Jurecki: Cards to add experience in F.O.

[DemsMyBoys]

Could it be that Mr. B is about to step down with his age and Michael assumes his role as owner and RG moves into Michael's role as President with a new GM coming to town? maybe?

I've been thinking along these same lines. One thing for sure: Change is in the air.

 

[perivolaki]

McFadden has always been a beast. As a rookie he was the guy who shut down Reggie Wayne on back to back plays to save the AFC title game in '05. He was the nickel his first two years and most consider the nickelback as a starter because they spend so much time on the field. By that standard, he has started every game he has played in a Steeler uni. Last year he started like 13/15 games, including the playoffs as the #2. quote]

First of all McFadden was injured for six games last year so I don't think he played in 13/15 as you stated. Second you seem to make up your own standard by saying playing nickle is the same as starting. He must have played nickle more than just two years because he hasn't had many starts in his career.

How would You compare McFadden to Deuce Lutui? You gave Deuce a bust rating and he has started 40 games while McFadden has started 18 games and has played one more season. Or how would he compare him to Antrel Rolle. Both were in the 2005 draft but Rolle has 265 tackles and 8 interceptions over his career while McFadden has only 135 tackles and 7 interceptions.

Using your criteria Rolle, who has started way more than McFadden, was probably covering the better receivers because as you say McFadden was the nickle back. This would mean he was matched up against the other teams 3rd receiver.

Again, I like McFadden but I can't just sit here and let you rank a guy a bust who has had a productive career like Deuce. My sense is you probably wouldn't rank Rolle very high either. When you look at the stats Rolle has had at least, if not more, of a productive career than McFadden with twice as many tackles.

 

[perivolaki]

McFadden has always been a beast./quote]

If McFadden is a beast why the 2 year 10 million dollar contract?

I'm not trying to bust you chops it's just that I think people dislike our FO so much that they discount everything that is done. Your rankings reflect that.

You gave Deuce a bust, but lets be fair about it. If Deuce was a free agent at the start of the 2009 free agent period do you think he would have got a better or worse contract offer than McFadden?

Lets remember that a lot of the people on this board didn't really give Antonio Smith much credit. He got a 5 year 35 million dollar contract from the Texans.

I think Deuce, who you classify as a bust, would get a long term contract for a substantial pile of cash if he was a free agent this year.

McFadden only has the first year guaranteed and even that isn't completely guaranteed. He got a 1 million signing bonus, 3.75 salary and a 250 K workout bonus. Why the workout bonus? Whis and company know him from Pittsburgh. If hes all that and a bag of chips why the 2 year contract, and why the workout bonus, and only 5 million guaranteed.

With the huge price corners were fetching this offseason a "beast" as you called him would have had a contract more in line with the one Antonio Smith signed not the one McFadden signed.

This isn't me making this judgement, thats the whole NFL who had a chance to sign McFadden and didn't. Just be fair to our FO and to our FO and players.

And it's nothing personal, just trying to make a point.

 

[jaguarpaw81]

McFadden has always been a beast. As a rookie he was the guy who shut down Reggie Wayne on back to back plays to save the AFC title game in '05. He was the nickel his first two years and most consider the nickelback as a starter because they spend so much time on the field. By that standard, he has started every game he has played in a Steeler uni. Last year he started like 13/15 games, including the playoffs as the #2.

First of all McFadden was injured for six games last year so I don't think
he played in 13/15 as you stated.

Yes, he missed 6 games, my fault. I meant to say he started 11/13 games in which he played in last year.

Second you seem to make up your own standard by saying playing nickle is the same as starting. He must have played nickle more than just two years because he hasn't had many starts in his career.

I didn't make up anything. I dont understand what you're trying to say in the second sentence. He was drafted in '05. He was the nickel for 2 years and the starter last year.

How would You compare McFadden to Deuce Lutui? You gave Deuce a bust rating and he has started 40 games while McFadden has started 18 games and has played one more season.

Duece is another guy I was overly harsh on, but he has definitely underperformed. This guy was the 2nd guard taken in the draft that year and I think the 40th player taken overall. He was the worst lineman on one of the worst lines in the league last year. He plays undisciplined football from time to time and doesn't seem to give the same effort when Kurt is on the field that he did when his buddy Matty was the starter. Tell me how good you think he is next year when 7th round pick Brandon Keith is the starter this coming season. I dont want to trash the guy because I like, him but I am just being honest.

Or how would he compare him to Antrel Rolle. Both were in the 2005 draft but Rolle has 265 tackles and 8 interceptions over his career while McFadden has only 135 tackles and 7 interceptions. Using your criteria Rolle, who has started way more than McFadden, was probably covering the better receivers because as you say McFadden was the nickle back. This would mean he was matched up against the other teams 3rd receiver.

First, being the nickelback doesn't mean you play against the other team's 3rd reciever. Many times it means you are covering the slot, where guys like Anquan Boldin live.

Secondly, you aren't telling the whole story with those stats on Rolle. He was the nickel last year and a FS this year. He had 112 tackles and 2 picks as a #1 or #2 CB. He has 151 tackles and 6 picks as a nickel or FS. Also, tackles are not a relevant stat for a CB anyhow. Opp. QB comp %, PD and Ints are.

Finally, Rolle is a beast. You, however, using him in an arguement where you are attempting to defend Graves' and Keim's drafting talents is actually somewhat comical. Here is a guy who had Tampa 2/Press Corner written all over him coming out of Miami. What do we do? We draft him into Pendy's "10yds off the line" scheme and destine him to failure. Had he been drafted by Tampa or the Colts Rolle would be a multiple PBer by now. This was a similar scenario to drafting Calvin Pace, (a reach none the less, but) an obvious 3-4 OLB only to plug him in as a 4-3 DE and then blast him as a conttract player when he suddenly performs at a PB level in his natural position.

Again, I like McFadden but I can't just sit here and let you rank a guy a bust who has had a productive career like Deuce. My sense is you probably wouldn't rank Rolle very high either. When you look at the stats Rolle has had at least, if not more, of a productive career than McFadden with twice as many tackles.

I just dont know what to tell you anymore.

Without being an Cardinal fan, you would have had to have called Rolle a bust, as every sports media outlet on Earth has. The guy was the 8th pick in the draft. Is his lack of production his fault IMO, NO. But does that negate the fact that he still underproduced for his draft position? One would hope he has done better than McFadden, being as though he was picked 50 spots ahead of him.

 

[jaguarpaw81]

McFadden has always been a beast./quote]

If McFadden is a beast why the 2 year 10 million dollar contract?

You think that bums make 5 million a year???

I'm not trying to bust you chops it's just that I think people dislike our FO so much that they discount everything that is done. Your rankings reflect that.

I dont dislike our FO at all. I dont think they are nearly as bad as some would lead you to believe and I dont think they are half as great as others would say. Graves does some things very well and some things he doesn't IMO.

You gave Deuce a bust, but lets be fair about it. If Deuce was a free agent at the start of the 2009 free agent period do you think he would have got a better or worse contract offer than McFadden?

Are you really trying to compare a CB to an OL??? I guess Fitz sucks too since he only makes 2/3 of what Matt Cassel does and he has never been to the playoffs or a Pro Bowl.

btw- Alan Faneca was regarded by many as the best guard in the game when he left via FA last year and he only got 7 per. If you think you could get Duece more than 5 per then you really should be his agent.

Lets remember that a lot of the people on this board didn't really give Antonio Smith much credit. He got a 5 year 35 million dollar contract from the Texans.

His contract certainly didn't surprise me and I was unaware that it came to a shock to anyone else.

I think Deuce, who you classify as a bust, would get a long term contract for a substantial pile of cash if he was a free agent this year.

Could you be more specific about the $$. Every player in the NFL gets a substantial pile of cash IMO.

McFadden only has the first year guaranteed and even that isn't completely guaranteed. He got a 1 million signing bonus, 3.75 salary and a 250 K workout bonus. Why the workout bonus? Whis and company know him from Pittsburgh. If hes all that and a bag of chips why the 2 year contract, and why the workout bonus, and only 5 million guaranteed.

The 2 year contract was what McFADDEN wanted, not the Cards. He did that so he can get more money in a few years. If you're asking why the Cards didn't give him 100 million then I would have to give you the honest answer---he isn't a #1 lockdown CB. What more do you want???

With the huge price corners were fetching this offseason a "beast" as you called him would have had a contract more in line with the one Antonio Smith signed not the one McFadden signed.

What are you talking about? Please fill me in on all these "huge prices corners were fetching this offseason". Yes I know the Ravens overpaid for Foxworth, who doesn't know this. Please tell me another FA non-#1 CB who got a deal any better than McFadden'.

This isn't me making this judgement, thats the whole NFL who had a chance to sign McFadden and didn't. Just be fair to our FO and to our FO and players.

So your saying nobody else wanted McFadden? I dont get your drift.

And it's nothing personal, just trying to make a point.

Afyer all this typing, you are gonna have to buy me a beer if I ever meet you.

 

[azsouthendzone]

This might be the most hijacked theread ever.

 

[perivolaki]

Afyer all this typing, you are gonna have to buy me a beer if I ever meet you.

That I will do.