On the Vujanic Puzzle

[George O'Brien]

Not much has been written in the press lately about Milos Vujanic. As far as I can tell he remains the same confusing player that we discussed last summer. He's a point guard who scores but doesn't have a lot of assists.

Euroleague offers some recent stats that follow what he did at the Euroleague level a year ago:

2004-05 16.5 ppg 60.8% shooting 33.5% for three 3.0 rpg and 2.4 apg
2003-04 16.3 ppg 53.8% shooting 35.8% for three 1.7 rpg and 1.8 apg

Bologna was knocked out of the Euroleague playoffs after reaching the top 16.

It is hard to know what to think of these stats. When compared to SARUNAS JASIKEVICIUS of Maccabi Tel Aviv (who was on the Lithuanian national team), Sarunas had more assists over the Euroleague season.

2004-05 15.5 ppg 48.3% shooting 37.9% for three 2.6 rpg and 5.2 apg

Does it mean anything? Maccabi is a much better team than Milo's team, so the stats may not mean much. It would be nice if there was some kind of first hand scouting report.

 

[scotsman13]

i have read somewhere that assist in the europe are not counted the same way as assist in the u.s. are. dont read to much into that. also his coach has him playing a lot of shooting guard. personally i think milo will be with the suns next year and will show a good passing touch. it is said that his is best in the pick and roll game a lot like nash is.

 

[asudevil83]

i have read somewhere that assist in the europe are not counted the same way as assist in the u.s. are. dont read to much into that. also his coach has him playing a lot of shooting guard. personally i think milo will be with the suns next year and will show a good passing touch. it is said that his is best in the pick and roll game a lot like nash is.

i've read the same thing. i think assists only count if the pass leads to either a dunk or layup. so any pass that leads to a jumpshot doesnt count.

if milos is ready to make the jump to the NBA, but will only come over if he starts, then the suns should trade him away to a team in need of a PG....and their are many out there. if we could get a late first rounder out of it, then that's even better.

 

[elindholm]

i have read somewhere that assist in the europe are not counted the same way as assist in the u.s. are.

You've probably read that here, since it's been posted about 75 times.

Even so, if one player is getting more than five assists per game in Europe and another one is getting about two, that's probably significant.

 

[George O'Brien]

That bothers me too, but this is all speculation since each team has its own system and personnel.

As for Vujanic insisting on starting, I'm not sure where this coming from. Yes, he signed with Bologna rather than taking a minimum contract with the Knicks a few years, but money was a big part of that decision. At this point, if Milos doesn't make the jump this summer, he won't come to the NBA ever so the rights would not be worth much.

As situations go, I'd think the Suns would be an attractive place to come. This is not the slow down, grind it out Knicks. Also, it is clear the Suns would like to limit Nash's minutes so 18 to 20 minutes a game is not out of the question. Further, it is pretty clear that Barbosa is more of an SG than PG, so there wouldn't be the problem of fighting for the backup PG slot.

In any case, I think the one thing that gets missed in the discussion of Vujanic's stats is his shooting percentage, of 60%. From what I can tell, he does it primarily shooting pull up mid range jumpers which would fit very nicely in the Suns offense.

 

[hcsilla]

Does it mean anything? Maccabi is a much better team than Milo's team, so the stats may not mean much.

I'm not sure that Maccabi is much better than Vujanic's team. I think that Climamio is at least a top8 team in Europe and he is their best player next to italian sharpshooter Gianluca Basile.
Unfortunately for them they were in the hardest group of the sweet 16 and barely failed to qualify.

Climamio is full of very quality players. They have two italian national players (Basile, Pozzecco), two slovenian national players (Smodis, Lorbek who will probably enter this year's draft), former Bulls' center Dalibor Bagaric, former NCAA star Ruben Douglas and two future NBA prospects (Mancinelli and Belinelli).

 

[George O'Brien]

I'm not sure that Maccabi is much better than Vujanic's team. I think that Climamio is at least a top8 team in Europe and he is their best player next to italian sharpshooter Gianluca Basile.
Unfortunately for them they were in the hardest group of the sweet 16 and barely failed to qualify.

Climamio is full of very quality players. They have two italian national players (Basile, Pozzecco), two slovenian national players (Smodis, Lorbek who will probably enter this year's draft), former Bulls' center Dalibor Bagaric, former NCAA star Ruben Douglas and two future NBA prospects (Mancinelli and Belinelli).

Unless I misread the Euroleague web site, Climanio failed to advance after getting blown out by Panathinaikos in the final section game. Apparently they have a point differential tie breaker so they did not get to the final eight.
Euroleague Results

 

[hcsilla]

Apparently they have a point differential tie breaker so they did not get to the final eight.

They didn't, I haven't debated that.

I said that Climamio is still at least a top8 team, IMO despite the fact they didn't get into final 8. Their group was probably the strongest one.

 

[George O'Brien]

They didn't, I haven't debated that.

I said that Climamio is still at least a top8 team, IMO despite the fact they didn't get into final 8. Their group was probably the strongest one.

I guess I misunderstood your point. In any case, the only times I've seen Vujanic has been when he played on the Serbian team, which has great shooters but is not really a running team nor did it rely on Vujanic to score. My guess is that he will fit into D'Antoni's running style fine, but that is only a guess.

 

[F-Dog]

That bothers me too, but this is all speculation since each team has its own system and personnel.

As for Vujanic insisting on starting, I'm not sure where this coming from. Yes, he signed with Bologna rather than taking a minimum contract with the Knicks a few years, but money was a big part of that decision. At this point, if Milos doesn't make the jump this summer, he won't come to the NBA ever so the rights would not be worth much.

As situations go, I'd think the Suns would be an attractive place to come. This is not the slow down, grind it out Knicks. Also, it is clear the Suns would like to limit Nash's minutes so 18 to 20 minutes a game is not out of the question. Further, it is pretty clear that Barbosa is more of an SG than PG, so there wouldn't be the problem of fighting for the backup PG slot.

In any case, I think the one thing that gets missed in the discussion of Vujanic's stats is his shooting percentage, of 60%. From what I can tell, he does it primarily shooting pull up mid range jumpers which would fit very nicely in the Suns offense.

Not a bad post. I think I disagree with every point, but it's well-presented.

--I don't see why Vujanic would stay in Europe forever, just because he doesn't come over next year. Money and PT seem to be the key issues with him, so whenever the Suns are willing to provide those, he'll probably be willing to come over.

--Vujanic would definitely be competing with Barbosa for minutes (and they might both be competing with the team's draft pick). If the Suns keep Joe J, the only minutes available for Barbosa at SG will be spot minutes, so if Barbosa wants to play regularly next year, it will have to be at PG. The same is true for Vujanic, of course.

--Three-pointers are absolutely key for this offense IMO--when I see Vujanic shooting under 35% from Euro 3pt range, it bugs the hell out of me.


I expect the Suns will leave Vujanic in Europe for at least another year, while they decide what they want to do with Barbosa. Either that, or they'll trade his rights for a second-round pick or something similarly modest...

 

[lancelet's cousin]

I'm glad you started this post George. I've been waiting for someone to start a post with, "Here's the full story on Vujanic..."

But I haven't seen that yet. What do we really know as fact about this guy? It looks as though this is all last year's info, at least as far as what it would take to get him in a Suns uniform.

And I have never personally read that he insists on starting. I've only read other posts regarding that. I would be curious to see that as a quote attributed to him somewhere.

And does this guy even want to come across the pond to play here? If he has demands that must be met I don't know if he has that big of an urge to play in the NBA. Are we overrating his desire to "experience the NBA"? Many people would relocate if the price is right. Does D'Antoni have any pull with the guy? Or are there any quotes from the Sun's managment or coaching staff concerning him?

If all of this information hasn't changed since last year, might that indicate that the Sun's front office is letting the story die a quiet death?

The funny thing is that this year we are so good that no one posts trade proposals like they do on, say, the Cleveland forums. So maybe we just aren't up-to-date with seeking out and compiling the information.

I'd like for him to come over. 60% shooting is an impresive stat. And 35% isn't terrible when we shoot from the corners so much. That has got to be around the same distance as the Euroleague's 3's doesn't it?

The next time one of you folks in Phoenix see a Suns player make sure you hit him up with questions!