Kevin Garnett?

[pokerface]

The next highest rebounder in Minny gets 5.7 rebs/game......no wonder KG gets 13. If Marion was on that team, he'd probably average 13 too. .

Marion never averaged 13 rpg in his life....KG did it three years straight.

 

[Covert Rain]

I agree!
During the games with the Lakers, D'Antoni said that Marion did not want to switch off Odom because when he did Odom would score on the other player and Marion would get blamed for it. Odom is a tough one for Marion to defend, but he does a great job against a taller very athletic player.

Marion has been doing a great job on defense for years now, I think many of you have just missed realizing that. He gets switched off during the course of a game as others do, but the player he is guarding does not do well at that time.

The other thing is that we are expecting 20 points from Marion every game also. He is quite often guarding their best offensive player and has to concentrate on that as well as very quickly switching to offense once the shot goes up. I think it is amazing how many times he is playing solid defense on someone like Redd and after the player shoots, Marion is the first down and gets a dunk. MARION IS A HELL OF A PLAYER!!

Don't forget that Marion also guards PGs & Sgs when asked to and KG would never be able to do that. Also, KG gets 13 rebs per game right now, but who else plays on Minny to compete with him? We've got Marion, Amare & KT all capable of getting double digit rebs every game. For a 6'7 guy to be among the league leaders in rebs every year plus guard any position on the court and score 20pts/game is very impressive and I don't think KG will be as effective here as Marion is.

Finally some guys in here with some freaking sense. Wow. KG puts up good numbers with a bunch of stiffs he plays with. Marions career numbers are almost as good and he has had much better players around him grabbing boards and scoring points too.

Do you even know how stupid that sounds? Garnett came into the league out of highschool , his career averages of course aren't nearly as good as his season stats in the last 6 years.

Career averages mean absolutey NOTHING.

What does him coming out of HS having anything to do with anything?? Now that sounds stupid. That has nothing to do with what he has averaged over his career. Last time I checked career average tells you what that person did over their career from YEAR to YEAR.

KG's season RPG stats have gone DOWN 3 years in a row. This is his WORST rebounding year in 6 years. Here is the last 4 - 13.9, 13.5, 12.7, 11.8. Again, like the poster was saying, it's not hard to pad your stats when your playing on a HORRIBLE team.

Marion never averaged 13 rpg in his life....KG did it three years straight.

Marion also never had a stretch of averaging only 6.3, 8.0 and 9.6 RPG for 3 straight years like KG either. Again so what? KG will NEVER average 13 RPG again. This is about what he does now. KG is statistically down in serveral categories.

FG% - Down
OR - Down
DR - DOWN
RPG - Down
APG - Down
Turn Over Per Game - UP
PPG - Down

So if career stats mean nothing...then using that philosophy the sky should be falling for you KG fans. Like I said, you can't take ANY of the stats so far this season and assume it won't average out to right around where his career numbers are.

I have yet to hear one person in here say KG stinks or is a bad player. I think the point is that even if you think KG is better the Marion, it's not by much. Therefore, saying that KG is worth some rediculous lop sided trade is equally stupid. I said it before and I will say it again. I would LOVE to have KG but for the right price. However, for Marion+Barbosa+1st rounder?

Please.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Anyone who has watched Marion and Garnett play would say that Garnett is by far the better player. Is Marion still amazing? Of course he is, but he is simply a full tier below Garnett. KG is a player that you can build a team around, Marion is a second star player.

I went and looked up this seasons numbers for everyone--

Kevin Garnet is in the 93rd percentile of scoring in the NBA. He is over 1.0 PPP in EVERY playtype catagory. That is absolutely unheard of - in fact, I can't remember ever seeing that before (although a few players have come close, and I would be amazed if this held up)

Shawn Marion is in the 64th percentile of scoring in the NBA. He is over 1.0 PPP in ONLY transitions, shots of cuts and as a roll man in the pick and roll.

Also, KG goes to his left and his right almost evenly (much harder to guard) where Marion drives left 77% of the time.

This is all with KG being the main and really only offensive option. Teams gear their entire defense around him. Marion almost never has teams trying to shut him down. (This is a bad season for him, last year him and Garnett were much closer with Marion edging out based on ridiculous transition numbers that dominated his offense - but just as this year - marion did it without any special focus)



With all that, I still wouldn't give up Marion/Barbosa for him. Only because Barbosa is far to good/young - and on a long term bargain contract. Like I said before, it is pretty obvious that Garnett is a much more valuable player. However, the Suns would be stupid to trade for him only with Minny unless they get a hell of a deal - the price would be too high.

Let it also be known that for nostalgia effect I really want Marion to retire a Sun. The only way I could live with him being traded is if it was in a no brainer deal that brings the Suns a ring - even though he finds a way to piss me off EVERY game

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Anyone who has watched Marion and Garnett play would say that Garnett is by far the better player. Is Marion still amazing? Of course he is, but he is simply a full tier below Garnett. KG is a player that you can build a team around, Marion is a second star player.

I went and looked up this seasons numbers for everyone--

Kevin Garnet is in the 93rd percentile of scoring in the NBA. He is over 1.0 PPP in EVERY playtype catagory. That is absolutely unheard of - in fact, I can't remember ever seeing that before (although a few players have come close, and I would be amazed if this held up)

Shawn Marion is in the 64th percentile of scoring in the NBA. He is over 1.0 PPP in ONLY transitions, shots of cuts and as a roll man in the pick and roll.

Also, KG goes to his left and his right almost evenly (much harder to guard) where Marion drives left 77% of the time.

This is all with KG being the main and really only offensive option. Teams gear their entire defense around him. Marion almost never has teams trying to shut him down. (This is a bad season for him, last year him and Garnett were much closer with Marion edging out based on ridiculous transition numbers that dominated his offense - but just as this year - marion did it without any special focus)



With all that, I still wouldn't give up Marion/Barbosa for him. Only because Barbosa is far to good/young - and on a long term bargain contract. Like I said before, it is pretty obvious that Garnett is a much more valuable player. However, the Suns would be stupid to trade for him only with Minny unless they get a hell of a deal - the price would be too high.

Let it also be known that for nostalgia effect I really want Marion to retire a Sun. The only way I could live with him being traded is if it was in a no brainer deal that brings the Suns a ring - even though he finds a way to piss me off EVERY game

I don't know if I have ever agreed this much with a post from beginning to end.

Great post Graham

 

[Covert Rain]

With all that, I still wouldn't give up Marion/Barbosa for him. Only because Barbosa is far to good/young - and on a long term bargain contract.

That's a very good point.

 

[Black Jesus]

Barbosa is too good to give up. It would have to be Marion, and draft picks along with Jurmaine or James or Banks or no deal

 

[pokerface]

Barbosa is too good to give up. It would have to be Marion, and draft picks along with Jurmaine or James or Banks or no deal

I could live with that but not sure the Twolves would. It depends how high the picks end up.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Eleven pages of "Garnett is way better than Marion. No, he's better but not WAY better."

As Abraham Lincoln said after a lengthy debate in Congress.

"I've never seen so many words crammed into so small an argument."

 

[Folster]

Eleven pages of "Garnett is way better than Marion. No, he's better but not WAY better."

As Abraham Lincoln said after a lengthy debate in Congress.

"I've never seen so many words crammed into so small an argument."

After this post the mods should lock this thread.

 

[pokerface]

After this post the mods should lock this thread.

OK dad

 

[Folster]

OK dad

The jerk store called...

 

[pokerface]

The jerk store called...

Yeah and they said you should stop hanging around there

 

[phxrising]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2685714


Garnett angered by rumors, not unhappy with Wolves


"I've never said I [was] unhappy," Garnett said after the Timberwolves beat the Philadelphia 76ers 95-84. "I don't know where y'all get that [expletive] from. None of y'all have asked me that."

"People feel sorry for me?" Garnett said. "I don't go out and scout players. I don't do any of the front office stuff. This thing's bigger than Kevin Garnett. I'm a piece, but ... I don't want nobody to feel sorry for me. I bust my [butt] to come in and be consistent every year. If you want to feel sorry for somebody, feel sorry for the people who put the team together and haven't put me in a position to be in those situations. Don't feel sorry for me."
-------------------------------------------------------------

Click link to read the rest of the article.


Well I guess for all the good he is as a player he just isn’t bright enough to leave the team.

 

[devilalum]

"If you want to feel sorry for somebody, feel sorry for the people who put the team together and haven't put me in a position to be in those situations. Don't feel sorry for me."
.

Oh yeah, he's happy.

This is passive aggressive.

 

[pokerface]

Oh yeah, he's happy.

This is passive aggressive.

He's not saying he's unhappy he's just not saying he's happy.

 

[playstation]

alright guys, KG isn't going anywhere...

close thread

 

[Covert Rain]

Thank you.

 

[az1965]

Rumor is (from azcentral.com) Suns are doing their homework in case Garnett is on the block to make sure he does not land in LA with Kobe. They want to participate as a 3rd team to send him packing preferably to east coast.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Rumor is (from azcentral.com) Suns are doing their homework in case Garnett is on the block to make sure he does not land in LA with Kobe. They want to participate as a 3rd team to send him packing preferably to east coast.

I don't think that happens. They would have to package at least Odom, Byrum, Walton, and draft picks to make it work. Let alone trying to match salaries.....

 

[slinslin]

Rumor is (from azcentral.com) Suns are doing their homework in case Garnett is on the block to make sure he does not land in LA with Kobe. They want to participate as a 3rd team to send him packing preferably to east coast.

My personal rumor is that Bob Young is stupid if he really thinks the Suns are sacrificing their future for a championship run if they trade Marion for Garnett.

 

[Suns_fan69]

I don't think that's what he's implying. Being involved as a 3rd team to me suggests that they'd be the role of facilitator with (sigh) draft picks, role players (JR, JJ, etc). I highly doubt they'd trade anyone of any real value to the team just to avoid having KG with kobe.

 

[az1965]

I don't think that's what he's implying. Being involved as a 3rd team to me suggests that they'd be the role of facilitator with (sigh) draft picks, role players (JR, JJ, etc). I highly doubt they'd trade anyone of any real value to the team just to avoid having KG with kobe.

Yes, you are right... Young in fact said that it will not be a good idea for Suns to acquire Garnett and sacrifice their future, that is why they just want to be facilitator in the trade.

Here is original link...
http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cheapseats/articles/1205p2main1205.html

 

[pokerface]

I was on the Minny espn board and proposed my Marion + Barbosa + 1st roounder for KG. They really didnt seem interested in Barbosa but were more interested in Kurt. Here is a three way deal that got some support on thier board...I like it too!

Saw the phoenix KG trade thread and got me thinking...

Minnesota Trade BreakdownOutgoingMark Blount7-0 C from Pittsburgh
11.3 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 27.7 minutesKevin Garnett6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 12.7 rpg, 4.0 apg in 39.0 minutesIncomingKurt Thomas6-9 PF from Texas Christian
8.6 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 1.1 apg in 26.6 minutesEddie Jones6-6 SG from Temple
11.8 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 2.4 apg in 32.5 minutesMike Miller6-8 SG from Florida
13.7 ppg, 5.4 rpg, 2.7 apg in 30.6 minutesRudy Gay6-8 from Connecticut
No games yet played in 2005/06Change in team outlook: +1.0 ppg, -0.3 rpg, and +1.0 apg.
Phoenix Trade BreakdownOutgoingKurt Thomas6-9 PF from Texas Christian
8.6 ppg, 7.8 rpg, 1.1 apg in 26.6 minutesShawn Marion6-7 SF from UNLV
21.8 ppg, 11.8 rpg, 1.8 apg in 40.4 minutesIncomingKevin Garnett6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 12.7 rpg, 4.0 apg in 39.0 minutesChange in team outlook: -8.6 ppg, -6.9 rpg, and +1.1 apg.
Memphis Trade BreakdownOutgoingEddie Jones6-6 SG from Temple
11.8 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 2.4 apg in 32.5 minutesMike Miller6-8 SG from Florida
13.7 ppg, 5.4 rpg, 2.7 apg in 30.6 minutesRudy Gay6-8 from Connecticut
No games yet played in 2005/06IncomingMark Blount7-0 C from Pittsburgh
11.3 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 1.2 apg in 27.7 minutesShawn Marion6-7 SF from UNLV
21.8 ppg, 11.8 rpg, 1.8 apg in 40.4 minutesChange in team outlook: +7.6 ppg, +7.2 rpg, and -2.1 apg.

Phoenix throws atlantas #1 to MN

For phoenix they would be getting KG which would honestly be a huge upgrade over marion when you throw him alongside nash and amare. Basically they give up the first and KG takes over all of kurt thomas minutes and half of marions. Only catch is it costs them atlantas #1. I would honestly start the deal by having both atlanta AND phoenix's #1, then backing off the suns #1 if they hold tight.



Memphis still thinks they can be a good team when pau is back, and adding a ready to go all star at the 3 along with blount (memphis was the other team bidding for him before last years trade deadline). They give up eddie jones expiring contract, mike miller, and rudy gay (both of whom play the 3 like marion). At first I thought memphis should get more, but gay+a big expiring contract would be about what it takes to get a player like marion, so it really comes down to miller and blount, which could be evened out fairly easily if they felt they needed more.



Wolves get immediate cap relief in jones, more cap relief after next season with thomas, a solid player and shooter in miller, and the best player in the 06 draft, gay. Throw in the atlanta pick which will be top 10, and potentially the suns pick.

Wolves with any luck (their pick and the hawks both being top 10) should be able to draft some size next year (oden? noah?). I like the idea of gay, foye, mccants, smith, and 2 top 10 picks in a deep draft for building a franchise on. Ricky will expire after next season, thomas will expire, and we can probably move hudson/jaric/hassell (jaric for sure) for smallish expiring deals.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I don't think that's what he's implying. Being involved as a 3rd team to me suggests that they'd be the role of facilitator with (sigh) draft picks, role players (JR, JJ, etc). I highly doubt they'd trade anyone of any real value to the team just to avoid having KG with kobe.

Hmm. Give up a pick (late first round?) just to make sure KG goes East. At first, I like it.

But upon reflection. That kind of thing could really backfire. It seem like that kind of sabatoge would be very poorly received by players and owners alike. Maybe we shouldn't care about it, but sometime in the future, when we need to make a deal with someone, it could come back and bite us.

Wow.

 

[asudevil83]

poker:

on paper that trade isnt horrible....but with the suns thin up front, subtracting 2 for 1 isnt really safe, unless another trade was worked out with someone like JR being involved.:

Amare
Diaw
KG/Rose
Bell/Barbosa
Nash/Banks

that is a STRONG 8 man rotation though.