Oh My ........ They are retaining a lot of assistant coaches

[conraddobler]

Pendy isn't awful but he's not setting the world on fire either.

Green's personal henchmen may have caused the problem but truly our corners are just bad, with excellent corners and a younger FS we'd be really good on defense IMO.

 

[Covert Rain]

The Cards have some of the lowest paid assistants in the NFL. Are you guys really that surprised we retained them? This is typical Cards trying to avoid having to put more money into the coaching spots. By making the next coach use this assistance the cards can maintain whatever budget they set for themselves.

When they hire a new coach, the new coach can't make the assitance salaries part of the discussion. I am sure, most head coache candidates want to know what kind of budget they have for assistants. With that out of the way, now it's just about the hc salary.

So basically we can look forward to the following:

Probaby cast off coach or "up and coming assitant". Again, some of the lowest paid assitance in the NFL. Oh and basically the same stellar front office headed by Rod Graves who shouldn't be the GM of a pop warner team.

I'M EXCITED!!!!!!!

 

[Evil Ash]

The Cards have some of the lowest paid assistants in the NFL. Are you guys really that surprised we retained them? This is typical Cards trying to avoid having to put more money into the coaching spots. By making the next coach use this assistance the cards can maintain whatever budget they set for themselves.

When they hire a new coach, the new coach can't make the assitance salaries part of the discussion. I am sure, most head coache candidates want to know what kind of budget they have for assistants. With that out of the way, now it's just about the hc salary.

So basically we can look forward to the following:

Probaby cast off coach or "up and coming assitant". Again, some of the lowest paid assitance in the NFL. Oh and basically the same stellar front office headed by Rod Graves who shouldn't be the GM of a pop warner team.

I'M EXCITED!!!!!!!

Dude we're keeping some of them to evaluate how well they've done and if they fit the new HC's scheme. There have been 2 coaching staffs fired and not a great deal of assistants available to replace them unless they wanted to a) wait for permission from another team or b) go to the college level.

If we let some of our staff go, they would've been gone before our new HC was replacing them. For example Loney going to the Rams, Bush going to the Texans. We're then stuck hoping that we can find even decent assistants to replace them

This just seems to be overreaction

 

[Red Hawk]

You seemed to support that assessment by saying you were fine with all these assistants they retained...pending someone better.

So reading between the lines it is.

 

[ajcardfan]

So reading between the lines it is.

Ok. Guilty as charged!

 

[kerouac9]

I'm aware of that. But they where also #4 in third down completion percentage with 34.2%.

Because in '05 teams could rush on third down and gain 7 yards.

 

[BigRedRage]

I think you are all missing the point, he said he was keeping them here until the new HC arrives and will go from there, we have many good position coaches.

 

[BigRedRage]

from azcardinals.com

The Cards did retain offensive line coach Steve Loney, wide receivers coach Mike Wilson, defensive line coach Larry Brooks, assistant head coach/linebackers Frank Bush, defensive quality control coach Rick Courtright, offensive coordinator/quarterbacks coach Mike Kruzcek and defensive coordinator Clancy Pendergast from their current staff.

“We felt like these guys would certainly fit in with our future but those coaches are going to be evaluated, along with my input, by the new head coach and then we’ll see ultimately where their status will fall.”

 

[john h]

Link or anyone else hear this?

Would be incredibly stupid.

I read it and i think Bidwill and Graves said as much in the interview. Pendegrast and others were mentioned by name as being retained.

 

[Stout]

'Along with my input'. Ugh. What a bittersweet day this has been.

Okay, I'll put out two situations and what they will add up to. We're keeping some assistants on the books for now. IF:

The HC candidates are told without a doubt they have final say on any assistant coach carryovers, then no worries, we're overreacting.

The HC candidates in any way feel they may not have 100 percent autonomy in selecting assistants, then we have regressed so badly it will be beyond the ken of words to describe.

 

[Big T]

Indeed I do find a lot of the over reaction here, simply amazing.

From my personal point of view all those mentioned do indeed seem worthy of being possibly retained by the new HC.
The first thing that pops out at me that everyone seems to have glossed over is that its not easy to assemble a new staff of assistants, especially if that new HC has presently been an assistant on some other team. They can't just take other coaches with them.
Also, these present assistants now "know" the players and what's been going on with them. Thus the more of them that are retained the less "rebuilding" that some have been whinning about as a downside of getting rid of Green.
I think the Cards are doing EXACTLY the right thing. Keep a core of assistants, if they are competant, which I think most of these guys are.
As to the strength and conditioning coach, Steve Wetzel, I would assume he's history, as Green brought him in as one of his old cronies from Minnesota, firing long-time Card stength and cond. coach Bob Rugucki, (something like 15 years), and I remember some of the early talk when that was done in regard to some of his training theories were quite a bit different "norm". So I would kind of assume he will be replaced too.
Again, think about it....say Ken Whisenhut, for example is hired as the new HC. Where is he going to get the bodies to man his new staff? It won't be easy and he might as well include looking at some of the decent ones already here.
My prediction is simpy with Green, Solomon, and Hargraves, gone, that alone is addition by subtraction and on defense, especially Clancy may "look" better and especially our secondary and CB's may now actually get some quality coaching.
This all looks good to me.
Ding Dong and Woo Hoo, the wicked witch is dead !!!
Today is the first day of the rest of our lives !!!
We got now where to go but up !!!
The first step of a great new journey has started !!!
Don't Worry...be Happy !!!
;>)

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Indeed I do find a lot of the over reaction here, simply amazing.

From my personal point of view all those mentioned do indeed seem worthy of being possibly retained by the new HC.
The first thing that pops out at me that everyone seems to have glossed over is that its not easy to assemble a new staff of assistants, especially if that new HC has presently been an assistant on some other team. They can't just take other coaches with them.
Also, these present assistants now "know" the players and what's been going on with them. Thus the more of them that are retained the less "rebuilding" that some have been whinning about as a downside of getting rid of Green.
I think the Cards are doing EXACTLY the right thing. Keep a core of assistants, if they are competant, which I think most of these guys are.
As to the strength and conditioning coach, Steve Wetzel, I would assume he's history, as Green brought him in as one of his old cronies from Minnesota, firing long-time Card stength and cond. coach Bob Rugucki, (something like 15 years), and I remember some of the early talk when that was done in regard to some of his training theories were quite a bit different "norm". So I would kind of assume he will be replaced too.
Again, think about it....say Ken Whisenhut, for example is hired as the new HC. Where is he going to get the bodies to man his new staff? It won't be easy and he might as well include looking at some of the decent ones already here.
My prediction is simpy with Green, Solomon, and Hargraves, gone, that alone is addition by subtraction and on defense, especially Clancy may "look" better and especially our secondary and CB's may now actually get some quality coaching.
This all looks good to me.
Ding Dong and Woo Hoo, the wicked witch is dead !!!
Today is the first day of the rest of our lives !!!
We got now where to go but up !!!
The first step of a great new journey has started !!!
Don't Worry...be Happy !!!
;>)

This arguement makes zero sense. New coaches assemble their own staff whether it is High School, college, or the NFL. There is no problem assembling a staff for other HC's, why is it such a problem for the Cards?

This whole hiring fiasco, not allowing the new HC to pick his assistants (if that is true), and the extensions of Graves, is a joke and why the Cards will always be the Cards. Pathetic

 

[Totally_Red]

Take a chill pill!

This organization finally does something halfway intelligent and they get ripped on this board.

This is a GOOD thing. Hang on to assistants who may actually have a future. How soon do we forget? During the broadcast Sunday, the Fox announcers said the San Diego coaches were amazed at the production Pendergast was getting out of his players. This from one of the best staffs in the NFL IMO. Why would they say if they didn't believe it?

Do we forget that the Rams and Scott Linehan wanted to hire Steve Loney out from under us last winter? Since Linehan worked with him in Minnesota, and since Loney had at least one other offer when the Cardinals hired him, and since the O-line finally started coming together late in the season, why fire the guy? Is there somebody better out there? The second after Loney was cut loose, he'd show up in St.Louis, thus strengthening an opponent, and IMO, weakening the Cardinals.

And we also know Frank Bush was in demand last offseason, and the Cardinals had to upgrade him to assistant head coach to retain him.

To repeat, it is a GOOD thing to give the new guy a chance to retain these coaches if desired, instead of starting from scratch.

 

[BACH]

I really don't understand what the big deal is!!!

We have several position coaches that rank among the best in the league.
Kruczek (QB), Bush (LB), Loney (OL), Wilson (WR) and Brooks (DL).

Why get rid of them before you know who's out there to replace them?

Don't you think Rivera will be pleased about having most of the offensive staff in place, if he takes over.

 

[Duckjake]

During the broadcast Sunday, the Fox announcers said the San Diego coaches were amazed at the production Pendergast was getting out of his players. This from one of the best staffs in the NFL IMO. Why would they say if they didn't believe it?

Good Old boy network?

If you look at that statement by the SD coaches it tells you that they think the talent on the Cardinals defense is really weak.

 

[Stout]

To repeat, it is a GOOD thing to give the new guy a chance to retain these coaches if desired, instead of starting from scratch.

Is this what they're doing? Doesn't sound like it. It sounds like Graves may try to saddle a new HC with some assistants he may not want. It sticks in my craw that Graves said he'd have input whether or not these coaches stick. If he wants to make a suggestion, then fine. If he in any way tries to tell a quality HC candidate what to do regarding assistants, we'll end up with a 2nd-tier HC.

 

[Totally_Red]

Good Old boy network?

If you look at that statement by the SD coaches it tells you that they think the talent on the Cardinals defense is really weak.

The talent on the Cardinals defense is relatively weak IMO. The team has largely concentrated on the offense. There is a pro-bowl safety in Adrian Wilson, an above-average, but undersized DE in Chike Okeafor, a good OLB in Karlos Dansby, and that's about it. Everybody else is average, adequate or unproven at best

 

[Totally_Red]

Is this what they're doing? Doesn't sound like it. It sounds like Graves may try to saddle a new HC with some assistants he may not want. It sticks in my craw that Graves said he'd have input whether or not these coaches stick. If he wants to make a suggestion, then fine. If he in any way tries to tell a quality HC candidate what to do regarding assistants, we'll end up with a 2nd-tier HC.

My response is that if the new guy can't recognize that some of the current assistants are superior to what's out there, and insists on bringing in inferior coaches who he's familiar with, I'm uncomfortable with that.

No matter what, it appears the Cardinals are going with a first-timer who may or may not have his assistants already picked out. No Graves shouldn't have veto power of his assistant coach selection, but I could see where the new guy would welcome the organization's input on the current staff.

 

[Duckjake]

The talent on the Cardinals defense is relatively weak IMO. The team has largely concentrated on the offense. There is a pro-bowl safety in Adrian Wilson, an above-average, but undersized DE in Chike Okeafor, a good OLB in Karlos Dansby, and that's about it. Everybody else is average, adequate or unproven at best

That's exactly my impression of the defense. I was just too lazy to type what you have. After those three the top players are unproven guys like Green, Watson and Franscisco. Age appears to have caught up with Berry, Dockett is wildly inconsistent, Beisel has shown my boy Hayes to be just average and Clancy has shown nothing special. We don't even need to discuss the CB's or Huff.

Yet there are people who think we need to spend our first round draft pick on an Offensive Tackle.

 

[JeffGollin]

Do we necessarily want to hire a new HC who will bring in entirely new offensive and defensive systems?

Do we really want to blow up our defensive and offensive schemes thereby setting back the development of the franchise another 2 years or so? For example, do you really think Cardinal management will bring in a HC who'd want to install a Vince Young/Mike Vick spread/shotgun running offense when our top 2 QB's (Leinart and Warner) are pretty much pocket guys?

I like our offensive scheme and I like our defensive scheme. I generally like our talent. (What's causing us to lose has more to do with poor execution and lack of concentration/discipline - those are the things that need to be changed by a new coaching regime; not the the systems we have in place).

I suspect ownership will hire a HC who's comfortable with our current schemes and he, in turn, will retain enough assistants to insure some degree of continuity.

 

[Sandan]

They are retaining the majority of their assistant coaches. To not give a new head coach the opportunity to pick his own staff is really hampering him from the get go. This is a horrible decision !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This decision as well as giving Graves a 3 year extension is going to be cause for this organization to be chastised by the media!!!!!!!! They really have no clue how to get things done !

I don't know where you heard that. What I hear/read is that the plan is to not cut ACs we like as they will then not be available for the new HC to evaluate. What I'm hearing is that the choice to retain them in the long run will be with the new HC. Why is that a horrible decision ?

 

[D-Dogg]

My response is that if the new guy can't recognize that some of the current assistants are superior to what's out there, and insists on bringing in inferior coaches who he's familiar with, I'm uncomfortable with that.

No matter what, it appears the Cardinals are going with a first-timer who may or may not have his assistants already picked out. No Graves shouldn't have veto power of his assistant coach selection, but I could see where the new guy would welcome the organization's input on the current staff.

I agree. We don't need a coach bringing in a Richard Solomon-type of coach, say for the OL, when we have Loney there.

However, you have to see the apprehension from Stout of Graves going overboard with the power wanting to retain someone when the coach has a better replacement.

Its a fine line, and retaining the coaches was a good idea. HOW and WHEN Graves' advice is implemented, and what weight it is given are crucial details.

 

[40yearfan]

I don't know where you heard that. What I hear/read is that the plan is to not cut ACs we like as they will then not be available for the new HC to evaluate. What I'm hearing is that the choice to retain them in the long run will be with the new HC. Why is that a horrible decision ?

Because it's the only thing we have left to bitch about. Some people decided we would keep Green to save money and when that didn't happen, they needed something else to complain about. They've already beat Graves to death and this is just the scape goat needed to continue the lament.

I'm glad I have something other than this football team in my life. Hope springs eternal in the human breast unless you're a Cards football fan. Then it's "abandon all hope all ye who enter here".

C'mon folks. Lighten up. It's a brand new year and the Cards haven't lost a game yet.

 

[Stout]

My response is that if the new guy can't recognize that some of the current assistants are superior to what's out there, and insists on bringing in inferior coaches who he's familiar with, I'm uncomfortable with that.

No matter what, it appears the Cardinals are going with a first-timer who may or may not have his assistants already picked out. No Graves shouldn't have veto power of his assistant coach selection, but I could see where the new guy would welcome the organization's input on the current staff.

If we're afraid of that with a particular candidate, then you obviously do not hire them. Trust them or don't trust them. Don't handicap them.

 

[conraddobler]

Because it's the only thing we have left to bitch about. Some people decided we would keep Green to save money and when that didn't happen, they needed something else to complain about. They've already beat Graves to death and this is just the scape goat needed to continue the lament.

I'm glad I have something other than this football team in my life. Hope springs eternal in the human breast unless you're a Cards football fan. Then it's "abandon all hope all ye who enter here".

C'mon folks. Lighten up. It's a brand new year and the Cards haven't lost a game yet.

40 I'm an optimistic person by nature I really am but when it comes to this team that's been beaten out of me, geez I wonder how that happend?

Graves is what he is, IMO he a good guy to have negotiating your contracts, he's good at that but that's it.

He may have learned a lot from DG on how to run a draft board, we can only hope he did but as far as a franchise GM, he's less than impressive.

I seriously hope since he's here he'll begin exercising his power and not let people run over him but as I say that I only pray when he does he makes the right move.

What I think he is IMO is a yes man to the Bidwill's, when they say we really don't need to spend $ here or there I think he says you know I think we can make that work, again it's my opinion I'm not there but it sure looks like that's why they are comfortable with him.

I don't think the cheap label is accurate on this team anymore but I do think that the Bidwill's want too much say in the process to the detriment of the team, what I am really saying is that they make their wishes known, their opinions known and that things tend to head in that direction at times they probably shouldn't. I don't think it's just about money it's about competent direction.

What we all want is someone who's smart enough to know what the right thing to do is and powerful enough to get it done, I hope Graves is that guy, I doubt it but I hope he is.