NBA Free Agency: Realistic options for the Suns

[SweetD]

https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/616273254966104064

Wow Spurs never fail to impress!

So this doesn't mean anything but hype. He was already scheduled to meet with the Spurs. He is meeting with us on Wednesday.... Maybe

 

[Mainstreet]

why are they walking in with Danny Green?!

My thoughts.

 

[sunsfan88]

I like Danny Green but he is not a star player.

Yea but even then he got way less than what people thought he'd be getting which was in the $14-$16M/yr range.

 

[Mainstreet]

DeMarre Carroll signs with Raptors. That's one player off the Suns list.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/238522/DeMarre-Carroll-Agrees-To-Four-Year-$60M-Deal-With-Raptors

 

[JCSunsfan]

tough off season for ATL if they lose Carroll and Millsap.

 

[Mainstreet]

tough off season for ATL if they lose Carroll and Millsap.

But they trade for Splitter.

 

[overseascardfan]

Let them have Marcus or Tucker.

I think the Suns can absorb the rest of Lee's salary.

Throw in a second round pick or the Cavaliers pick if you want to play nice.

I believe PHX has a $7.5M trade exception from the Dragic trade. Lee's salary is $15M+ and Markieff is at $8M. I would rather get rid of Markieff's salary than Marcus or PJ's. What is the max difference in salaries allowed in trades...like 15%?

 

[Covert Rain]

I don't recall you saying anything about major FA signing periods, you said "Suns anticipated making a huge splash and didn't". I don't recall a time since they went after Nash that the Suns anticipated making a major signing. In fact, I don't think even Nash was considered major at the time. He wasn't a max guy at least. Who exactly did the Suns anticipate getting that they didn't? Just because they swung for a the fences on a few doesn't mean they believed they'd get them, they just did what they should do, took a shot. How many major free agents have switched teams? Not many and not many teams get them, but they have to take a chance. IMO you made another claim based on your perception and don't see it as a big deal apparently. Just like arguing that calling something a fact that isn't is not a big deal. I guess I and perhaps others disagree. Maybe that's why I have no interest in made up rumors and conjecture? Opinions are fine, but they should have substance behind them or they have no worth.

I believe clearing up cap space to pursue top free agents qualifies. Dude...it's not my job to jog your memory. Evidently you don't have a problem attempting to call people out without backing up what you say. What proof have you provided to counter anything? It's easy to call someone out when you can't back it up. I couldn't quite recall the specifics either since I am not a human almanac. Sweet D remembered them.

I have no problem being called to the mat if I am wrong. Just back it up. I am not always right and I was going off my memory of the last two times the Suns "advertised" their goal was to "target" max level type players.

You are correct in that not many superstars change teams. The point being is that it seems like every time the Suns have an opportunity to make a big splash...it's more like a belly flop...for whatever reason. Not to mention it appears most of the FA we end up pursuing we don't get and that has been discussed at great length here by many posters.

I never criticized the Suns for giving it the good old college try in FA. It's the Suns reputation that has taken a major hit under Sarver that I think gives FA pause to sign here. That is the problem I have.

It was Kobe and Tmac, It was 2003 and they ended up with a great team on paper.

The other year was 2010-11, but the issues was the looming lockout season and no team was going to sign a non star to a long term deal.

Thank you!

 

[slinslin]

Somebody investigate the Spurs, there is clearly something fishy with how each of their player mysteriously signs for way below market value.

Carroll signs for 4/60 with the Raptors and Green signs for 4/45????!?!

 

[Mainstreet]

I believe PHX has a $7.5M trade exception from the Dragon trade. Lee's salary is $15M+ and Markieff is at $8M. I would rather get rid of Markieff's salary than Marcus or PJ's. What is the max difference in salaries allowed in trades...like 15%?

I'd rather keep Markieff if the legal issues get resolved. He would help GS. I think the Suns may have 12 million CAP space but I could be wrong.

 

[slinslin]

Lillard gets 5 years 120M$.

Someone please try to convince anyone that Bledsoe is overpaid, Bledsoe is a bargain not to mention his contract is decreasing per year.

Lillard is barely better (and younger Lillard is 25 this month, Bledsoe is 26 in December) than Bledsoe if at all and makes 10M$ more per year.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Somebody investigate the Spurs, there is clearly something fishy with how each of their player mysteriously signs for way below market value.

Carroll signs for 4/60 with the Raptors and Green signs for 4/45????!?!

That's about right with the high taxes in Canada and no state tax in TX.

 

[slinslin]

That's about right with the high taxes in Canada and no state tax in TX.

How does that factor?

His market value is still 15M$ per. The salary cap and CBA is the same for every team so he should still get 15M$.

 

[JCSunsfan]

How does that factor?

His market value is still 15M$ per. The salary cap and CBA is the same for every team so he should still get 15M$.

Players care about what they net, not what they gross. Toronto has to overpay to get players. Its really not that hard to understand.

 

[KloD]

Dude...it's not my job jog your memory. I couldn't quite recall the specifics either since I am not a human almanac. Sweet D remembered them.

You are correct in that not many Superstars change teams. The point being is that it seems like everytime the Suns have an opportunity to make a big splash...it's more like a belly flop...for whatever reason.

Not to mention it appears most of the FA we end up pursuing we don't get and that has been discussed at great length here by many posters.





Thank you!

WTF are you going on about? YOU make claims, you get called on said claim, and naturally your response is to get defensive? Name me a team that hasn't flopped in F.A.. Your constant criticisms of the Suns management are the same for every team from time to time. The Lakers are supposed to be this grand attraction and they've failed time and time again to land a major F.A. since Shaq. I just read that Aldridge was not impressed at their meeting last night. They will strike out again this year at the top guys most likely. Because some fans believe the team wanted certain players that the team did not get does not equal the team thought they would get them. I don't believe for a second that the Suns front office ever thought they were getting Kobe.

 

[sunsfan88]

Players care about what they net, not what they gross. Toronto has to overpay to get players. Its really not that hard to understand.

Yup it's been that way for years.

Another example is how Texas sports teams like Cowboys and Mavs are able to be in the running for FAs due to their no state taxes being attractive.

 

[SirStefan32]

How does that factor?

His market value is still 15M$ per. The salary cap and CBA is the same for every team so he should still get 15M$.

Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? Players can sign wherever they want for as little money as they want.

Players love the team, the organization, and the city. They will take a little less money to play for that organization.

Spurs are a great organization, they have the best FO and the coach in recent history, climate is great, there is no state income tax.

 

[CardsFan88]

Players care about what they net, not what they gross. Toronto has to overpay to get players. Its really not that hard to understand.

If memory serves correct that difference, say CA vs TX is 12 percent.

Which means if say Houston offered someone 100 million, then after taxes, the Lakers would need to offer 112 million to match it.

Which also means with some of these guys getting 145 million dollar deals, under the above scenario CA vs TX, CA would need to offer 162.4 million to match 145.

As for Toronto, who knows, but it definitely matters to the players.

But since there is a maximum contract amount, the teams in states with lower or no tax will have an advantage every time. Which means no matter what, Houston can ALWAYS offer more take home money then the Lakers. All Cali teams have to hope players take less for whatever reason, because they will never be able to outbid anyone on a max contract, except maybe Toronto.

 

[slinslin]

Players care about what they net, not what they gross. Toronto has to overpay to get players. Its really not that hard to understand.

With that kind of money every player can have an offseason home in some tax haven or evade high income taxes one way or another.

Still if Toronto is willing to pay a worse player 15M$, other NBA teams should be willing to offer Danny Green that kind of deal too, also other teams with no state tax.

And what if you get traded from such a team? You are going to be happy when they trade you to Canada on your small contract?

 

[KloD]

Players care about what they net, not what they gross. Toronto has to overpay to get players. Its really not that hard to understand.

That is true, but they do file returns in every city they play in. So while they do indeed net more in Texas than in Toronto, It's not $15 million more. Carroll was way overpaid IMO. He's a journeyman who performed well in Atlanta's system for one season, but played below average on what, 3 teams prior? I guess we'll see if he can repeat last season performance with Toronto, let alone show improvement. IMO they will regret giving him that contract.

 

[Covert Rain]

Somebody investigate the Spurs, there is clearly something fishy with how each of their player mysteriously signs for way below market value.

Carroll signs for 4/60 with the Raptors and Green signs for 4/45????!?!

Maybe he is that loyal to the Spurs. It's not the first time a player has signed for under market to help his team out. IMO MJ was underpaid for portion of his career (although he probably didn't care at first because his endorsements were sick).

I don't think that necessarily means there is something fishy does it?

 

[sunsfan88]

https://twitter.com/Vincemarotta/status/616278923878494208

 

[KloD]

If memory serves correct that difference, say CA vs TX is 12 percent.

Which means if say Houston offered someone 100 million, then after taxes, the Lakers would need to offer 112 million to match it.

Which also means with some of these guys getting 145 million dollar deals, under the above scenario CA vs TX, CA would need to offer 162.4 million to match 145.

As for Toronto, who knows, but it definitely matters to the players.

But since there is a maximum contract amount, the teams in states with lower or no tax will have an advantage every time. Which means no matter what, Houston can ALWAYS offer more take home money then the Lakers. All Cali teams have to hope players take less for whatever reason, because they will never be able to outbid anyone on a max contract, except maybe Toronto.

That's not correct. They are required to file state taxes in every state they play.

 

[CardsFan88]

That is true, but they do file returns in every city they play in. So while they do indeed net more in Texas than in Toronto, It's not $15 million more. Carroll was way overpaid IMO. He's a journeyman who performed well in Atlanta's system for one season, but played below average on what, 3 teams prior? I guess we'll see if he can repeat last season performance with Toronto, let alone show improvement. IMO they will regret giving him that contract.

Interesting. So basically it's about half. Still that should amount to about 6-9 million for 100-145 million dollar contracts.

..and it is correct that they will have that disadvantage every time, it was just by what amount that I was wrong.

 

[sunsfan88]

Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? Players can sign wherever they want for as little money as they want.

Players love the team, the organization, and the city. They will take a little less money to play for that organization.

Spurs are a great organization, they have the best FO and the coach in recent history, climate is great, there is no state income tax.

Stop it, you know the logical answer is that their doing something "fishy"