Jimmer = Adam Morrison + JJ Redick

[Brian in Mesa]

The difference with golf, as an example, is that Tiger Woods is actually good/great..

That and the fact that he's only 1/4 black.

The media wanted him to be golf's great black player.

When he saw where this was headed, he went on TV and asked not to be called black. He's multi-racial. Considers himself "Cablinasian" because it includes all of his heritage.

 

[Covert Rain]

What a reach..

You stereotyping every white person as thinking of Jimmer as the next white hype is not. Right.

 

[Gee!]

That and the fact that he's only 1/4 black.

The media wanted him to be golf's great black player.

When he saw where this was headed, he went on TV and asked not to be called black. He's multi-racial. Considers himself "Cablinasian" because it includes all of his heritage.

He's still black and black people call him black..

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I'm white and to me Jimmer is a basketball player, not a "white" basketball player.

 

[Gee!]

You stereotyping every white person as thinking of Jimmer as the next white hype is not. Right.

I didnt do that.. In fact I brought up examples of Dirk and Jason Williams as counter points.. Your assessment of my stereotyping is incorrect...

 

[Covert Rain]

I didnt do that.. In fact I brought up examples of Dirk and Jason Williams as counter points.. Your assessment of my stereotyping is incorrect...

You said:

All white folks salivating over him... I see it everywhere...

The point Im trying to make here is that everytime a white guy comes in with a good college resume, he's the next great whiye hype.

I would say that is the very definition of stereotyping unless I misinterpreted what you said.

 

[Gee!]

You said:





I would say that is the very definition of stereotyping unless I misinterpreted what you said.

I think you must have..

I never said every white dude coming out of college sucks.. I said every time a good white guy comes out, people say he is/hope he is the next great white hope.. Its not me saying these things, I just hear people say it..

Dirk didnt go to college, he's a Euro so this is a non issue.. The point of me saying these two players (with Jason Williams) is because they were actually good..

I think your thinking too deep into it or something..

 

[Covert Rain]

I think you must have..

I never said every white dude coming out of college sucks.. I said every time a good white guy comes out, people say he is/hope he is the next great white hope.. Its not me saying these things, I just hear people say it..

When did I say you even said that?? What I did say you said was this:

"All White folks".

"everytime a white guy comes in with a good college resume, he's the next great whiye hype"

I am taking that to mean that you think all white people take this stance because the players are white. You didn't say that you "hear" people saying that the first time. You said it.

So by "ALL" or "Every time" you mean you are saying it or even if you are saying that you hear white people saying these things is stereotyping. I happen to know alot of white people myself (being half white) and I hear plenty of white people slamming white players in the draft and picking black players as their favorite. Does it happen? I bet it does but it's far from "All" or "everytime". I see the reverse often as well.

For what it is worth none of the white people I know are looking for the next great white hype. None of them are prejudice or racist to hope the next great player should be white. They are just basketball fans period. I am not stupid enough to say there still isn't alot of racism out there but its far from "all" or "every time" with the white people I know and grew up with. Sounds more like what their grandparents might have thought.

Again...If I am way off base here and misunderstood my bad......it just didn't seem that way.

 

[TucsonDevil]

Back to the original point to the thread...

Put me in the Jimmer camp. I believe he will be a good player for years (if he remains healthy). He can shoot the lights out, and in the game of basketball - the team that scores the most wins. I don't believe he will make an All-Star team, but you don't have to in order to be considered a fantastic player (see Eddie Johnson, Jason Terry, etc).

BTW, I wanted to see the Suns draft Jimmer.

One last thing, can everyone stop saying "yeah, but Jimmer can't guard Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Derrick Rose, etc...." Can you tell me who can?

 

[Superbone]

One last thing, can everyone stop saying "yeah, but Jimmer can't guard Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Derrick Rose, etc...." Can you tell me who can?

Apparently, Shumpert.

 

[Gee!]

When did I say you even said that?? What I did say you said was this:

"All White folks".

"everytime a white guy comes in with a good college resume, he's the next great whiye hype"

I am taking that to mean that you think all white people take this stance because the players are white. You didn't say that you "hear" people saying that the first time. You said it.

So by "ALL" or "Every time" you mean you are saying it or even if you are saying that you hear white people saying these things is stereotyping. I happen to know alot of white people myself (being half white) and I hear plenty of white people slamming white players in the draft and picking black players as their favorite. Does it happen? I bet it does but it's far from "All" or "everytime". I see the reverse often as well.

For what it is worth none of the white people I know are looking for the next great white hype. None of them are prejudice or racist to hope the next great player should be white. They are just basketball fans period. I am not stupid enough to say there still isn't alot of racism out there but its far from "all" or "every time" with the white people I know and grew up with. Sounds more like what their grandparents might have thought.

Again...If I am way off base here and misunderstood my bad......it just didn't seem that way.

So your arguement is I said all people love the guy? Thats what were debating over? Of course that was an exagerration.. Im done.. But all the white people I know that love the guy are not basing it Jimmers skills rather their hope he becomes something.. There you go.. I worded it to specifications as not to be general.. This is stupid .. Done with this lil go around..

 

[Covert Rain]

So your arguement is I said all people love the guy? Thats what were debating over? Of course that was an exagerration.. Im done.. But all the white people I know that love the guy are not basing it Jimmers skills rather their hope he becomes something.. There you go.. I worded it to specifications as not to be general.. This is stupid .. Done with this lil go around..

There you go again. If you can't even see what it is your doing......man.....nevermind...you will never get it.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Jimmer Fredette = Hersey Hawkins + Stephen Curry

IMHO, Jimmer is just another prolific college scorer, like Hawkins or Curry. He led the nation in scoring and that's what got everyone's attention. Will he be a good pro? Time will tell.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Jimmer Fredette = Hersey Hawkins + Stephen Curry

IMHO, Jimmer is just another prolific college scorer, like Hawkins or Curry. He led the nation in scoring and that's what got everyone's attention. Will he be a good pro? Time will tell.

Hersey Hawkins + Stephen Curry??

He's going to be a hell of a player.

 

[Mulli]

Hersey Hawkins + Stephen Curry??

He's going to be a hell of a player.

Those dudes were white?

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Those dudes were white?

No. Did I miss some requirement that says you can only compare players of the same race? That's just ridiculous, IMHO.

 

[Gee!]

No. Did I miss some requirement that says you can only compare players of the same race? That's just ridiculous, IMHO.

Did you take a class from Pariah for passive aggressive posts?

 

[Covert Rain]

No. Did I miss some requirement that says you can only compare players of the same race? That's just ridiculous, IMHO.

You didn't get the memo?

Did you renew your membership to the "White Men Can't Jump" club? If not that is probably why. Gotta keep up with them membership dues.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Jason Terry could be a pretty good comparison to Jimmer.

I actually don't think the guy has no game. He goes to the rack much harder/faster than Reddick. There's no comparison between those guys. I'd just be worried that as a Suns fans we've been down that path before, where offense is valued over all else and I'm looking for the team to turn a corner on the road they've been on seemingly forever.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Jason Terry could be a pretty good comparison to Jimmer.

I actually don't think the guy has no game. He goes to the rack much harder/faster than Reddick. There's no comparison between those guys. I'd just be worried that as a Suns fans we've been down that path before, where offense is valued over all else and I'm looking for the team to turn a corner on the road they've been on seemingly forever.

I agree that's a bad thing but the one thing that would be worse than pursuing offense at the expense of defense is the reverse. The Spurs, for example, did NOT win championships because of their defense. They won championships because they had Duncan, Parker, Ginobili plus a solid supporting cast AND they played very good team defense. Switch those big three with excellent defense-only players and that team would have been in the lottery every year. As has been said before, we need balance more than anything.

Steve

 

[Errntknght]

I agree that's a bad thing but the one thing that would be worse than pursuing offense at the expense of defense is the reverse. The Spurs, for example, did NOT win championships because of their defense. They won championships because they had Duncan, Parker, Ginobili plus a solid supporting cast AND they played very good team defense. Switch those big three with excellent defense-only players and that team would have been in the lottery every year. As has been said before, we need balance more than anything.

Steve

I'd go a little further and say that we need mostly players that are individually fairly well balanced. I think its good to have a small number of defensive and offensive specialists but not a roster full of them - even if it winds up balanced.

I think it would have been fun to get Fredette but its probably better for the team that we didn't. IMO, he would finally be the backup we've needed for Nash but its too late for that to help enough to matter. Anything that tends to prolong Nashball is bad now and Jimmer could have done just that.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'd go a little further and say that we need mostly players that are individually fairly well balanced. I think its good to have a small number of defensive and offensive specialists but not a roster full of them - even if it winds up balanced.

I think it would have been fun to get Fredette but its probably better for the team that we didn't. IMO, he would finally be the backup we've needed for Nash but its too late for that to help enough to matter. Anything that tends to prolong Nashball is bad now and Jimmer could have done just that.

I agree with everything you say but especially the bolded part. It's nice to have a Barbosa type that can create his own offense or a Bruce Bowen type that you can bring in to cool down a shooter but a team of them does nothing for you.

Steve

 

[Errntknght]

Come to think of it, the Suns FO might be thinking the same way... 'Keif' seems to be fairly well balanced. At the time I was hoping for Singleton to be the pick - who seems to be a defensive specialist from the bits I've read and seen. Of course, there were so many negative comments on here I didn't really think much of the Morris twins. After he was ours I watched some YouTube videos and decided he was not as bad as I'd believed. Sheesh, we might wind up having to give the FO props for the choice...

 

[Covert Rain]

The Spurs, for example, did NOT win championships because of their defense. They won championships because they had Duncan, Parker, Ginobili plus a solid supporting cast AND they played very good team defense.
Steve

Chicken before the egg. Those players were excellent defensive players. They had good defensive players on the bench. They could play excellent team defense because they were good defensive players.

They absolutely won those titles because of their defense. They absolutely won those titles because they had good enough defensive players to play team defense.

I'd go a little further and say that we need mostly players that are individually fairly well balanced.

I posted some time back a list of the last 15 title winners. Many of them were amongst the best in the NBA in defense and many were mediocre offensively. I think it's very important to be a top defensive team for example but I don't think in general you need to be a top 5 offense that same year to win a title. I think you just have to be good enough to score when needed IMO. Good defense will usually keep you in most games.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Chicken before the egg. Those players were excellent defensive players. They had good defensive players on the bench. They could play excellent team defense because they were good defensive players.

They absolutely won those titles because of their defense. They absolutely won those titles because they had good enough defensive players to play team defense.

They were very solid defensively but they had an unstoppable offensive force down low in Duncan and two very good offensive players in Parker and Ginobili. Again, switch those three guys for 3 players that are weak on offense and even if the replacements are the 3 greatest defensive players of all time, that team goes to the lottery every year. I'll go a step further, just take Tim out and replace him with Dikembe and that team probably fails to win a championship, IMO.

Steve