Not excited about Reid

[Dr. Jones]

And all have been borderline horrible to just mediocre after leaving. So to cite him developing QB's as some great trait is far from accurate when he really only has one on his resume that I know of.

Andy Reid has the right to say: The System Works.

 

[Shane]

Andy Reid has the right to say: The System Works.

Not in the last 2 seasons he don't. His system and ability to motivate players seems to have clearly passed him by.

Weak argument BTW.

 

[Dr. Jones]

And all have been borderline horrible to just mediocre after leaving. So to cite him developing QB's as some great trait is far from accurate when he really only has one on his resume that I know of.

When did it become his job to make them successful in the next town? What a completely myopic thing to think.

If we were Eagles fans we would be applauding what he has done.

 

[azsouthendzone]

Max Hall, Derek Anderson, Trading Boldin, benching everyone on the team at some point, keeping Grimm employed, drafting Levi over AP, what else am I missing?

Ryan Lindley, John Skelton, Billy Davis, Alan Faneca, Joey Porter, the list goes on and on.....

 

[Dr. Jones]

Not in the last 2 seasons he don't. His system and ability to motivate players seems to have clearly passed him by.

Weak argument BTW.

You are flat out wrong buddy. Offense worked. Defense did not. We have a defense. And he has always given his DC's latitude to run it.

 

[Shane]

When did it become his job to make them successful in the next town? What a completely myopic thing to think.

If we were Eagles fans we would be applauding what he has done.

Eagles fans wanted his ass run out of town. So clearly that isn't the case.

You keep up citing his past. Well lets talk about his most recent coaching successes. Which is what he should be judged on. There is a reason he was fired and the fans were happy to see him go. Same as us with Whiz.

 

[azsouthendzone]

Shane you are still deeply hurt by Whiz getting boxed. Your confusion is understandable. The rehabilitation from believing in Whiz won't come over night.

 

[crisper57]

Eagles fans wanted his ass run out of town. So clearly that isn't the case.

You keep up citing his past. Well lets talk about his most recent coaching successes. Which is what he should be judged on. There is a reason he was fired and the fans were happy to see him go. Same as us with Whiz.

Philly fans are ******s?

 

[azsouthendzone]

Eagles fans wanted his ass run out of town. So clearly that isn't the case.

You keep up citing his past. Well lets talk about his most recent coaching successes. Which is what he should be judged on. There is a reason he was fired and the fans were happy to see him go. Same as us with Whiz.

Eagles fans want Santa Claus dead. Their measurement of success is unique. If Reid was in AZ we would have had statues built and bad housing developments on the outskirts of town named after him. If..., and I think it's a big IF, the Cards land Reid we could do a lot worse.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

The guy a had a turnover machine QB who looked great but then the league adjusted to him. Vick, no surprise, never adjusted. They had a defense who their coach made a poor decision in moving an OL coach over to the defense in order to allwo them to hire Howard Mudd. They also play in arguably the toughest division in football.

Look, no coach is available because they just won the Super Bowl. Most coaches available either got too much control and made a mistake which got them fired OR have no actual experience and is a total gamble. Cowherd just made a great point on the radio that Belichick, Shanahan, Gruden, and Coughlin all won Super Bowls with their SECOND team they coached. Does Andy Reid come with risks? Sure, but less risks than those who do not have any head coaching resume.

Great post. Very good points.

 

[PACardsFan]

I've stated the guy I want, Doug Marrone from Syracuse. He brought that program from the depths of terribleness, has developed a young QB, his teams play extremely hard, he's 48 and has upward mobility, he has a NFL pedigree, he was the OC in New Orleans under Payton, and he has the endorsements of Parcells, Payton, and Loomis. Besides those things I don't like the guy .

I grew up in Syracuse & have been a fan all my life. You are so right about Marrone being an excellent choice for the Cardinals. He took over a "dead & buried" program @ Syracuse and made them very competitive with 1 & 2 star athletes and almost NO depth at all. He's now getting 3 star recruits & will have Syracuse in the Top 20 next year. He played @ Syracuse and it was breaking his heart to see where our once proud program had regressed to. When he took over, the program was ripe with kids with bad attitudes, criminal records & no work ethic. Within weeks, he had thrown 15 -20 kids off the team. They had so little depth that 1st year, that he had kids playing positions that they had never played before. Before he came on board, we were losing Big East games by 30-40 pts EVERY week. We were probably the WORST Div 1 program in the country. I would hate to see him leave right now, because Syracuse isn't all the way back. But this guy will be an EXCEPTIONAL NFL HC real soon. Syracuse is trying to offer him a long-term contract as we speak. He's the real deal!!

 

[Totally_Red]

Here we go again... Jason Cole thinks Reid is using the Cardinals as leverage.

https://twitter.com/JasonColeYahoo/status/286494936331853824
https://twitter.com/JasonColeYahoo/status/286491933084377089

I'm 95% sure Jason Cole is correct.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Eagles fans wanted his ass run out of town. So clearly that isn't the case.

You keep up citing his past. Well lets talk about his most recent coaching successes. Which is what he should be judged on. There is a reason he was fired and the fans were happy to see him go. Same as us with Whiz.

Lesean McCoy? Bryce Brown? Top 13 offense with an all-pro tackle out for the year? Vick playing catch with the defense? His rookie backup coming in and looking like he knows what he is doing?

I live 2 hours from Lincoln Financial Field. Philly fans are near-sighted and complacent. They want the NFC East title every year. He is compared to the Giants and to Coughlin after every game. He was fired more for what they have done than anything he has done to lose the job.

Hiring Castillo was dumb, I get it. But jesus man..... You know not what you speak of homie.

 

[azsouthendzone]

Lesean McCoy? Bryce Brown? Top 13 offense with an all-pro tackle out for the year? Vick playing catch with the defense? His rookie backup coming in and looking like he knows what he is doing?

I live 2 hours from Lincoln Financial Field. Philly fans are near-sighted and complacent. They want the NFC East title every year. He is compared to the Giants and to Coughlin after every game. He was fired more for what they have done than anything he has done to lose the job.

Hiring Castillo was dumb, I get it. But jesus man..... You know not what you speak of homie.

I'm with Indy on this one. Dr Jones speaks the truth.

 

[sportznutt]

The guy took arguably the most talented roster in the NFL the last two years and coached their asses into the ground. That really cant even be argued.

Those of you citing a decade of success etc... This is a what have you done for me lately league. Thats like saying why the hell diid Jerry Jones replace Tom Landry back in the day etc.... The game passes people by happens all the time. Andy Reid is by no means a sexy pick.

Injuries mean absolutely nothing then?

 

[sportznutt]

Sorry but its an excuse. With that talent he should be able to coach them to MUCH better than 8-8 and 4-12 and playing disgraceful football. Even with his tragedies.

With Nick Foles, Jason Avant, Riley Cooper and Clay Harbor?

 

[Totally_Red]

What about the issue with Andy's players apparently not being willing to 'go through brick walls for him'? Is that a problem with him being unable to motivate them or just a bunch of lazy bums on the team. The last thing the Cardinals need IMO is a head coach who can't get the most out of his talent.


http://tracking.si.com/2013/01/01/michael-vick-rips-teammates-eagles-andy-reid-nfl/?sct=uk_t2_a5

 

[PACardsFan]

There are definitely pros & cons to hiring Reid, so I understand where Shane & Dr. are coming from. Living in York, PA, I've watched plenty of Eagles games during Reid's tenure. Let's not forget just how bad the Eagles were before Reid. They were a laughingstock of a franchise. He turned them around almost immediately. And he did it with a vastly overrated McNabb at QB. Being a Syracuse guy, I knew McNabb's shortcomings. He was wildly erratic & very innacurate. The beauty of Reid's system is that it is a very, very QB friendly system. QB's thrive in his system & then struggle when they leave. That is NOT a knock on Reid. Quite the contrary. If he had a Manning, Rodgers, or Brady, he would have won many multiple SB's.

Pros
1. Very friendly QB system. Has made average QB's (McNabb, Vick, Garcia) look very good. In a QB driven league, that is reason enough to hire him! Vick struggled the most because he's dumb as a rock & a turnover machine.
2. Great x's & o's guy. Learned from the Walsh system. His teams have ALWAYS moved the ball. Even this year's team moved the ball with an injury crippled OL, RB & QB. They didn't win SB's because McNabb couldn't finish drives like the great QB's do, especially in crunch time.
3. Has always had a great eye for RB's. He found Westbrook, who was tiny & played at Villanova. He turned him into a perennial pro bowler. He did the same with Duce Staley. LeSean McCoy was highly regarded, but he has even done better than NFL experts thought he would do.
4. Would bring a great staff with him here. No HC in Cardinal history was afforded that.

Cons
1. Not a great motivator, never was & never will be. He has to win right away or his teams will quit on him.
2. Can he be reinvigorated. He's only 54, but seems older. Eagles teams looked very bored the last 2 years.
3. Personal problems at home. He's lost one son & his other son has issues also.
4. High risk/reward hire. If he succeeds, the Cardinals can be very good in short order. If he fails, it's back to square 1.

 

[PACardsFan]

Injuries mean absolutely nothing then?

They didn't matter with Whisenhunt, why should they matter with Reid?

 

[Shane]

Injuries mean absolutely nothing then?

With Nick Foles, Jason Avant, Riley Cooper and Clay Harbor?

Not an excuse for Whiz was it?

 

[sportznutt]

the difference is, Reid had the talent before injuries, Whiz did not.

McCoy >>>>>>>>>>> Beanie + Williams + Powell + LSH
Vick >>>> Kolb + Skelton + Lindley
Jason Peters >>>>>> anyone on our O-line

Not to mention having your starting WR in and out all season.......we had our starting WR available all season long.

 

[kerouac9]

Tampa fans were thrilled to see Tony Dungy get fired. It could be the same situation with Reed coming to Arizona. Indy came out on the right end of that deal, IMO, although both teams ended up okay.

I'm ambivalent about hiring Andy Reid. The problems with Philly were with their offensive line; their defense too often bore the brunt of the problems. Reid stopped drafting offensive and defensive linemen and started drafting skill position players, and the whole thing fell apart.

Reid would be walking into a situation here where all he'd have to do is find a running back and build the offensive line and get a QB with whom he can live. I think he could do that and be very, very successful here. If he's motivated and his head is right and he can bring in his coterie of assistants.

 

[Totally_Red]

There are definitely pros & cons to hiring Reid, so I understand where Shane & Dr. are coming from. Living in York, PA, I've watched plenty of Eagles games during Reid's tenure. Let's not forget just how bad the Eagles were before Reid. They were a laughingstock of a franchise. He turned them around almost immediately. And he did it with a vastly overrated McNabb at QB. Being a Syracuse guy, I knew McNabb's shortcomings. He was wildly erratic & very innacurate. The beauty of Reid's system is that it is a very, very QB friendly system. QB's thrive in his system & then struggle when they leave. That is NOT a knock on Reid. Quite the contrary. If he had a Manning, Rodgers, or Brady, he would have won many multiple SB's.

Pros
1. Very friendly QB system. Has made average QB's (McNabb, Vick, Garcia) look very good. In a QB driven league, that is reason enough to hire him! Vick struggled the most because he's dumb as a rock & a turnover machine.
2. Great x's & o's guy. Learned from the Walsh system. His teams have ALWAYS moved the ball. Even this year's team moved the ball with an injury crippled OL, RB & QB. They didn't win SB's because McNabb couldn't finish drives like the great QB's do, especially in crunch time.
3. Has always had a great eye for RB's. He found Westbrook, who was tiny & played at Villanova. He turned him into a perennial pro bowler. He did the same with Duce Staley. LeSean McCoy was highly regarded, but he has even done better than NFL experts thought he would do.
4. Would bring a great staff with him here. No HC in Cardinal history was afforded that.

Cons
1. Not a great motivator, never was & never will be. He has to win right away or his teams will quit on him.
2. Can he be reinvigorated. He's only 54, but seems older. Eagles teams looked very bored the last 2 years.
3. Personal problems at home. He's lost one son & his other son has issues also.
4. High risk/reward hire. If he succeeds, the Cardinals can be very good in short order. If he fails, it's back to square 1.

Excellent summation of Andy's pluses and minuses in an unbiased manner. Thanks for that!

I would add that I think Andy is one of the very best at managing the draft. Not sure how much of the credit he deserves, but I've been envious of how well Philly does their draft and stockpiles picks to provide maximum flexibility. That is one area where Rod Graves was sorely lacking IMO and I'm hopeful we improve under whomever is running it next April.

 

[devilalum]

Has everybody forgotten what happened the last time we took on a fat Beagles cast off?

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Chopper0080]

Tampa fans were thrilled to see Tony Dungy get fired. It could be the same situation with Reed coming to Arizona. Indy came out on the right end of that deal, IMO, although both teams ended up okay.

I'm ambivalent about hiring Andy Reid. The problems with Philly were with their offensive line; their defense too often bore the brunt of the problems. Reid stopped drafting offensive and defensive linemen and started drafting skill position players, and the whole thing fell apart.

Reid would be walking into a situation here where all he'd have to do is find a running back and build the offensive line and get a QB with whom he can live. I think he could do that and be very, very successful here. If he's motivated and his head is right and he can bring in his coterie of assistants.

Danny Watkins failing hurt. Brandon Graham never developed.

Since 2006 the Eagles have had 67 draft picks and they have used 25 (37%) of those on either offensive line (12), defensive line (10) or QBs (3). Even in the past three draft, the Eagles have used 13 of their 33 draft picks (39%) on OL (5), DL (6), and QBs (2). Not to mention them acquiring Michael Vick, Jason Babin, Jason Peters, Daryl Tapp and turning FA Evan Mathis into a Pro Bowl OG.

Things just didn't pan out for Reid. They drafted Danny Watkins to upgrade at OG, hasn't panned out. They signed Michael Vick, started great but turned into a turnover machine. Signed Demetress Bell to fill in for Jason Peters, he fell on his face. Lost their starting C to IR early. DRC showed what he is as a player. Asomugha proved to be done despite the entire league chasing him. Jason Babin went from a double digit sack guy to a liability in two seasons. Maclin and Desean Jackson have both missed time.

Shane, you are correct in that some of these issues are self made, but you aren't seeing that just as many are bad luck. In the end, I choose to put my money into the 10 years of success vs. the 2 years of poor results, even if those are the most recent.