Mavs/Warriors trade.........

[SirStefan32]

Originally posted by elindholm
They are still soft and can't defend.

Finley is probably their toughest player and best defender. Who do you see Dallas trading him for?

Kurt Thomas, Brian Grant.

Having said that, I doubt they will trade Finley. They just lost their back up PG/SG. They don't have any depth as far as guards go.

Stefan

 

[elindholm]

... and then they have to extend Marbury's contract, they have to max out Stoudemire.

JJ and Jake will want new contracts too.

Yes, but at least then, the Suns will be getting talent close to what they're paying for. I seriously doubt they will overpay Johnson or Tsakalidis, and I'm holding out hope that Marbury will agree to something less than an "overmax" contract.

 

[SirStefan32]

True.

 

[fordronken]

What this trade really means is that the Mavs now have 4 players who, if added to just about any(if not any) team in the east, would immediately become either their best or second best player.

 

[elindholm]

What this trade really means is that the Mavs now have 4 players who, if added to just about any(if not any) team in the east, would immediately become either their best or second best player.

True enough, but that was already true for the Lakers and Timberwolves (although I guess Szczerbiak is a bit of a stretch).

 

[SirStefan32]

But they still have no D, and no tough offensive or defensive inside presence.

 

[fordronken]

Originally posted by elindholm
True enough, but that was already true for the Lakers and Timberwolves (although I guess Szczerbiak is a bit of a stretch).

And it was probably true before the trade as well.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by Chris_Sanders
I would hope so or these moves reek of panic for Golden State.

Great idea bad execution. trading Jamison was a good move, but they got very little for him which was bad. They didn't even get caproom until 2006.

Jamison was the guy I figured SHOULD go but wouldn't because of his contract, so I'm happy he's gone but what a lousy deal.

 

[cly2tw]

The bright side of the trade for the Warrior's is that they got rid of two big burdens in Jamison and Fortsan. They now have a chance for a 'fresh' start. Whether they'd screw it up again? Noone knows.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by cly2tw
The bright side of the trade for the Warrior's is that they got rid of two big burdens in Jamison and Fortsan. They now have a chance for a 'fresh' start. Whether they'd screw it up again? Noone knows.

How can you have a "fresh start" if your hands are tied because you didn't get any substantial cap relief?

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by SirStefan32
Another thing to consider is that GSW got rid of Fortson's terrible contract.

Yes and they acquired Eschmeyer's excellent one.

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by elindholm

To me this trade seems very good for Dallas.

Me too.

GSW traded

Jamison for Van Exel

I'm not a huge Jamison-fan either and Van Exel is a talented PG but Jamison is 5 years younger.Van Exel is simply can't be worth more.

Last time when Van Exel was the best player of a non-play-off team he immediately became a locker-room-cancer.
That's was one of the main reasons why DEN made the Howard-trade.

He will be exactly in the same situation in GSW. He will have some +35 points games and he alone will win some games for the Warriors but I'm pretty that we will read a lot of Van Exel trade-rumours in January of 2004.

From the other side the Jamison/Nowitzki F combo can work together because Nowitzki's excellent outside-shooting will complement well Jamison's powerful post-up play.

Fortson for Eschmeyer

Ok, Fortson is one-sided but Eschmeyer is "zero-sided".
Last time when Fortson was a starter he putted up 11/12.
Last time when Eschmeyer was a starter he putted up 3/5.

Mills for Johnson

Mills still can play some minutes while Johnson will probably retire soon and become an assistant coach somewhere else.

Welsch for nothing

Welsch is still promising combo G.


All in all that was a pretty stupid move from GSW.

That's already the 5th in the last 2 years.

1. Not to get a 3rd-year option on Arenas's contract or to create enough cap room for keeping him.

2.Matching with HOU's offer sheet for Marc Jackson then pay him 1 mil., make him to a cancer and get a #53 pick in 2007 for him.

3.Picking up Dunleavy at #3.

4.Picking up Pietrus at #11(I know, I'm biased).

5.Make the Jamison trade.

 

[hcsilla]

Anyway I'm still curious how will Nelson build their team defense.

Till the Mavericks played defense last season they had the best record in NBA.
Nelson always putted a defensive-minded swingman in their starting lineup.
First Griffin and Buckner, later Najera and Bell.
Now after acquiring of Jamison and getting their big4 they have no room for a defensive specialist.

 

[Chaplin]

I think a few of you guys are underrating just how important Nick Van Exel was to the Mavs. He single-handedly beat the Kings in the playoffs last year, IN EVERY GAME THEY WON. Period. NVE was the ONLY clutch playoff performer Dallas had.

I think Dallas got the better of the deal, but I don't think they are that much improved.

 

[elindholm]

If Van Exel was going to continue to be the Mavericks' top playoff performer, they were doomed anyway. There's only so far you can go with Van Exel as your best player.

The Mavericks get a significant talent upgrade (for a financial price, of course) and give themselves room to grow.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by elindholm

The Mavericks get a significant talent upgrade (for a financial price, of course) and give themselves room to grow.

I won't argue that they upgraded, but significantly? I don't think so. Jamison is a fine player, and Welsch could turn into something, but other than that, I don't see how they are a significant upgrade, especially when you consider Fortson and Jamison's contracts...

 

[elindholm]

I don't see how they are a significant upgrade, especially when you consider Fortson and Jamison's contracts...

The contracts have nothing to do with the talent, and I already acknowledged the financial price.

Fortson has an attitude problem, but he's 20 times better than Eschmeyer, whose contract is just as long. And he costs only $3 million per year more, which is chump change to Cuban, even after the luxury tax doubles it.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by Chaplin
I won't argue that they upgraded, but significantly? I don't think so. Jamison is a fine player, and Welsch could turn into something, but other than that, I don't see how they are a significant upgrade, especially when you consider Fortson and Jamison's contracts...

As others said NVE has been a problem when he's not on a playoff team, unless he opts out after this year I expect a highly paid ballhog who won't be good in the locker room.

Getting rid of Jamison's deal is almost a wash NVE makes 10.9 this year, Jamison 12. Fortson was a bad contract but again we took on enough other contracts that unless NVE opts out after this year(and or Dampier) there is no real cap relief until 2006.

I liked Welsch a lot when we picked him but he's got a real problem in terms of physical strength, he can get inside fairly effectively but he's not strong enough to finish. The overwhelming commment on him from summer league this year was "I've never seen a guy so consistently go to the hole and not be able to finish". The Warriors decided Pietrus was a better SG and they had better PG's on the roster. Logan was apparently overweight in summer league but most felt even he outplayed Welsch.

Jamison merely makes Dallas an even worse defensive club. That said, he is one of those guys who can score without a lot of set plays because he's good at getting his own garbage. But that team has really good ball movement and that's not Antawns' game.

They will certainly get scoring from him but I'm not convince he makes them any better.

The Warriors should have gotten more in return, either in players or expiring contracts.

FYI today's local paper Steinmetz says he thinks Mullin actually masterminded the deal not St. Jean.

 

[elindholm]

Any chance that Van Exel will be shipped to Utah now? Or Claxton, for that matter?

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by elindholm
Any chance that Van Exel will be shipped to Utah now? Or Claxton, for that matter?

I do think someone is gone at PG because they got Avery Johnson too. With Logan and Sura they have 5 guys who can play PG. I think Logan gets cut(if he ever actually signs) but I would think someone will get moved from those other 4.

Again trading AJ made sense, it just doesn't seem like they got either talent or caproom in return.

The previous rumor was AJ and Richardson for Finley and LaFrentz, I would have preferred that deal.

I don't know a thing about Rigodeaux but apparently he's staying overseas again this coming season.

 

[Billythekid]

I just see it as an Idiotic and terrible off-season for the GSW.

They were the suprise packet of last season with so much more room to improve. What did they expect to do last season? I would've thought last year exeeded all expectations. And given everyone alot of confidence for their future... for a real change, they had something going. Maybe not championship quality but defiantly playoff material with improvement.

So what do they do. Let their most important player walk away to the Rubble that MJ left and trade their best scorer for a locker room disease.

Personally, if I was a Warrior fan i'd be outraged.

 

[Russ Smith]

Originally posted by Billythekid
I just see it as an Idiotic and terrible off-season for the GSW.

They were the suprise packet of last season with so much more room to improve. What did they expect to do last season? I would've thought last year exeeded all expectations. And given everyone alot of confidence for their future... for a real change, they had something going. Maybe not championship quality but defiantly playoff material with improvement.

So what do they do. Let their most important player walk away to the Rubble that MJ left and trade their best scorer for a locker room disease.

Personally, if I was a Warrior fan i'd be outraged.

Again, to keep Arenas was a mutual decision, he had to agree to take less this year and trust they'd pay him down the line. He refused to do so and even came out and said he wanted a guarantee from the owner, which FYI violates league rules.

Arenas followed the money because he's still mad about not going in the first round, he's forgotten which team it was that gave him his chance to prove scouts wrong.

Trading Jamison was a good idea but executed poorly. I am not at all happy with who they got. I was fine with losing Arenas I'd have preferred to keep him but understood HE chose to leave and the Warriors simply couldn't stop him, but the trade of Jamison was wrong because it didn't accomplish the goal of clearing caproom in the near future.

Unless NVE opts out after this season in which case it might be a good deal for capspace.

 

[SECTION 11]

What in the hell is Golden State thinking?

 

[sunsfn]

Golden state should have made a trade or moved someone while they had time last year so they had enough money to sign Arenas.
They tried to do this, but obviously they did not try hard enough!

I have always thought that St. Jean was a poor general manager.
The Suns were trying to trade picks and/or players for Mark Jackson. The Suns after trying for a few days finally offered a 1st round pick, St. Jean would not do it because he was upset someone leaked it to the press. (this after everyone knew he was trying for a year to trade him and not play him)
He then traded him to Minnesota for a 2nd round pick?
STUPID!!!

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by sunsfn
Golden state should have made a trade or moved someone while they had time last year so they had enough money to sign Arenas.
They tried to do this, but obviously they did not try hard enough!

I have always thought that St. Jean was a poor general manager.
The Suns were trying to trade picks and/or players for Mark Jackson. The Suns after trying for a few days finally offered a 1st round pick, St. Jean would not do it because he was upset someone leaked it to the press. (this after everyone knew he was trying for a year to trade him and not play him)
He then traded him to Minnesota for a 2nd round pick?
STUPID!!!

Actually the reason they did not make the trade with the Phoenix Suns was because Bryan Colangelo wanted the first-round draft going to Golden state to be lottery protected. Finally BC gave up realizing that the Suns needed to rebuild. They traded Tony Delk and Rodney Rogers to Boston just before the deadline.

Joe Mama