Keim/Bidwill smarter than the rest of the league or complete morons?

[MadCardDisease]

But they're not inaccurate. It's impossible to say that he was a "successful" college coach. He was fired by a second-tier Big 12 program and was eventually hired as a coordinator at USC.

He had Baker Mayfield and Patrick Mahomes and somehow couldn't make it work.

I like Kliff and obviously hope that he does well, but calling him what he is isn't wrong just because it makes you feel bad.

It's not like the offense didn't work with those two. I don't think the Cardinals hired KK to fix their D.

 

[PACardsFan]

The only thing that might be in favor of KK new offense is the recent rule changes that favor the offense.

I'm not sure Kyler Murray would have survived a game if he played 30 years ago when it was OK to level a QB 5 seconds after they got rid of the ball. These days QBs are protected like an endangered species (which in essence they are). QBs now are allowed to throw the ball away and it won't result in an intentional grounding penalty. You can no longer target a QB after they throw an INT. Remember the days when a big nasty Defensive lineman went straight to "Block" a QB and completely leveled them.

Not to long ago enforcer Safeties would patrol the middle of the field taking heads off of little WRs who dared entering their domain. Now it's a 15 yard penalty with massive fines included.

Rules like no contact 5 yards past the line of scrimmage are actually being enforced now making it more difficult for DB to latch onto WRs.

This is 100% correct. This is exactly how I explained why drafting Murray was our best bet. I'm an old traditionalist that loved 6'5" QB's that sat in the pocket & looked over his Olinemen. Where did that get me? Nowhere! Decade after decade of mostly mediocre football & that is being generous. It was time to look at where the NFL is currently at. MCD describes it accurately and succinctly. On top of that, Rosen will never be anything special. Easy decision. Maybe the easiest the Cardinals have ever had to make. I'm done watching crappy a$$ football. It was time for the Cardinals to move outside the box. It was time for me to do the same.

 

[kerouac9]

It's not like the offense didn't work with those two. I don't think the Cardinals hired KK to fix their D.

I have it on fairly good authority that it's extremely hard to not win 8 games or more if you have an NFL-caliber QB.

I'm pretty sure that Kingsbury was the coach of the ENTIRE Texas Tech team. Just because it makes you feel bad doesn't make it not true.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I have it on fairly good authority that it's extremely hard to not win 8 games or more if you have an NFL-caliber QB.

I'm pretty sure that Kingsbury was the coach of the ENTIRE Texas Tech team. Just because it makes you feel bad doesn't make it not true.

It doesn't make me feel bad. I'm just saying that KK had success as an Offensive guy and that is why he was brought to the Cardinals. It's also why they brought in an experienced NFL DC.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

People calling Kingsbury a failed college coach are myopic.

His responsibilities as a pro coach are way more limited, and it's obviously limited to what he does well, coach offensive football.

It's meant to slur/belittle the hiring.

Is it myopic when Mike Leach never had a losing record in 10 years at Texas Tech and won the Big 12 South one year?

 

[Hoodhero]

I hate the argument that he did nothing with Baker & Mahomes. It's not like Saban & co offered those guys anything coming out of high school. He is the one who saw potential & offered them a chance. The man knows talent @ QB & how to develop it. Not sure how many coaches have recruited 2 QB's that ended up ROTY & MVP in same season

 

[kerouac9]

I hate the argument that he did nothing with Baker & Mahomes. It's not like Saban & co offered those guys anything coming out of high school. He is the one who saw potential & offered them a chance. The man knows talent @ QB & how to develop it. Not sure how many coaches have recruited 2 QB's that ended up ROTY & MVP in same season

Saquon Barkley was rookie of the year.

And let's pump the brakes on Kingsbury being a QB whisperer. I hadn't seen this story before:

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...6/baker-mayfield-texas-tech-transfer-oklahoma

That's not a good look, although I'm sure there are extenuating circumstances. Mayfield WALKED ON at Tech and moved up the depth chart. Then Kingsbury dumped him for David Webb.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Probability/History suggests they are complete morons who are too desperate to find the McVay clone. This isn't even calculated risk...this is a swing for the fences experiment.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Kingsbury is running the offense he learned under the aforementioned Mike Leach but Leach ran it and was able to win. He’d have been a more qualified hire.

But then again, the Cards are trying to copy their rivals, Wilson and McVay.

If SF has a big year and George Kittle is the main reason, I’m betting the Cards take a TE in round 1 next year.

 

[Hoodhero]

Saquon Barkley was rookie of the year.

And let's pump the brakes on Kingsbury being a QB whisperer. I hadn't seen this story before:

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...6/baker-mayfield-texas-tech-transfer-oklahoma

That's not a good look, although I'm sure there are extenuating circumstances. Mayfield WALKED ON at Tech and moved up the depth chart. Then Kingsbury dumped him for David Webb.

My bad. It probably was PFWA rookie of year award. Forgot about Saquon with all Daniel Jones madness. Walk on or not, Baker got his start with KK.

 

[football karma]

lots to digest, but:

what does having short arms have anything to do with playing QB?


CBus: you are basically asking the "crazy, or visionary?" question. It cant be answered today.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

lots to digest, but:

what does having short arms have anything to do with playing QB?


CBus: you are basically asking the "crazy, or visionary?" question. It cant be answered today.

Arm length is an issue. Drew Brees and Wilson are the guys Murray is often used for comparison. Both those guys have very long arms. I’ve seen articles written about it. It gives them a higher release point.

I agree about the crazy question. I was just wanting opinions on what people thought and reasons they have faith in the Cards moves.

 

[DVontel]

lots to digest, but:

what does having short arms have anything to do with playing QB?


CBus: you are basically asking the "crazy, or visionary?" question. It cant be answered today.

It has absolutely nothing to do with it.

Everybody in this thread knows if we took a certain QB in this draft, this thread wouldn’t have even been made.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Arm length is an issue. Drew Brees and Wilson are the guys Murray is often used for comparison. Both those guys have very long arms. I’ve seen articles written about it. It gives them a higher release point.

I agree about the crazy question. I was just wanting opinions on what people thought and reasons they have faith in the Cards moves.

They have 2" longer arms. The odds of that making much of a difference is highly unlikely. Again Murray had among the fewest tipped passes of all college QBs last year with just 5. I expect that number to be higher in the NFL, but still won't be any sort of major issue.

 

[cardpa]

I have it on fairly good authority that it's extremely hard to not win 8 games or more if you have an NFL-caliber QB.

I'm pretty sure that Kingsbury was the coach of the ENTIRE Texas Tech team. Just because it makes you feel bad doesn't make it not true.

All this talk about KK only focused on the offensive side of the ball is ludicrous. Last time I checked he was hired as the Head Coach. If you expect him to just pay attention to the offensive side of the ball then who in the hell is going to be the head coach. Is this going to be head coach by committee?

 

[Dr. Jones]

Thread is closed. Please use the All things Kyler Murray thread

Thread is open since this is more than Murray

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

All this talk about KK only focused on the offensive side of the ball is ludicrous. Last time I checked he was hired as the Head Coach. If you expect him to just pay attention to the offensive side of the ball then who in the hell is going to be the head coach. Is this going to be head coach by committee?

He will be the head coach, but his primary focus will be on the offense and the DC will have his entire focus on the defense. The set-up should be somewhat similar to how it was with BA. Arians was the head coach, but he put most of his time into the offense because he was the one calling plays on that end and then he put trust into his DC to run the defense.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Saquon Barkley was rookie of the year.

And let's pump the brakes on Kingsbury being a QB whisperer. I hadn't seen this story before:

https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...6/baker-mayfield-texas-tech-transfer-oklahoma

That's not a good look, although I'm sure there are extenuating circumstances. Mayfield WALKED ON at Tech and moved up the depth chart. Then Kingsbury dumped him for David Webb.

Davis Webb outplayed Baker Mayfield. It takes a short dive to see that. Mayfield whined and was shown the door.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Arm length is an issue. Drew Brees and Wilson are the guys Murray is often used for comparison. Both those guys have very long arms. I’ve seen articles written about it. It gives them a higher release point.

I agree about the crazy question. I was just wanting opinions on what people thought and reasons they have faith in the Cards moves.

Arm length is an issue? No its not.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Arm length is an issue. Drew Brees and Wilson are the guys Murray is often used for comparison. Both those guys have very long arms. I’ve seen articles written about it. It gives them a higher release point.

I agree about the crazy question. I was just wanting opinions on what people thought and reasons they have faith in the Cards moves.

You'll make a deal about arm length, but you dont seem to care that your boy (Haskins) posted a 73 QB Rating when pressured.

 

[dscher]

All this talk about KK only focused on the offensive side of the ball is ludicrous. Last time I checked he was hired as the Head Coach. If you expect him to just pay attention to the offensive side of the ball then who in the hell is going to be the head coach. Is this going to be head coach by committee?

Not out of the realm of possibility that he is just to focus on the offensive side of the ball. The head coach thing could just be a title. Him and Vance will definitely be coordinating alot of the head coaching I believe. Along with a sprinkle of Keim to take the load off their shoulders. I dunno.. jmo

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Good post and all legit questions. History tells us this is going to be a colossal failure. But I’m sure rooting for the other side of the coin. My heart tells me this is going to be a disaster...

I sure hope you and I are wrong.

Add me to the list

A lot of ??? for this team to answer

 

[football karma]

Arm length is an issue.

i say it cuts both ways

shorter arms can facilitate a more compact throwing motion, and, improved accuracy

longer levers magnify imprecision

its why so very many pro golfers are 5-10". long legs and arms make repetitive, dependable golf strokes harder

 

[football karma]

ill also say this:

it would be easier for me to accept "visionary" if these were the series of moves immediately after Arians retired

but instead, they went right down the middle of NFL status quo in hiring Wilks, McCoy, etc ---

so this might be either:

dramatic over reaction to the 2018 moves, or

visionary by necessity

hitting rock bottom can provide some needed clarity of thinking

 

[Shane]

i say it cuts both ways

shorter arms can facilitate a more compact throwing motion, and, improved accuracy

Is there some sort of science that proves this statement? lol