's always going to be missing something fundamental.

Guess the Denver guys salivating at getting him on the cheap from us thinking we were stupid understand now why they even got the chance.

 

[Duckjake]

He's the certainly got the most experience at digging a hole and then trying to get out of it

I guess Jake is still one win away from the Super Bowl.

Better than being 11 wins away from the Super Bowl like we are every year in Arizona.

 

[Russ Smith]

Better than being 11 wins away from the Super Bowl like we are every year in Arizona.

Absolutely. Everyone wants to play on a team good enough to get them to a Superbowl.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

My only problem that comes up in debate is that some seem to think that the situation/team in Pittsburg is about the same as we have here and therefore Big Ben would be successful here (or at least thats how it comes off anyways). Sorry but the 2 teams aren't comparable and Big Ben would have his struggles here because the way our team has been set up, QBs are set up to fail

Jeez, will you give any QB other than Josh McCown credit for anything? All we heard about duringf the last couple years is how Roethlisberger isn't that good and his success is due to his running game. Well, so far in the playoffs the Steelers have run for a whopping 3.2 YPC (same as the 2005 Cardinals) and the Steelers have been putting up a lot of points and winning road games against Top 10 defenses. Hell, even Hines Ward only has 10 receptions through these first three games.

But I'm sure that only has nothing to do with the quarterback.

 

[jstadvl]

I agree Mao. Give the kid his props.
He did get away with a couple yesterday that may have turned things around for the donkies. BUT, he did get away with them ,so, good for the team, Ben, and their fans.