Kelly Oubre...

[SunnyBaller]

Can they afford Rubio?


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I hope they don't even try for Rubio he hasn't been good all year and is probably going to get 10x what I'd pay him if I was a GM

 

[Mainstreet]

Depends how it's viewed. Tyler's salary is useful as an expiring for teams looking to get out of long term contracts, or just to match up salaries for trades. It is a problem if the Suns want to use capspace, but they have the option of stretching and waiving to make it less of a problem.

I'd like to keep Tyler and strengthen the point guard position if that were possible. It would be nice to have him coming back.

Keeping, trading or stretching Tyler gives the Suns lots of options as you point out.

 

[Phrazbit]

Isaiah Thomas is toast, I don't think he will ever be an impact player again.

And even if he were healthy, he's only effective if he is 'the man', he is not an off the ball player or much of a distributor or defender. You're going as far as he can carry you... which puts a hard ceiling on your team and stunts the development of your roster.

 

[Western Font]

Depends how it's viewed. Tyler's salary is useful as an expiring for teams looking to get out of long term contracts, or just to match up salaries for trades. It is a problem if the Suns want to use capspace, but they have the option of stretching and waiving to make it less of a problem.

Yeah, we already had the problem, it was just named Brandon Knight and then Ryan Anderson. Johnson is way less of a problem.

I'll be curious to see what the trade possibilities might actually be. At present the biggest need is PG, and until someone new is on the roster there's little point in exchanging Johnson for a big contract who can't play or is redundant on the court. So it would have to be a deal that offered additional financial relief or a young/role player we covet. I won't have more of an opinion until I know what the Suns are doing at PG.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Yeah, we already had the problem, it was just named Brandon Knight and then Ryan Anderson. Johnson is way less of a problem.

I'll be curious to see what the trade possibilities might actually be. At present the biggest need is PG, and until someone new is on the roster there's little point in exchanging Johnson for a big contract who can't play or is redundant on the court. So it would have to be a deal that offered additional financial relief or a young/role player we covet. I won't have more of an opinion until I know what the Suns are doing at PG.

I underestimated the concept that Johnson was going to be alot better than Ryan Anderson.

Gambo stated that the two reasons for the trade 1) Suns got a player who would actually be productive. 2) Gave the team a trade salary for next season.

I'm actually ok with the Jones-Bukstein partnership. Johnson and Oubre have been good moves for this team.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I underestimated the concept that Johnson was going to be alot better than Ryan Anderson.

Gambo stated that the two reasons for the trade 1) Suns got a player who would actually be productive. 2) Gave the team a trade salary for next season.

I'm actually ok with the Jones-Bukstein partnership. Johnson and Oubre have been good moves for this team.

From outward appearances they seem okay right now. What we don’t know are the moves that were available or possible that either were never explored or not consummated and the reasoning behind both. In other words - lost opportunity and avoided mistakes. That’s almost as important in examining these guys as is examining what they made happen. I would suspect that Sarver is privy to that info. At least I’d hope so.

 

[Hoop Head]

I think Tyler Johnson could prove more valuable in a sign and trade this offseason than if we hung onto him trying to flip him at the deadline next year. We'll have around $20 million in cap space this summer to make something happen, probably a little less after cap holds are taken into consideration. That is also what Tyler Johnson is set to make. If we come to an agreement with a free agent around that price point then we can explore a sign and trade with them for Johnson and the Bucks pick. The other team may decide to let that player walk and if that happens then we'll need to get creative to form the cap space but they could have a 1 year rental and large expiring in Johnson plus a pick for their troubles. Johnson isn't a great player but he is a rotation player and that might be enough for a team to be willing to take him on. I'm not saying that will happen but it could and that would stretch our cap space further since that signing wouldn't count against our space the same way because they'd take up the room Johnson did.

That is what we should have done with Chandler last offseason, used his salary to bring someone back in a sign and trade because no one wanted him outright but taking his contract in a move like that would make more sense, then they could waive if him if they didn't want to keep him.

 

[Krangodnzr]

From outward appearances they seem okay right now. What we don’t know are the moves that were available or possible that either were never explored or not consummated and the reasoning behind both. In other words - lost opportunity and avoided mistakes. That’s almost as important in examining these guys as is examining what they made happen. I would suspect that Sarver is privy to that info. At least I’d hope so.

How will we ever know this? I mean maybe Gambo says that so and so was available, but I don't really trust his info.

I think from the moves that the HAVE made, the results have been pretty good.

Kelly Oubre IMO can be the third/fourth option behind Booker/Ayton. Jones/Bukstein turned chicken poo into chicken salad by tossing a worthless old veteran into a good, young two way player. The Wizards have notoriously made stupid moves like this to contend and it's blown up in their faces more often than not.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I think Tyler Johnson could prove more valuable in a sign and trade this offseason than if we hung onto him trying to flip him at the deadline next year. We'll have around $20 million in cap space this summer to make something happen, probably a little less after cap holds are taken into consideration. That is also what Tyler Johnson is set to make. If we come to an agreement with a free agent around that price point then we can explore a sign and trade with them for Johnson and the Bucks pick. The other team may decide to let that player walk and if that happens then we'll need to get creative to form the cap space but they could have a 1 year rental and large expiring in Johnson plus a pick for their troubles. Johnson isn't a great player but he is a rotation player and that might be enough for a team to be willing to take him on. I'm not saying that will happen but it could and that would stretch our cap space further since that signing wouldn't count against our space the same way because they'd take up the room Johnson did.

That is what we should have done with Chandler last offseason, used his salary to bring someone back in a sign and trade because no one wanted him outright but taking his contract in a move like that would make more sense, then they could waive if him if they didn't want to keep him.

I don't think ANYONE wanted Chandler. Dude has been banished to the bench.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I don't think ANYONE wanted Chandler. Dude has been banished to the bench.

Yeah, this idea that we lost something of value by letting him go makes no sense to me. If we'd had an expensive target and a team that was willing to take on his salary we could have still made that move using Ryan Anderson's salary who is only slightly less playable than Tyson is IMO.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't think we could have gotten much for Chandler but it didn't seem like we were even looking at dealing him. If we were going to cut him then we should have done before the preseason started. There was no need to keep him around as a camp body or anything given how done he was. I don't mind we waived him but the timing of it was bad. Even if McD didn't want to do it then Jones should have when we signed Jamal Crawford instead of delaying that a little longer because we thought we could help Reed land elsewhere. Reed was on a guaranteed contract and I would have preferred he was kept on the end of the bench or assigned to the G-League than waste 2-3 weeks keeping Chandler around.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I don't think we could have gotten much for Chandler but it didn't seem like we were even looking at dealing him. If we were going to cut him then we should have done before the preseason started. There was no need to keep him around as a camp body or anything given how done he was. I don't mind we waived him but the timing of it was bad. Even if McD didn't want to do it then Jones should have when we signed Jamal Crawford instead of delaying that a little longer because we thought we could help Reed land elsewhere. Reed was on a guaranteed contract and I would have preferred he was kept on the end of the bench or assigned to the G-League than waste 2-3 weeks keeping Chandler around.

Hmm. I don't believe we could have gotten anything for Chandler, quite the opposite. He was grossly overpaid his second year here and it worsened each season. And there were rumors/reports for a couple of seasons that we were trying to move him with no luck.

 

[BC867]

Hmm. I don't believe we could have gotten anything for Chandler, quite the opposite. He was grossly overpaid his second year here and it worsened each season. And there were rumors/reports for a couple of seasons that we were trying to move him with no luck.

The Mavs got Tyson Chandler in his prime and he was the difference maker in bringing them their Championship.

The Suns got Tyson Chandler past his prime and he wasn't. As if anyone could.

The story of the Suns life. A day late and a dollar short, as the saying goes. Only that saying is not to scale.

 

[Sunstroke]

I liken him to Bruce Bowen in stature. Bowen a bit smarter on the defensive end, Oubre a bit better on the offensive end. Both players had/have that aggressive mentality. Jmo.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I liken him to Bruce Bowen in stature. Bowen a bit smarter on the defensive end, Oubre a bit better on the offensive end. Both players had/have that aggressive mentality. Jmo.

Sorry, I don't see it. Oubre is so much better in every aspect of the game if you compare them when they were at the same stage of their careers. Sure, Bowen became a clever (and filthy) defender over the years but I'd say the difference between them is more experience than smarts. And offensively, Oubre can already initiate for himself so on that side of the ball he's in a different ballpark than Bowen was at any point IMO.

 

[devilalum]

Sorry, I don't see it. Oubre is so much better in every aspect of the game if you compare them when they were at the same stage of their careers. Sure, Bowen became a clever (and filthy) defender over the years but I'd say the difference between them is more experience than smarts. And offensively, Oubre can already initiate for himself so on that side of the ball he's in a different ballpark than Bowen was at any point IMO.

Also Bowen would not be nearly as successful under the current rules.


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[AzStevenCal]

Also Bowen would not be nearly as successful under the current rules.

Quite true. Especially since they outlawed his favorite move - no more sliding your foot under an airborne shooter so he can sprain his ankle when he lands awkwardly on top of your foot.

 

[Phrazbit]

Quite true. Especially since they outlawed his favorite move - no more sliding your foot under an airborne shooter so he can sprain his ankle when he lands awkwardly on top of your foot.

When that fails...

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Bowen, somehow, did not get ejected and only paid a small fine.

Bowen, with today's rules "NO TOUCHING!" and emphasis on shooting, probably would have had a very, very brief career, spent mostly in the D league.

 

[Hoop Head]

I liken him to Bruce Bowen in stature. Bowen a bit smarter on the defensive end, Oubre a bit better on the offensive end. Both players had/have that aggressive mentality. Jmo.

I agree with Steve, I don't see the comparison there with Oubre. However if you said that Bridges reminded you of Bowen I could probably get behind that. He's got a similar type of up your jersey defensive style like Bowen did. He also seems to drift to the corners on offense a lot.

Oubre reminds me of the Suns version of Grant Hill without the playmaking aspect of his game. He runs the floor well, can play good defense, is long enough to play the passing lanes well, has a deceptively quick first step on both ends of the floor, and he's got a long stride also when he's running. I know it's not a great comparison, especially for those that remember Hill from his Detroit days, but he was not the same superstar type player when he was in Phoenix. He was a fantastic role player and I think that might be Oubre's ceiling. I don't see him as a star or part of a big 3 but he could be a great complimentary player for years to come. I don't think you'll win much if he's one of your best 3 players though. That's where paying him $20 million a year could get dicey.

 

[Sunstroke]

Thanks Poop Head, Phrazbit and AZStevenCal. Like I said I'm trying to learn and get back in touch with the NBA and the Suns. You guys would know better than my last memories of Sun's playoff nemesis. And you guys are right, Oubre jr. is a different sort of player. Both tho' were/are aggressive. on their respective ends of the floor.

 

[Errntknght]

Just read this thread and while I didn't 'like' any posts, I found something to like in nearly every one of them. More than that was the fact that everyone posted a respectful contribution. It was a refreshing read! No sniping, no snide 1 liners. I poked around is few other threads and found them similar to this one in that regard. I don't know how it happened but you guys have turned this forum around. If the team could do so well, we'd probably be high on the future. I'm proud to say I belong to the forum.

I can't say I'm as sanguine about the NBA. Labron, his agent and the unibrow and doing their best to make a shambles of the league. Hopefully it will blow up in their faces. In the other corner we have Luka Doncic showing all us doubters how the game should be played. One of the good things about the NBA over the years is that even the very best players knew the history of the game and respected the players that came before and respected the game. It's less true now and we need to get back to it. The league, the owners and the GMs need to show strong leadership.
If they don't step up, the league could fall apart. Sadly Sarver is part of the problem even though a minor part.

I could be all wet and I hope I am - I just don't have my finger on the pulse now days.

Keep it up guys!

 

[JCSunsfan]

Oubre really moves well for a player his size. Really agile and quick yet very natural easy mivements

 

[Chaplin]

I know he’s generally been described as an elite role player at best, but are we seeing a star on the making? He seems to be pretty consistently putting up great numbers. Maybe not Shawn Marion because of the rebounding, but maybe a Joe Johnson post-Suns level. Meaning not superstar, but definitely borderline all-star quality. Maybe a prime Latrell Sprewell? Minus the ridiculousness of course.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I know he’s generally been described as an elite role player at best, but are we seeing a star on the making? He seems to be pretty consistently putting up great numbers. Maybe not Shawn Marion because of the rebounding, but maybe a Joe Johnson post-Suns level. Meaning not superstar, but definitely borderline all-star quality. Maybe a prime Latrell Sprewell? Minus the ridiculousness of course.

There's a strong possibility of that. It's only 12 games, but he is averaging 20 points, 6 rebounds, 2 steals and 1 block per game as a starter and I see no reason why he can't keep that up. On top of that he has a good chance of continuing to improve for next few years as he is only 23 right now.

 

[SirStefan32]

AND he plays excellent defense.