Moving up scenarios

[SirStefan32]

I do believe we will get a much better Bender this year I think Igor is perfect for him

On paper, they look like a perfect match. Bender is a textbook Igor player. Now the question is whether or not Igor can get Bender to be aggressive. He clearly has skills, but I am always worried about players who are passive.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Who are we drafting in this scenario with the #4?

I didn’t make that clear. I would do that trade if Doncic were available. Likely no one else. MAYBE for young, maybe.

 

[Mainstreet]

Chriss' body language seemed much improved especially during the latter part of last season. I wouldn't trade him based on attitude unless he reverts to past behavior. Everyone likes Bender, but Chriss might eventually be the better player.

 

[leclerc]

I think Young will be closer to Jimmer than Steph. Is he fast enough and good enough with the ball for the next level? I have my doubts.

Hopefully we come away with a rotation back court player in addition to number one (Ayton) from the draft. Maybe McD can make a deal for a PG or perhaps Igor has plans for Payton or Knight *shudder*

 

[SirStefan32]

I think Young will be closer to Jimmer than Steph. Is he fast enough and good enough with the ball for the next level? I have my doubts.

Hopefully we come away with a rotation back court player in addition to number one (Ayton) from the draft. Maybe McD can make a deal for a PG or perhaps Igor has plans for Payton or Knight *shudder*

Young is a far better ball-handler and passer than Jimmer ever was. Young won't be able to guard a broken chair, but he will be a solid offensive player. He can pass, shoot, and handle the basketball. Those are three NBA skills he already has.

 

[Finito]

Young is horrible. The first half of the season he was amazing but once people got a look at him he couldn't do anything at all.

 

[Chaplin]

Young is horrible. The first half of the season he was amazing but once people got a look at him he couldn't do anything at all.

He was on a terrible team and the opposition had one job--stop Young. After that, they could coast. So I think that's a bit disingenuous.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Young is horrible. The first half of the season he was amazing but once people got a look at him he couldn't do anything at all.

Wow. He couldn't do anything at all the second half of the season? He finished the season with a PER of 27.4. Are you suggesting he had a PER in the 50's in the first half of the season?

In the second half of the season his numbers went down, his team won fewer games but he still put up better stats the second half of the season than all but a small handful of players. And that was against defenses designed to stop JUST him.

 

[1tinsoldier]

Do nothing. Draft your players. Only way I am giving up anything is if we can get Doncic. Everything else is Lens and Benders

imo, Bagley, J.Jackson, Porter, Bamba, Young are all likely star material and worthy of anything we have besides Devin and Josh.

i love the idea of raising a core of young stars together with our new coach

 

[JCSunsfan]

Young is horrible. The first half of the season he was amazing but once people got a look at him he couldn't do anything at all.

. You must have an odd definition of “couldn’t do anything at all”. His second half numbers were stellar. Not as good as the first half but still star quality.

 

[1tinsoldier]

i'm glad some believe Bender can be fixed. maybe some other team agrees and is up for the project.
you can't teach size, he's got that, but you can only teach a player to be a little more aggressive than his nature
and Bender hasn't got the fire in his belly
Josh did from the start
so even though he was making a lot of mistakes most of the year
i stayed optimistic

Trae Young is another player with the fire inside
and he has the skill and confidence to make it work in the NBA
i watched him take 4 big 3 point shots in tournament crunch time and make half of them
and 2 weeks ago i heard him say he "wants to be the best ever"
(a lot of players might, and should think that, but few will say it)

Bamba is another one with the will

again: #5, #6, or #7
make it happen, phx

 

[Hoop Head]

(a lot of players might, and should think that, but few will say it)

I think a lot of players say it before they're picked, or when they're rookies, but you can tell the ones who actually mean it and are willing to put in the work. Booker is one of those, we've seen that first hand. I think Trae Young is legitimately one of those guys also as well. I agree the he could be really special. I can't see him ending up like a Jimmer Fredette type and flaming out.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think a lot of players say it before they're picked, or when they're rookies, but you can tell the ones who actually mean it and are willing to put in the work. Booker is one of those, we've seen that first hand. I think Trae Young is legitimately one of those guys also as well. I agree the he could be really special. I can't see him ending up like a Jimmer Fredette type and flaming out.

You can mean it all you want and still flame out. You don’t think jimmer wanted it badly enough and that’s why he didn’t succeed? No, I never heard anything about jimmer not putting in the effort. He just didn’t have the ability to translate. Mostly due to physical limitations imo. Could easily be the same for young who is physically underwhelming.

 

[Phrazbit]

I think a lot of players say it before they're picked, or when they're rookies, but you can tell the ones who actually mean it and are willing to put in the work. Booker is one of those, we've seen that first hand. I think Trae Young is legitimately one of those guys also as well. I agree the he could be really special. I can't see him ending up like a Jimmer Fredette type and flaming out.

Young's best ability is his passing, he is the best college passing guard I've seen in ages. Jimmer didn't pass. I don't see them being anything alike.

 

[Mainstreet]

i'm glad some believe Bender can be fixed. maybe some other team agrees and is up for the project.
you can't teach size, he's got that, but you can only teach a player to be a little more aggressive than his nature
and Bender hasn't got the fire in his belly
Josh did from the start
so even though he was making a lot of mistakes most of the year
i stayed optimistic

Trae Young is another player with the fire inside
and he has the skill and confidence to make it work in the NBA
i watched him take 4 big 3 point shots in tournament crunch time and make half of them
and 2 weeks ago i heard him say he "wants to be the best ever"
(a lot of players might, and should think that, but few will say it)

Bamba is another one with the will

again: #5, #6, or #7
make it happen, phx

I give Bender more flexibility because he did not play high level competition before entering the NBA plus he was so young.

 

[Errntknght]

Jimmer just wasn't much of a playmaker and really not consistently that good a shooter

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I think a lot of players say it before they're picked, or when they're rookies, but you can tell the ones who actually mean it and are willing to put in the work. Booker is one of those, we've seen that first hand. I think Trae Young is legitimately one of those guys also as well. I agree the he could be really special. I can't see him ending up like a Jimmer Fredette type and flaming out.

You can mean it all you want and still flame out. You don’t think jimmer wanted it badly enough and that’s why he didn’t succeed? No, I never heard anything about jimmer not putting in the effort. He just didn’t have the ability to translate. Mostly due to physical limitations imo. Could easily be the same for young who is physically underwhelming.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Young's best ability is his passing, he is the best college passing guard I've seen in ages. Jimmer didn't pass. I don't see them being anything alike.

Yeah, they are nothing alike despite the fact some fans keep calling Trae the next Jimmer.

I really don't understand the current view on Young. Had he been injured the first half of the season, his second half performance alone would get him mentioned as a lottery pick. But because it was well below his earlier play, he's getting picked apart.

 

[Raze]

Young's best ability is his passing, he is the best college passing guard I've seen in ages. Jimmer didn't pass. I don't see them being anything alike.

I agree. Young is an outstanding passer. His total offensive package is dynamic.

Who the heck compared him to Jimmer? Any fan that compares Young to Jimmer doesn't have the first clue about basketball. That's one of the laziest comparisons I've heard of. (BTW, I'm not casting any shade on PH here. He was just saying he won't "flame out" like Jimmer.)

 

[Hoop Head]

You can mean it all you want and still flame out. You don’t think jimmer wanted it badly enough and that’s why he didn’t succeed? No, I never heard anything about jimmer not putting in the effort. He just didn’t have the ability to translate. Mostly due to physical limitations imo. Could easily be the same for young who is physically underwhelming.

Perhaps the drive wasn't there. I don't remember seeing Jimmer interviews but he seemed content to be in the league, like a lot of guys are. I think Young will deliver. There's a better chance he ends up helping a team than fading into obscurity.

 

[Hoop Head]

The only reason I've mentioned Young and Jimmer in the same post is because I've seen others do that here when questioning if that is what Young will become. I can't see that happening. I would have went with Eddie House if I was making a comparison of someone who never really found a role in the league for Suns fans to be able to connect with but since Jimmer's name had come up, I wasn't going to change course for that. Young should end up being no worse than in the top 3 in assists every year and averaging around 15 ppg with a 30's/low 40's 3pt percentage. He has great court vision, has an ability to score from outside and a high enough BB-IQ that he'll know when to score and when to facilitate well enough he won't have trouble staying in favor with a team and his teammates so he'll always have a starting job in the league.

I know the comparison I want to make is Nash with the Mavericks before he returned but a Nash comparison with Suns fans is a bit difficult to get by.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah, they are nothing alike despite the fact some fans keep calling Trae the next Jimmer.

I really don't understand the current view on Young. Had he been injured the first half of the season, his second half performance alone would get him mentioned as a lottery pick. But because it was well below his earlier play, he's getting picked apart.

I don’t think the comparison hails from their games being similar - at least that’s not what I’d be arguing if I was comparing them - I think it’s more that both were GREAT collegiate players whose physical limitations (might) fail them in the pros.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Perhaps the drive wasn't there. I don't remember seeing Jimmer interviews but he seemed content to be in the league, like a lot of guys are. I think Young will deliver. There's a better chance he ends up helping a team than fading into obscurity.

That’s 100% conjecture on your part because we NEVER heard a single word that questioned his commitment or drive. Literally NEVER. So you’re really making that up if it’s an argument you’re relying on.

IN YOUR OPINION there’s a better chance he ends up helping a team than fading into oblivion. But the reality is, more draft picks (even top draft picks) fail than succeed, so there’s actually a better chance that he fades into oblivion than he ends up helping team, if you’re going to view things objectively.

 

[leclerc]

You can mean it all you want and still flame out. You don’t think jimmer wanted it badly enough and that’s why he didn’t succeed? No, I never heard anything about jimmer not putting in the effort. He just didn’t have the ability to translate. Mostly due to physical limitations imo. Could easily be the same for young who is physically underwhelming.

I said I was sceptical to Young and feared he'd have more of a Jimmer career, where he'd be unstoppable in college but not make it in the NBA mostly because of physical limitations, like Ouchie recognized.

I then said that the reason Curry was able to be great, was that he had speed and exceptional ball handling in addition to being a fantastic shooter.

I'm not saying Trae is Jimmer. Relax.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The only reason I've mentioned Young and Jimmer in the same post is because I've seen others do that here when questioning if that is what Young will become. I can't see that happening. I would have went with Eddie House if I was making a comparison of someone who never really found a role in the league for Suns fans to be able to connect with but since Jimmer's name had come up, I wasn't going to change course for that. Young should end up being no worse than in the top 3 in assists every year and averaging around 15 ppg with a 30's/low 40's 3pt percentage. He has great court vision, has an ability to score from outside and a high enough BB-IQ that he'll know when to score and when to facilitate well enough he won't have trouble staying in favor with a team and his teammates so he'll always have a starting job in the league.

I know the comparison I want to make is Nash with the Mavericks before he returned but a Nash comparison with Suns fans is a bit difficult to get by.

See when you say “Young should end up being no worse than in the top 3 in assists every year“ I wonder how you define the word “should.” There’s no “should” for draft picks. I could see “he might” or “I think” but “should?” No. No one knows how these kids will translate to the pro game. Particularly not a kid whose athleticism is questioned. There’s DEFINITELY no “should” for him.