Kobe pours in 81!

[Chaplin]

So should Kobe should play more "team" basketball and get scrubs like Luke Walton and Devean George more involved and most likely lose a game? Or should he take control himself which he has repeatedly shown the ability to do and win games at the expense of "team" basketball?

You actually believe that the Lakers will win like that in the playoffs (or even late in the regular season)?? Please tell me you don't believe that.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Wow after reading alot of these comments I am realizing us Suns fans are either delusional or bias....

Kobe Bryant is the best player in the NBA. The Lakers (yes the Lakers not Bryant) made the right decision in going with Kobe over Shaq...Kobe is the best perimeter player since MJ and to doubt his skill is ignorance. Say all the garbage you want about how he shoots too much and teammates hate him but you are uniformed.

I remember Jordan in his hey dey and thinking "damn this guys shoots the ball every time down the floor" Before the second three peat i remember telling people he was overratted because of that fact. Well i changed my tune once i began to understand bball al litte better. First Kobe-bashers want to say he shotts to much to the detriment to his team, then now that he is carrying his team on his back and winning he is....what? Hurting the game of basketball?... are you kidding me?

And Chaplin wants us to have perspective and say it was the Raptors...its not like they are the Washington Generals...they are an NBA team if i rememebr correctly and his team did win after being down 17 points in the second half...Plus he scored 62 (and could have had 80+) against one of the top three teams in the league, but he held back. The fact that it took him only three weeks to get close again is just ridiculous. Do you remember who Wilt dropped 100 on? yeah me either....

We need to give credit where credit is due. Kobe is amazing and should be touted as a once and a generation type player. I dont know if i would rather have him then Nash with the team presently constituted, but its not like he is Bonzi Wells or something. Its definitly debatable.

Instead of hating like i did back in 95 with Jordan (and later grew out of) just appreciate the work and time he puts into his game and that he is such a competitior that he wants to kill everybody. He has his flaws but on the court i have not seen them. His team is garbage and as good as Nash is, they wouldnt have a better record than they do with him running that team.

Phil Jackson deserves some credit too. Lakers are not to far off and if Bynum develops and they add one more good piece, they will be a handful next year.

But fear not Suns fans, Kobe aint dropping 81 on us anytime soon b/c we have Raja Bell. We are the better team so take solace in that.

But dont deny the credit he deserves.....he is playing basketball at its highest level....

And yes, i still think he will end up being MVP of this season when its all said and done.....

 

[D-Dogg]

Kobe will never play team basketball and that's the POINT. When Kobe comes to Suns, he will still dominante the ball and I fail to see how Amare/Marion can shine under him.

Lakers needs Kobe to score that many points to win games but their record certainly doesn't show that it's the most effective way to win games (ex: Pistons/Spurs/Mavs).

Boy, let the haterade flow.

The fact that he CAN play like this should clue you in to the fact he's played team basketball for most of his career. You don't win three rings without playing team ball.

All it takes for Kobe to give you the ball is trust that you will score with it. It's pretty clear he'd trust Amare and Marion to score. Your argument is flawed, and biased.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

You actually believe that the Lakers will win like that in the playoffs (or even late in the regular season)?? Please tell me you don't believe that.

No I don't, just like the Bulls never won in the playoffs in the late 80s with Jordan carrying those teams by himself. The Lakers also won't win if Kobe gets bad players involved so he's kind of up a creek. I just can't blame Kobe for taking a game over when his teammates are struggling and they're stuck in a double digit defecit. What was he supposed to do?

 

[D-Dogg]

You actually believe that the Lakers will win like that in the playoffs (or even late in the regular season)?? Please tell me you don't believe that.

Playoff series? No. Games, yes.

The hope is the team figures out the triangle by then, and improves. Phil's teams traditionally do as such, and right now they have to ride Kobe's greatness until someone else steps up to play.

 

[jibikao]

Boy, let the haterade flow.

The fact that he CAN play like this should clue you in to the fact he's played team basketball for most of his career. You don't win three rings without playing team ball.

All it takes for Kobe to give you the ball is trust that you will score with it. It's pretty clear he'd trust Amare and Marion to score. Your argument is flawed, and biased.

Did I say I "hate" Kobe? If you read my previous posts, I've been saying good things about Kobe. In fact, I don't even understand why so many "trash Kobe" threads in other basketball forums. I've brought it up so many times even on www.basketballboards.net because people love to trash Kobe and I don't.

"All it takes for Kobe to give you the ball is trust that you will score with it" - does it mean if your teammate cannot score, you are not going to give the ball to them at all? To form the trust, you have to give them the impression that you actually trust them taking the shots. The way Kobe dominanting the ball, I feel even his teammates don't trust in their shots. They probably feel "why do I need to shoot when Kobe can score". Well, keep playing this way and his teammates will NEVER improve. That's how I see it in Lakers' games. Role players don't really improve and new players don't really fit in (Odom/Bulter).

I am not a Kobe hater, period. I am just saying what I see on TV. Truth or not, let the record speak the truth.

 

[Chaplin]

No I don't, just like the Bulls never won in the playoffs in the late 80s with Jordan carrying those teams by himself. The Lakers also won't win if Kobe gets bad players involved so he's kind of up a creek. I just can't blame Kobe for taking a game over when his teammates are struggling and they're stuck in a double digit defecit. What was he supposed to do?

This is the whole crux of the arguement. Kobe needs to do that more often if he wants this team to win. That's the problem. The personnel on the Lakers sucks.

And again, even Suns fans are accusing me of not giving Kobe any credit. I have said it ad nauseum: KOBE BRYANT GAVE AN AMAZING PERFORMANCE LAST NIGHT. I wonder why a few people that disagree with me use the illusion that I think it wasn't a good performance as ammunition. That's just not true.

Kobe Bryant is likely the best player in the NBA--I've said that for years, especially the summer we were rumored to be interested in him. Those of you with selective memory probably don't recall that I was one of the big proponents of at least exploring contract ideas with Bryant. So to say that I don't think his peformance was good (Arizona's Finest actually has the brass to say I thought it was the fault of the Raptors that allowed him to score 81, not Kobe's skills--WTF?).

To recap:

1) I think the performance was outstanding, amazing, magnificent. It was another hallmark of what was an amazing day in the NBA.

2) However, I'm not going to dilute myself and make the Lakers contenders just because they have a player that can score 81 points! The Lakers TEAM just isn't that good. Kobe will not be able to score 81 points a game for the rest of the year to make up for the rest of his team. It just WON'T HAPPEN. He is a phenomenal talent, but he is a horrible leader and does not play team basketball. Only D-Dogg and other Laker fans seem to disagree with that, but that's to be expected.

3) If Kobe continues on this path, he is going to alienate his teammates--which in turn will make them perform worse.

 

[elindholm]

And yes, i still think he will end up being MVP of this season when its all said and done....

Very thoughtful post until this. No matter how well Bryant plays, he's not an MVP candidate. That award (in this league) always goes to a player on a top team. Unless the Lakers get red hot and wind up with a win total in the mid 50s (which would mean playing .750-.800 the rest of the way), he doesn't have a chance. It may or may not be fair, but that's the way it is.

 

[jibikao]

Having said that... I feel the media will root for Kobe for MVP. His recording breaking scoring will be the basis of it and the fact that Lakers has improved since last season.

Kobe VS Lebron (isn't that a HOT topic or what? lol)

If Lakers can end up in playoffs (even if it's 8th spot), Kobe will earn a lot of votes.

I think Kobe's biggest opponent is Billups/Dirk so far.

 

[F-Dog]

Great game by Kobe. The first 70 or so points were absolutely vital to the Lakers' win.


Kobe isn't the best player in the league--the Lakers would be a better team if they had Duncan or Garnett instead, and might easily be better if they had LeBron or even Steve Nash. (Kobe's teammates look so bad partly because his game and personality strangles theirs.)

He might be the most impressive player in the league when he's on, because he converts shots with insane DoD's. When I watch him, though, I'm always reminded of the quote about Wilt Chamberlain--how Wilt could never figure out the difference between what was impressive and what was important.

 

[Yuma]

LOL!! No, not gonna happen. Utah especially, and Minny doubtful. The Lakers post all-star break schedule is easier than the first half. The Clippers are sinking, and have no business being up there anyway. The Lakers will end up with the 5th or 6th seed.

Utah is on a roll after finally getting Kiralenko off IR. Minnesota is starting to play the best ball it's played after an agonizingly slow start to their season. LA may have an easier schedule after the all-star break, but how many more 81 point games does Kobe have in him this season to get more W's? LA hasn't exactly been undefeated in this scoring binge Kobe's been on. Heck, we could have Amare score 80 points a night just constantly feeding him the ball and looking for noone else to score. I don't think we'd win many games doing it. To have Phil Jackson thinking this will work for a whole season, including playoffs, is kinda hard to believe. Especially since the Lakers are hardly defensive oriented.

 

[elindholm]

If I had to handicap the MVP race right now (based on how I think it will come out, not how I would personally vote), it would be something like this:

1. Billups
2. Nash
3. Nowitzki
4. Bryant
5. Duncan

James has no chance. The more he scores, the worse his team does.

 

[elindholm]

Heck, we could have Amare score 80 points a night just constantly feeding him the ball and looking for noone else to score.

Get real. That's what the Suns did against the Spurs in last year's playoff series, and Stoudemire didn't come close to 80. He averaged less than half that.

 

[Chaplin]

Heck, we could have Amare score 80 points a night just constantly feeding him the ball and looking for noone else to score.

Get real. That's what the Suns did against the Spurs in last year's playoff series, and Stoudemire didn't come close to 80. He averaged less than half that.

I totally agree with that. I agree with it because the Suns are a TEAM, Amare doesn't have to score 80 points. Not with Steve Nash and Shawn Marion on the team.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

And yes, i still think he will end up being MVP of this season when its all said and done....

Very thoughtful post until this. No matter how well Bryant plays, he's not an MVP candidate. That award (in this league) always goes to a player on a top team. Unless the Lakers get red hot and wind up with a win total in the mid 50s (which would mean playing .750-.800 the rest of the way), he doesn't have a chance. It may or may not be fair, but that's the way it is.

I see that you disagree but my feeling is this...The Lakers will end up second in the Pacific and Kobe will the first player since MJ to avg. 35 pts a game....there will be abig swell for him after carrying THAT team to that level....

Nash and Nowitzki will be up there to so if he doesn't win he will def. top 3....

 

[jibikao]

If I had to handicap the MVP race right now (based on how I think it will come out, not how I would personally vote), it would be something like this:

1. Billups
2. Nash
3. Nowitzki
4. Bryant
5. Duncan

James has no chance. The more he scores, the worse his team does.

I wish your list is what it ends up... but I highly doubt the media would give the award to Nash again. As for Billups... I don't know.. his team is just so good. It's even hard to pick the leader from the group. I mean the most "effective" player on that team is actually Prince. lol I hope it doesn't go to Billups... I really hope not. I would rather they give it to Kobe if that's what the media wants (since Kobe has never won MVP).

I think at this pace, the award may go to Dirk since he is the most obvious leader on that team.

 

[Yuma]

Heck, we could have Amare score 80 points a night just constantly feeding him the ball and looking for noone else to score.

Get real. That's what the Suns did against the Spurs in last year's playoff series, and Stoudemire didn't come close to 80. He averaged less than half that.

Against arguably the first or second best defensive team in the league. Not the Raptors! Which makes Amare's scoring more impressive!

 

[Yuma]

I see that you disagree but my feeling is this...The Lakers will end up second in the Pacific and Kobe will the first player since MJ to avg. 35 pts a game....there will be abig swell for him after carrying THAT team to that level....

Nash and Nowitzki will be up there to so if he doesn't win he will def. top 3....

How will they be second in the Pacific when they aren't even the best team in the Staple's Center right now?

 

[Yuma]

I wish your list is what it ends up... but I highly doubt the media would give the award to Nash again. As for Billups... I don't know.. his team is just so good. It's even hard to pick the leader from the group. I mean the most "effective" player on that team is actually Prince. lol I hope it doesn't go to Billups... I really hope not. I would rather they give it to Kobe if that's what the media wants (since Kobe has never won MVP).

I think at this pace, the award may go to Dirk since he is the most obvious leader on that team.

Billups doesn't get his due. I've watched them play and would take Billups on the Suns in a heartbeat. I guess if Nash "didn't deserve" his MVP, then Billups won't deserve his either.

 

[LakeShowMan]

I refuse to get into any kind of pissing match over this game.

All I will say is, that game was about the most amazing thing I have ever watched. People or opposing fans can qualify it any way they want, or try to discredit it by calling Kobe a bad teammate, but if you watch that game or more importantly the second half and don't think Kobe is the most amazing player in the world today then you are simply blinded by hate.

The fact is, Kobe's teammates were absoluteley terrible in the first half. They had just finished a terrible back-to-back where the lost a game they should have won in Sacramento and predictably got handled the next night by a very good Phoenix team. The Lakers were down 14 at the half at home to the Raptors, and Kobe Bryant took the team on his back and outscored the Toronto team 55-41. Truly a historic performance, from an incredible player, playing at as high a level as ANYONE that has ever played the game.

There have been a lot of players that I couldn't stand in my life. Jordan, Bird, Karl Malone, etc. However, there are games and moments that even that hatred for a player can not take away from the amazing acheivement I've seen. If there is anyone that can't appreciate that game, especially after watching it, then you have no right to call yourself a fan of basketball, period.

 

[F-Dog]

Get real. That's what the Suns did against the Spurs in last year's playoff series, and Stoudemire didn't come close to 80. He averaged less than half that.

At the time, I thought the Suns weren't going to Amare nearly enough, especially in the first and third quarters.

Plus, Amare's isolation game is still a work in progress. I think he's got a long way to improve, if he can get and stay healthy.

 

[Yuma]

I refuse to get into any kind of pissing match over this game.

All I will say is, that game was about the most amazing thing I have ever watched. People or opposing fans can qualify it any way they want, or try to discredit it by calling Kobe a bad teammate, but if you watch that game or more importantly the second half and don't think Kobe is the most amazing player in the world today then you are simply blinded by hate.

The fact is, Kobe's teammates were absoluteley terrible in the first half. They had just finished a terrible back-to-back where the lost a game they should have won in Sacramento and predictably got handled the next night by a very good Phoenix team. The Lakers were down 14 at the half at home to the Raptors, and Kobe Bryant took the team on his back and outscored the Toronto team 55-41. Truly a historic performance, from an incredible player, playing at as high a level as ANYONE that has ever played the game.

There have been a lot of players that I couldn't stand in my life. Jordan, Bird, Karl Malone, etc. However, there are games and moments that even that hatred for a player can not take away from the amazing acheivement I've seen. If there is anyone that can't appreciate that game, especially after watching it, then you have no right to call yourself a fan of basketball, period.

I think we all would have left it as you put it. An amazing game, period. Then others started writing into how it showed more than it was.

PS. I want that firepower on my USA Olympic team! (added as an afterthought.)

 

[Chaplin]

I refuse to get into any kind of pissing match over this game.

All I will say is, that game was about the most amazing thing I have ever watched. People or opposing fans can qualify it any way they want, or try to discredit it by calling Kobe a bad teammate, but if you watch that game or more importantly the second half and don't think Kobe is the most amazing player in the world today then you are simply blinded by hate.

I hope you're not referring to me, because I've said until I'm blue in the face that it was an amazing performance and that Kobe is an amazing player. But being an amazing player does not make him a good teammate.

 

[jibikao]

Quite frankly, Lakers is in the same division and it's for Suns fans' interest to see Lakers fail (Kobe fail to be exact). Even if the Suns fans don't appreciate Kobe, what does it matter? Who gives a F about Lakers' success when Suns is fighting for #1 spot? I don't. Unless you are not a Suns fan??? Why are you here in the first place?

 

[Chaplin]

Quite frankly, Lakers is in the same division and it's for Suns fans' interest to see Lakers fail (Kobe fail to be exact). Even if the Suns fans don't appreciate Kobe, what does it matter? Who gives a F about Lakers' success when Suns is fighting for #1 spot? I don't. Unless you are not a Suns fan??? Why are you here in the first place?

LakeShowMan is one of the classiest Laker fans many of us have ever known, might as well ask that same question to D-Dogg or Brian in Mesa, who have been here as regulars for far longer.