Lightyear (Disney/Pixar)

[JohnnyCakes]

Dumb comment. That's like saying if they make a cartoon of alive action movie the same person has to play the part in the cartoon. You don't get the premise. It's not the same character. The Premise is that Andy from Toy Story wanted Buzz lighter toy (which is what the Toy Story movies are about) based on his favorite movie. That movie is this....Lightyear. NOT THE SAME CHARACTER. It's not Buzz the toy. It's no different then making a cartoon out of any other live action movie.

Also, you didn't see this so you don't know what your talking about in terms of WOKE either. The movie in no way shape or form is trying to be Woke. What you are alluding to is a couple seconds on screen and has nothing to do with the rest of the movie outside of establishing who one character is.

Sounds like you let politics, sound bites or taking heads drive your opinion instead of actually judging something based on facts or actually seeing it for yourself.

< siiiiiigh >

you just. dont. get. it.

 

[JohnnyCakes]

LOL.

It's a bust, sure, but it's not disastrous. Disney will be just fine. And you still don't understand the premise. And your ilk are the ones that have a big problem with the "kiss". That says more about you than anyone else. Woke? Come on.

Nobody cares about who kisses who. Literally , nobody. Go kiss you brother, you dog, your wife your mailman. Nobody cares....

Its changing/altering a simple childrens cartoon character to promote your politics.

Thats why its a flop, its political boloney, and and kids dont dig that.

And yes, it was a disastrous, embarrassing flop.

 

[Covert Rain]

< siiiiiigh >

you just. dont. get. it.

This is coming from the person who has not seen the movie or understands the premise. OK. They didn't change the premise of the movie. It's a 2 second scene that has no impact on the overall story or plot. LOL.

Again, you don't know what you are talking about because you are listening to talking heads to tell you what is in the movie.

P.S. You do realize how many billion-dollar hits Disney has had where people have called those movies "Woke" as well? LOL. Go Woke and get broke might be the stupidest comment I hear out there. Disney is making billions overall with their movies. Lightyear won't be a blip and they won't go broke. LOL.

 

[puckhead]

Nobody cares about who kisses who. Literally , nobody. Go kiss you brother, you dog, your wife your mailman. Nobody cares....

Its changing/altering a simple childrens cartoon character to promote your politics.

Thats why its a flop, its political boloney, and and kids dont dig that.

And yes, it was a disastrous, embarrassing flop.

How can one have so many strong opinions about something you've never seen?

 

[Cheesebeef]

I almost never agree with Johnny, especially about anything “woke”, but I do think Disney kicking Tim Allen to the curb and bringing in Evans to voice him hurt the box office. And I’m betting multiple factors went into it… hoping that Evans brings in the younger/Avengers audience and Disney may have been trying to distance itself from a MAGA guy last year after the insurrection.

I mean… there’s no way they ever make a Woody movie without Tom Hanks.

Changing Buzz’s voice plus the confusing premise of what/who Buzz is in the movie (first thing Evans said was it was the real life Buzz that the toy was based on… then it was based on a movie Andy watched?) made for a muddy ad campaign.

Then, shave off a segment of families who can now just wait a month for these movies to hit Disney Plus and a segment of the movie going public bigoted against the LGTBQ community and so slavishly devoted to a moron like Trump who would boycott because FOX told them to, and it all ads up to a big disappointment at the box office.

 

[Chaplin]

< siiiiiigh >

you just. dont. get. it.

I almost never agree with Johnny, especially about anything “woke”, but I do think Disney messed up kicking Tim Allen to the curb and bringing in Evans to voice him. And I’m betting multiple factors went into it… hoping that Evans brings in the younger/Avengers audience and Disney may have been trying to distance itself from a MAGA guy last year after the insurrection.

There’s no way they ever make a Woody movie without Tom Hanks.

Changing Buzz’s voice plus the confusing premise of what/who Buzz is in the movie (first thing Evans said was it was the real life Buzz that the toy was based on… then it was based on a movie Andy watched?) made for a muddy ad campaign.

Yeah, but that's a pretty weak criticism, don't you think? You have a point, but I'm not sure it's really a strong one -- not a reflection on you, but the point itself.

My 6-year-old has plenty of Iron Man action figures that talk, and none of them use Robert Downey Jr's voice.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yeah, but that's a pretty weak criticism, don't you think? You have a point, but I'm not sure it's really a strong one -- not a reflection on you, but the point itself.

My 6-year-old has plenty of Iron Man action figures that talk, and none of them use Robert Downey Jr's voice.

sure, but you're talking about the reality of kid's toys and movie stars not voicing them. but I don't think most people make that leap when they see an animated character on screen, who they've known and loved for decades, look exactly the same but sound very different. there's just a weird disconnect there in the movie space.

and like i said, I don't think it was the main factor, but I do think it was one of many and can see where there's at least a little credence to replacing Allen as a reason it sputtered out of the gate.

 

[Covert Rain]

sure, but you're talking about the reality of kid's toys and movie stars not voicing them. but I don't think most people make that leap when they see an animated character on screen, who they've known and loved for decades, look exactly the same but sound very different. there's just a weird disconnect there in the movie space.

and like i said, I don't think it was the main factor, but I do think it was one of many and can see where there's at least a little credence to replacing Allen as a reason it sputtered out of the gate.

My kids didn't blink an eye. Didn't care. My oldest said the same thing I posted above. He said it made sense. He said if this were live action, he wouldn't expect in a cartoon for it to be the same actor in live action. He thought this was a similar scenario even though it was animation. He didn't think they were the same character. Not one of my kids asked is that "Tim Allen". That's grown-up fodder.

 

[Cheesebeef]

My kids didn't blink an eye. Didn't care. My oldest said the same thing I posted above. He said it made sense. He said if this were live action, he wouldn't expect in a cartoon for it to be the same actor in live action. He thought this was a similar scenario even though it was animation. Not one of my kids asked is that "Tim Allen". That's grown up fodder.

Sure, but grown-ups are a big part of the Pixar demographic. That's what usually makes the movies so huge... that they're legitimately 4 quadrant films. and the reality is the movie 100% sputtered out of the gate in weekend 1 and then had one of the worst second weekend drops of any Pixar movie ever. And you and Chap both liked it a lot and it got solid reviews... so there's got to be some reason why it never achieved liftoff.

spinning off the main character and then altering who was playing him has to be at least a reason why this is such a dud after Disney was probably expecting boffo box office. Remember, this is the first Pixar film they've put back in theaters since the pandemic with all others going right to streaming.

 

[Covert Rain]

Sure, but grown-ups are a big part of the Pixar demographic. That's what usually makes the movies so huge... that they're legitimately 4 quadrant films. and the reality is the movie 100% sputtered out of the gate in weekend 1 and then had one of the worst second weekend drops of any Pixar movie ever. And you and Chap both liked it a lot and it got solid reviews... so there's got to be some reason why it never achieved liftoff.

spinning off the main character and then altering who was playing him has to be at least a reason why this is such a dud after Disney was probably expecting boffo box office. Remember, this is the first Pixar film they've put back in theaters since the pandemic with all others going right to streaming.

I agree but not having Tim Allen doesn't appear to be an issue with most people that have seen it. I know it's anecdotal but our "family circle of friends" that have seen it with theirs didn't miss Tim Allen one bit. Not sure if it's for the same reasons I put above. I think there is a certain segment looking for excuses to bash the movie. It very well could be a factor but IMO the marketing for the movie was horrendous. IMO that was the number one reason.

Don't know if you have seen it but at the very start they have a simple statement about what the movie was about. The parents next to us evidently didn't get it until that very opening scene. The mom said "ohhhhh" and the dad said "oh I get it.". That's not a good sign when even people going didn't get the premise.

 

[puckhead]

... Remember, this is the first Pixar film they've put back in theaters since the pandemic with all others going right to streaming.

I didn't realize that. How have other movies of a similar genre/target audience been doing in theaters? (I don't have kids, so I'm don't have my finger on the pulse of this segment at all)

 

[Cheesebeef]

I didn't realize that. How have other movies of a similar genre/target audience been doing in theaters? (I don't have kids, so I'm don't have my finger on the pulse of this segment at all)

Sonic 2 was a big overperformer. Otherwise, there haven't been a lot of animated flicks that have come out. I think The Bad Guys was a pretty unheralded animated flick that's done decent at 95 million domestic, 242 global.

New Minions movie comes out this weekend. I'm interested to see how that does.

 

[Chaplin]

sure, but you're talking about the reality of kid's toys and movie stars not voicing them. but I don't think most people make that leap when they see an animated character on screen, who they've known and loved for decades, look exactly the same but sound very different. there's just a weird disconnect there in the movie space.

and like i said, I don't think it was the main factor, but I do think it was one of many and can see where there's at least a little credence to replacing Allen as a reason it sputtered out of the gate.

I don't know, I don't think I agree. They have said that Lightyear's voice is Captain America. That likely does the opposite of driving people away in some instances.

I just don't think the lack of Tim Allen is that big of a deal.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I agree but not having Tim Allen doesn't appear to be an issue with most people that have seen it. I know it's anecdotal but our "family circle of friends" that have seen it with theirs didn't miss Tim Allen one bit. Not sure if it's for the same reasons I put above. I think there is a certain segment looking for excuses to bash the movie. It very well could be a factor but IMO the marketing for the movie was horrendous. IMO that was the number one reason.

Don't know if you have seen it but at the very start they have a simple statement about what the movie was about. The parents next to us evidently didn't get it until that very opening scene. The mom said "ohhhhh" and the dad said "oh I get it.". That's not a good sign when even people going didn't get the premise.

without a doubt. but i think the recasting of the character is baked a little into that cake.

 

[Chaplin]

I also don't think there is a huge difference between the younger Chris Evans and the older Tim Allen as far as their voices go.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I don't know, I don't think I agree. They have said that Lightyear's voice is Captain America. That likely does the opposite of driving people away in some instances.

I just don't think the lack of Tim Allen is that big of a deal.

okay. just for discussion sake, take Allen out of the situation. having seen the movie and said you really liked it, why do you think the movie is seriously underperforming?

 

[Chaplin]

okay. just for discussion sake, take Allen out of the situation. having seen the movie and said you really liked it, why do you think the movie is seriously underperforming?

That's a good question. Releasing right when school is getting out -- Minions is positioned much better because school is already out.

Parents also have probably already made theater trips to see Dr. Strange, but especially Top Gun, and don't want to spend another 100 bucks to go see Lightyear. Especially knowing it will show up on Disney + sooner rather than later.

I think Minions will outperform Lightyear, and possibly overwhelmingly.

 

[Covert Rain]

That's a good question. Releasing right when school is getting out -- Minions is positioned much better because school is already out.

Parents also have probably already made theater trips to see Dr. Strange, but especially Top Gun, and don't want to spend another 100 bucks to go see Lightyear. Especially knowing it will show up on Disney + sooner rather than later.

I think Minions will outperform Lightyear, and possibly overwhelmingly.

Don't forget Jurrasic as well. Again, I think this is mostly about the piss poor marketing. I don't know anybody that says....hey kids "Tim Allen" is in a movie....let's go. It could be a factor but a very small one IMO. He is way past his A-list days.

 

[puckhead]

okay. just for discussion sake, take Allen out of the situation. having seen the movie and said you really liked it, why do you think the movie is seriously underperforming?

My question was aimed at trying to determine if there was A. still some hesitancy due to COVID, and B. the ability to wait a month and watch in the home for a lot less money.

My money is on B. having the biggest impact, especially when it comes to kids movies. We all have big screens and you can make popcorn for a year at home for the price you pay for a family bucket in theater.

 

[Chaplin]

Don't forget Jurrasic as well. Again, I think this is mostly about the piss poor marketing. I don't know anybody that says....hey kids "Tim Allen" is in a movie....let's go. It could be a factor but a very small one IMO. He is way past his A-list days.

Geez, how can I forget Jurassic World??

 

[puckhead]

Don't forget Jurrasic as well. Again, I think this is mostly about the piss poor marketing. I don't know anybody that says....hey kids "Tim Allen" is in a movie....let's go. It could be a factor but a very small one IMO. He is way past his A-list days.

Can't dismiss the marketing angle either. Since I am not in the target demo, I don't even pay attention to that stuff.

 

[Chaplin]

My question was aimed at trying to determine if there was A. still some hesitancy due to COVID, and B. the ability to wait a month and watch in the home for a lot less money.

My money is on B. having the biggest impact, especially when it comes to kids movies. We all have big screens and you can make popcorn for a year at home for the price you pay for a family bucket in theater.

COVID is interesting --- an argument against that is that Top Gun is making so much money, but that movie has an audience that is all adults, a lot of which would be vaccinated. COVID is probably a bigger issue with Lightyear's audience. The Minions numbers will be interesting if it supports that use case.

 

[Dback Jon]

My question was aimed at trying to determine if there was A. still some hesitancy due to COVID, and B. the ability to wait a month and watch in the home for a lot less money.

My money is on B. having the biggest impact, especially when it comes to kids movies. We all have big screens and you can make popcorn for a year at home for the price you pay for a family bucket in theater.

I'd agree with that - #B. Disney used to not release movies to home theater, then rarely. Now it is full on Disney+, which means families can wait to see it at home in a month for far cheaper.

 

[Covert Rain]

I'd agree with that - #B. Disney used to not release movies to home theater, then rarely. Now it is full on Disney+, which means families can wait to see it at home in a month for far cheaper.

That has caused some confusion. After it was released, my wife wondered if this was something we can watch on Disney+, only in the theater or if was on both at the same time? It wasn't until after we watched Strange, Top Gun and Jurassic World that we looked into it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

COVID is interesting --- an argument against that is that Top Gun is making so much money, but that movie has an audience that is all adults, a lot of which would be vaccinated. COVID is probably a bigger issue with Lightyear's audience. The Minions numbers will be interesting if it supports that use case.

the fly in the ointment of this theory is Sonic 2, which was a smash back in April of this year and then held well week to week.