Levi Brown Not a Lock to Start

[Mulli]

Countdown begins for someone to post that Arians was mean by planting this with Jurecki.

 

[Darkside]

BA said Levi was elite. We all know Levi isn't elite--even though I like the dude--and BA knows it too, but he isn't going to put Potter in before letting Levi prove his suck. And I doubt it's a motivational ploy, because there's nothing more motivational than someone telling you you're elite. Gotta live up to it. Or show that what people say about you is true.

What always gets lost is that Levi is one of the class guys on our team. You never hear a bad word or comment from him, never hardly even see him in front of a microphone. Shows up to work, no drama--shows up in shape, no drama. Every year since he's been here, and he's been nothing but trashed by the fans.

That's fine, as a paying customer, vent your frustrations, but there's more that goes in to being a professional football player than simply athletic ability, badassery, or fundamentals. There's something to be said for work ethic, character, loyalty and professionalism. I'd take 9 out of 10 employees with just those qualities--because the rest you can mold.

 

[Card'em]

To me this is a sign of progress for the offensive line. Last year after we lost Levi Brown the braintrust went with D.J. Young from the practice squad first and after his colossal whiff in a preseason game they turned to the great D'Anthony Batiste.

At least this year our fallback player is Nate Potter. I'll take Potter over D.J. Young and Batiste any day.

 

[1DS]

Levi Brown is a lock to start. Period.

 

[Buckybird]

What always gets lost is that Levi is one of the class guys on our team. You never hear a bad word or comment from him, never hardly even see him in front of a microphone. Shows up to work, no drama--shows up in shape, no drama. Every year since he's been here, and he's been nothing but trashed by the fans.

That's fine, as a paying customer, vent your frustrations, but there's more that goes in to being a professional football player than simply athletic ability, badassery, or fundamentals. There's something to be said for work ethic, character, loyalty and professionalism. I'd take 9 out of 10 employees with just those qualities--because the rest you can mold.

Thesmel is that you?

I'm sure Batiste, Big, LJ Shelton, Earnest Dye, etc were class guys too.

Levi's performance his entire career has been mediocre & being a "good guy" who's talent is suspect for the $$$ has got him cut once & I'm betting gets him cut again in 2014. IMO it's has to be a proper combo of talent, class, work ethic to be a very successful NFL player...Levi lacks in the most critical area...talent!!!

 

[SECTION 11]

Thesmel is that you?

I'm sure Batiste, Big, LJ Shelton, Earnest Dye, etc were class guys too.

Levi's performance his entire career has been mediocre & being a "good guy" who's talent is suspect for the $$$ has got him cut once & I'm betting gets him cut again in 2014. IMO it's has to be a proper combo of talent, class, work ethic to be a very successful NFL player...Levi lacks in the most critical area...talent!!!

And your starting left tackle would be... who exactly?

 

[Snakester]

I see us drafting a LT next year and moving Levi to RG. Anyone that thinks Levi isn't going to be rusty is kidding themselves. I don't see him playing well until about game 4. The guy should have been left at RT years ago and most fans wouldn't be complaining about him.

 

[kerouac9]

I see us drafting a LT next year and moving Levi to RG. Anyone that thinks Levi isn't going to be rusty is kidding themselves. I don't see him playing well until about game 4. The guy should have been left at RT years ago and most fans wouldn't be complaining about him.

Again? Look what the Cards drafted to play LG in Jonathan Cooper: Good size, but mostly mobile and quick-footed. This is not Levi Brown. That's the opposite of Levi Brown.

I'd prefer a man-blocking scheme with big guys up front pushing the line of scrimmage forward, but that's clearly not what this team is looking for or wants to do.

 

[Snakester]

Again? Look what the Cards drafted to play LG in Jonathan Cooper: Good size, but mostly mobile and quick-footed. This is not Levi Brown. That's the opposite of Levi Brown.

I'd prefer a man-blocking scheme with big guys up front pushing the line of scrimmage forward, but that's clearly not what this team is looking for or wants to do.

Then he gets released. I think his movement skills and strength will be fine at guard. I also think we would have a great guard combo. One of the best in the league in a short time.

 

[Buckybird]

Then he gets released. I think his movement skills and strength will be fine at guard. I also think we would have a great guard combo. One of the best in the league in a short time.

I'm thinking the Cards like what they have in Watford & Kelemente. I think Levi is pretty much a goner in 2014...I just think you don't basically draft 2 OGs & move your underperforming LT to RG.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm thinking the Cards like what they have in Watford & Kelemente. I think Levi is pretty much a goner in 2014...I just think you don't basically draft 2 OGs & move your underperforming LT to RG.

Yeah... I think that the Cards said all they needed about how they feel about Kelemete by drafting two guards in the last draft.

That said, I agree that Levi Brown needs to play at a fairly high level in 2013 to make the team going into 2014.

Brown wouldn't be a good guard in this system because while he sets a nice hard edge in pass pro and in the run game, he doesn't have great lateral movement and acceleration, and he doesn't recover from inside moves very well.

Moving him to guard would "stop the bleeding" if you can replace him with a better player at LT, but cutting Brown in 2014 creates a cap savings of more than $3M, which would likely be enough to sign a player of similar skill on the free agent market at the tackle position.

I watched the two sacks that the team allowed in the San Francisco game for fun yesterday, and Kelemete just got owned on a LEX stunt that left him completely befuddled.

 

[Mulli]

Yeah... I think that the Cards said all they needed about how they feel about Kelemete by drafting two guards in the last draft.

That said, I agree that Levi Brown needs to play at a fairly high level in 2013 to make the team going into 2014.

Brown wouldn't be a good guard in this system because while he sets a nice hard edge in pass pro and in the run game, he doesn't have great lateral movement and acceleration, and he doesn't recover from inside moves very well.

Moving him to guard would "stop the bleeding" if you can replace him with a better player at LT, but cutting Brown in 2014 creates a cap savings of more than $3M, which would likely be enough to sign a player of similar skill on the free agent market at the tackle position.

I watched the two sacks that the team allowed in the San Francisco game for fun yesterday, and Kelemete just got owned on a LEX stunt that left him completely befuddled.

Prediction: Levi Brown is not on the team next season.

 

[kerouac9]

Prediction: Levi Brown is not on the team next season.

I dunno. It's hard to say that right now. If the team goes 10-6 and wins a Wild Card game, it's going to be difficult to sell wholesale changes.

If the team's 8-8 and competitive in 12 total games, I think you're kind of cutting your own throat by creating a need for a starting left tackle, even if guys like Branden Albert, Jordan Gross, and Michael Oher are slated for free agency.

I'd probably say that there's a 65% chance that Levi Brown does not go to training camp with the Arizona Cardinals in 2014, but I bet he stays on the roster until at least after the draft.

I hate the idea of passing over another good rush linebacker prospect in the draft because we created a need for ourselves at another position.

 

[Mulli]

I dunno. It's hard to say that right now. If the team goes 10-6 and wins a Wild Card game, it's going to be difficult to sell wholesale changes.

If the team's 8-8 and competitive in 12 total games, I think you're kind of cutting your own throat by creating a need for a starting left tackle, even if guys like Branden Albert, Jordan Gross, and Michael Oher are slated for free agency.

I'd probably say that there's a 65% chance that Levi Brown does not go to training camp with the Arizona Cardinals in 2014, but I bet he stays on the roster until at least after the draft.

I hate the idea of passing over another good rush linebacker prospect in the draft because we created a need for ourselves at another position.

This team will NOT go 8-8 or 10-6. What was the % you gave for the Cards winnin the games they needed to win?

My wager would be he is not on roster opening day 2014

 

[Mulli]

And the need for a better LT has been there a very long time.

 

[kerouac9]

This team will NOT go 8-8 or 10-6. What was the % you gave for the Cards winnin the games they needed to win?

My wager would be he is not on roster opening day 2014

To get to 10 wins? It was like 0.91 percent. I didn't take stats in college, so I don't remember how to put together the probabilities that the Cards would win 8 of 10 games that I think they could win.

If you let me outsource the question to Football Outsiders, their 2013 Almanac gives a 28% chance the Cards win 8-10 games.

And the need for a better LT has been there a very long time.

A "better" LT, but it seems that the consensus here is that it takes the use of a Top 15 pick to get a "better" LT. My argument remains the same: Levi Brown is a perfectly cromulent starting left tackle in the NFL. Kevin Kolb made him look much worse than he actually was, and that's how we remember him.

Levi Brown makes some forehead-slapping mistakes, but so does every offensive lineman in the NFL who isn't Jake Long or Joe Thomas. Levi is in the company of the middle 15-18 left tackles in the NFL. That's a valuable commodity.

 

[Mulli]

another middle 15-18 LT who has never been endorsed or coached by Russ Grimmcan be had in the 2nd or 3rd round.

But that is just my opinion.

 

[Buckybird]

To get to 10 wins? It was like 0.91 percent. I didn't take stats in college, so I don't remember how to put together the probabilities that the Cards would win 8 of 10 games that I think they could win.

If you let me outsource the question to Football Outsiders, their 2013 Almanac gives a 28% chance the Cards win 8-10 games.



A "better" LT, but it seems that the consensus here is that it takes the use of a Top 15 pick to get a "better" LT. My argument remains the same: Levi Brown is a perfectly cromulent starting left tackle in the NFL. Kevin Kolb made him look much worse than he actually was, and that's how we remember him.

Levi Brown makes some forehead-slapping mistakes, but so does every offensive lineman in the NFL who isn't Jake Long or Joe Thomas. Levi is in the company of the middle 15-18 left tackles in the NFL. That's a valuable commodity.

Which is why the Cards screwed the pooch this year by not putting the all out press for Jermaine Bushrod! The Cards had a few better options than a average/below average player imo

 

[kerouac9]

Which is why the Cards screwed the pooch this year by not putting the all out press for Jermaine Bushrod! The Cards had a few better options than a average/below average player imo

1) Cutting Levi Brown this year would only save $800K on the salary cap.
2) Bushrod was given a deal with nearlyh $12M in money coming in the first year.
3) Jermon Bushrod isn't very good--or better than Levi Brown. 3 sacks and 9 penalties to go along with an astonishing 21.5 blown pass blocks and 7 blown run blocks.

You only think that Bushrod is good because Drew Brees makes a lot of mediocre offensive linemen look better than they are.

Extending yourself financially into the future for at best a mild upgrade is a terrible idea. The kind of idea that leads you to sign Stewart Bradley and Adam Snyder.

 

[Buckybird]

1) Cutting Levi Brown this year would only save $800K on the salary cap.
2) Bushrod was given a deal with nearlyh $12M in money coming in the first year.
3) Jermon Bushrod isn't very good--or better than Levi Brown. 3 sacks and 9 penalties to go along with an astonishing 21.5 blown pass blocks and 7 blown run blocks.

You only think that Bushrod is good because Drew Brees makes a lot of mediocre offensive linemen look better than they are.

Extending yourself financially into the future for at best a mild upgrade is a terrible idea. The kind of idea that leads you to sign Stewart Bradley and Adam Snyder.

1) first of all, the mistake was made the day Levi was resigned after being cut

2) sounds like what Levi was gonna make before being axed, but for a better player

3) Bushrod isn't better than stand around Levi Brown? Whatever!
K9 you really cant be serious! Those numbers you throw around for Bushrod is usually a bad game for Levi...seriously!!! Didn't one year he allowed 17 sacks? I wonder how many pressures? 40? Sure Bree's helped those numbers, but don't most very good QBs because of their decision making?

Levi Brown is considered by most people who talk, write & know football to be one of the worst starting LTs in the NFL, that's a fact! I respect your knowledge & insight, but comparing the two is laughable.

Hoping for #75 to be anything else is like pitching a penny in a wishing well & having it come true

 

[GuernseyCard]

1) first of all, the mistake was made the day Levi was resigned after being cut

2) sounds like what Levi was gonna make before being axed, but for a better player

3) Bushrod isn't better than stand around Levi Brown? Whatever!
K9 you really cant be serious! Those numbers you throw around for Bushrod is usually a bad game for Levi...seriously!!! Didn't one year he allowed 17 sacks? I wonder how many pressures? 40? Sure Bree's helped those numbers, but don't most very good QBs because of their decision making?

Levi Brown is considered by most people who talk, write & know football to be one of the worst starting LTs in the NFL, that's a fact! I respect your knowledge & insight, but comparing the two is laughable.

Hoping for #75 to be anything else is like pitching a penny in a wishing well & having it come true

K9's opinion is supported by facts and yours through the abuse of smilies.

 

[THESMEL]

fans

With fans like you who needs enemies- MOST PEOLPE WHO KNOW SOMETHING ABOUT FOOTBALL LAUGHS AT YOU!
SMUSHDOWN LEVI BROWN is not the problem with the Arizona Cardinals. i


Left tackle Levi Brown has long been the whipping boy for Arizona Cardinals fans. That short of changed in 2012 when he was lost for the season with a torn triceps. Then fans saw just how bad it could be. coming into this season, head coach Bruce Arians has already thrown the "elite" word around to describe Brown.

http://arizonasports.com/40/1580086/Jaworski-I-was-sore-after-watching-Kolb

Kevin Kolb, let's get real guys, will not finish the season," he said. "It'll be (John) Skelton very soon, then Ryan Lindley after that and whoever they sign as a free agent. This line is just not holding up."

So what's the problem? Obviously, the season-ending triceps injury left tackle Levi Brown suffered in preseason put the Cardinals into scramble mode. Journeyman left tackle D'Anthony Batiste and rookie fourth-round pick Bobby Massie have been exploited, especially in the last two weeks.
Jaworski pins the responsibility on the Cardinals' front office, and their perceived failure to address the line through the draft. "Seems like for a decade, the Cardinals have been trying to rebuild their offensive line and they can't seem to get it done, so you're never going to get consistent quarterback play from that position if your offensive line is not addressed and at least stabilized."

1) first of all, the mistake was made the day Levi was resigned after being cut

2) sounds like what Levi was gonna make before being axed, but for a better player

3) Bushrod isn't better than stand around Levi Brown? Whatever!
K9 you really cant be serious! Those numbers you throw around for Bushrod is usually a bad game for Levi...seriously!!! Didn't one year he allowed 17 sacks? I wonder how many pressures? 40? Sure Bree's helped those numbers, but don't most very good QBs because of their decision making?

Levi Brown is considered by most people who talk, write & know football to be one of the worst starting LTs in the NFL, that's a fact! I respect your knowledge & insight, but comparing the two is laughable.

Hoping for #75 to be anything else is like pitching a penny in a wishing well & having it come true

 

[PDXChris]

Mike Jurecki ‏@mikejurecki 1m
A name that could be on the #Cardinals radar is RT Eric Winston , sounds he’s looking for a starting job, but could come in and compete.

HMM

 

[kerouac9]

If I were Michael Bidwill, I wouldn't be interested in sinking some $15M in resources (Brown dead money + upfront obligations to Bushrod) for what would be, at best, a mild improvement in Jaron Bushrod.

I'm not a huge fan of Pro Football Focus, but some people are convinced by their data: https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/10/17/snapshot-pbe-offensive-tackles/

If you look there, you'll find Bushrod in some pretty poor company.

 

[Quinn McCollum]

Darren Urban ‏@Cardschatter 6m

Lot of Levi talk suddenly RT @PaulCalvisi: I'm hearing Levi Brown asked to lose weight before #CardsCamp & has indeed lost significant lbs


Very much could been the reason why the coaches were not happy with him during off season workouts.