NBA draft picks trade rumors

[Sunburn]

He's an absolutely terrible low post defender. He gives up far too much space, he can't hold his ground against marginal talented big men, he has questionable positioning off opponents shots (more than once I caught him under the basket), and worst of all he doesn't seem to care. When you watch Isaac and Jackson play D, you see passion. When you watch Tatum "play" D you see apathy and confusion.

His team D is also frustrating to watch. He looks lost too often and is late to help (sometimes displaying matador defense).

Stats like what you quoted can be very misleading. If he's guarding the best big guy on the floor then he's doing a great job. If he's guarding a scrub then he's doing a poor job. It also makes a difference if he's guarding the post vs. the perimeter.

And he is too slow to guard NBA SFs. This guy screams tweener on D.

So you're saying Tatum's superior defensive statistic is based off of him primarily guarding "scrub" players over the season? Well, I don't think Duke ever hid Tatum on defense. He played Jonathan Isaac twice. Tatum out-performed Isaac statistically, and displayed effective defense in so doing. Isaac is a better defensive player, Tatum a better offensive player. However, Isaac is no slouch on the offensive end, and Tatum isn't a slouch on the defensive end. Agreed, Tatum needs to improve his low post defense, but his perimeter defense is good and he uses his length well to bother shots. His block and steal numbers are good, and generally are a decent indicator of defensive ability.

 

[overseascardfan]

The defensive stats for Issac, Jackson & Tatum are pretty similar, all three average more than 1bpg & 1spg. Isaac averages about half a block more than the other two but that is to be expected as he is around 3 inches taller than both Jackson & Tatum. So really the deciding factor becomes who is better offensively, that's Tatum.

 

[Raze]

So you're saying Tatum's superior defensive statistic is based off of him primarily guarding "scrub" players over the season? Well, I don't think Duke ever hid Tatum on defense. He played Jonathan Isaac twice. Tatum out-performed Isaac statistically, and displayed effective defense in so doing. Isaac is a better defensive player, Tatum a better offensive player. However, Isaac is no slouch on the offensive end, and Tatum isn't a slouch on the defensive end. Agreed, Tatum needs to improve his low post defense, but his perimeter defense is good and he uses his length well to bother shots. His block and steal numbers are good, and generally are a decent indicator of defensive ability.

No, I just said that stat can be misleading. He defended numerous players every game, both great and scrubby. I just tend to treat stats less valuable than what I see on film. And what I saw was terrible low post D, invisible transition D, and only okay perimeter D. While I agree that he uses his length well on the perimeter, D is played with your legs not your arms. His footwork is lethargic. He coasts when he should attack. And he spends a lot of time watching. What's truly troubling is that he displays great athleticism on O, but you almost never see it on D. Why not? Heart. I absolutely question his heart.

And that's the major difference between Tatum and Isaac. I question Tatum's heart on D. I don't question Isaac's heart on O. I'll take a guy who gives everything he has on both ends over a guy that only wants to play half of the time (if their talent levels are equal.)

I will add this caveat. If I addressed this during the interviews with him and he was embarrassed at his D and has shown a heart to actually fix it, I'd give the kid some grace. He's an offensive talent for sure (his low post ability is truly intriguing). I think he has some of the tools to be an okay defender, if he harnessed them.

But you can't coach heart.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

The defensive stats for Issac, Jackson & Tatum are pretty similar, all three average more than 1bpg & 1spg. Isaac averages about half a block more than the other two but that is to be expected as he is around 3 inches taller than both Jackson & Tatum. So really the deciding factor becomes who is better offensively, that's Tatum.

Except there is more to determining a players abilities than just stats. Sure statistically Tatum may seem like a similar level defender as Jackson and Isaac, but if you actually watch all of them play defense there would be no question that Isaac and Jackson are better in that regard.

 

[WildBB]

True, although if a player with obvious ego issues doesn't want to play for you, it might be better to stay away.

What I meant was, there's no obvious reason for the Lakers not to want him, unless they've decided he's not worth the #2 pick. And if he's not worth the #2 pick, it would be stupid for the Suns to move up in order to take him there, unless they think they are smarter than the Lakers, which they probably aren't.

Exactly, make them burn a #2 on Jackson if they are that enamored with him. We're sitting pretty at 4. Let the Lakers eat Dengs' deal as well. Don't help them there.

 

[AZCrazy]

Did we luck out be getting #4 instead of #2? Would Ball even sign anywhere but LA, or pull an Elway?

 

[GatorAZ]

Did we luck out be getting #4 instead of #2? Would Ball even sign anywhere but LA, or pull an Elway?

The Lakers could've easily lost their pick so he wouldn't have been able to force his way there. I'm sure he'd be working out for the top-5 teams had that happened.

 

[pokerface]

Here's a hint for the Suns brass: If Ball is dying to play for the Lakers and the Lakers don't want him, that's a clear sign that the Suns need to stay the hell away.

Or maybe they just like Jackson/Fox more? Just because they don't like Ball at #2 pick doesn't mean we shouldn't like him at #4 pick. Besides, I think Jackson or Ball fit better with the suns than most other players and he could be BPA at #4 so it's best of both worlds.

 

[pokerface]

Did we luck out be getting #4 instead of #2? Would Ball even sign anywhere but LA, or pull an Elway?

If the Lakers pass on Ball then his love might turn to hate.

 

[devilalum]

If the Lakers pass on Ball then his love might turn to hate.

Yeah, if the Lakers were picking 4th then it might make sense for him to try and scare off other teams but if they pass on him he's just gonna have to suck it up and play ball wherever he goes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[hsandhu]

Stein and Woj saying deep talks between celts and sixers for 3 for 1 swap. sixers waiting for fultz health records.

i said this a few days ago in the thread, that trade makes the most sense, especially with pick assets philly has.

gambo said boston would not take jackson at 1, he is friends with ainge. wonder if they still take him at 3, everyone is saying they love tatum.

looks like either ball or jackson could be there at 4.

 

[Cheesebeef]

If the Lakers pass on Ball then his love might turn to hate.

Dude... if they pass on him, you KNOW he'all be massively motivated to be incredible and stick it to the Lakers every time he can.

There's no better place to do that than the Suns.

That said, there's no way he gets passed LA and Philly who have no PG either. And yes, I know they're "plan" is to play Simmons at the point, but Jerry LOVE LOVE LOVES his PGs and I think they take him there.

 

[Matt L]

Dude... if they pass on him, you KNOW he'all be massively motivated to be incredible and stick it to the Lakers every time he can.

There's no better place to do that than the Suns.

That said, there's no way he gets passed LA and Philly who have no PG either. And yes, I know they're "plan" is to play Simmons at the point, but Jerry LOVE LOVE LOVES his PGs and I think they take him there.

I dont think there's any way Suns get Ball unless we trade up to 2.

The ringer had an interesting idea of the suns taking on a bad contract and swapping picks with the Lakers to grab Ball. I would do that in a heartbeat.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I dont think there's any way Suns get Ball unless we trade up to 2.

The ringer had an interesting idea of the suns taking on a bad contract and swapping picks with the Lakers to grab Ball. I would do that in a heartbeat.

Agree 100%

 

[Ronin]

Adrian Wojnarowski‏Verified account@WojVerticalNBA
Sources: Philadelphia is waiting on medical information on Markelle Fultz, but deep into talks on acquiring Boston's No. 1 overall pic

 

[Ronin]

Adrian Wojnarowski‏Verified account@WojVerticalNBA 47m47 minutes ago
Adrian Wojnarowski Retweeted Adrian Wojnarowski

Boston would acquire Sixers No. 3 overall pick in 2017 and package to include future first from Sixers, sources say.

 

[Sunburn]

Adrian Wojnarowski‏Verified account@WojVerticalNBA 47m47 minutes ago
Adrian Wojnarowski Retweeted Adrian Wojnarowski

Boston would acquire Sixers No. 3 overall pick in 2017 and package to include future first from Sixers, sources say.

Ugh. 6'ers are still a long way away. Boston just keeps acquiring valuable assets. Ainge is a master. Stevens is fantastic. They very well may be the cream of the crop when Lebron and the Warriors begin to decline.

 

[devilalum]

I dont think there's any way Suns get Ball unless we trade up to 2.

The ringer had an interesting idea of the suns taking on a bad contract and swapping picks with the Lakers to grab Ball. I would do that in a heartbeat.

This is a no brainer for me.
I don"t write the checks and I don't care if Sarver has less dollars in his bank account.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Folster]

The Celts must be fairly confident that LA passes on Jackson and that he's available at 3. If LA takes Jackson, I wonder if they nab Tatum.

 

[Sunburn]

This is a no brainer for me.
I don"t write the checks and I don't care if Sarver has less dollars in his bank account.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hmmn they'd probably want us to take Deng or Mozgov. Probably Deng. That means we're on the hook for 18 mil per year until 2020. That could cause roster problems.

 

[devilalum]

Hmmn they'd probably want us to take Deng or Mozgov. Probably Deng. That means we're on the hook for 18 mil per year until 2020. That could cause roster problems.

What's this we kemosabi?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Sunburn]

What's this we kemosabi?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My psyche identifies itself with the Suns organization. Please don't make me question this reality. It may lead to massive psychological consequences.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

The Celts must be fairly confident that LA passes on Jackson and that he's available at 3. If LA takes Jackson, I wonder if they nab Tatum.

That is what they would do. According to Gambo, Celtics are rating Fultz, Ball, Jackson, and Tatum the same.

 

[devilalum]

My psyche identifies itself with the Suns organization. Please don't make me question this reality. It may lead to massive psychological consequences.

Me too but seriously I'm tired of worrying about the money part. One day you'll read about the teams financial problems then a few months later Forbes will report that they made a gazillion dollars.

I don't care how much it costs. I just want a good young team. If they make a trade like this then that tells me they can afford it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Folster]

I'm reminded of how annoying it is in the NBA Draft that teams don't trade picks until after the player is drafted. The NFL has it right.