OT: New Ray Rice video released

[Bert]

I am sorry if I dont buy the 200+lb professional athlete's story, you know the athlete who is in absolute peak physical condition who makes his living in a violent sport, his story that because she "lunged" at him he somehow felt his life was threatened and he felt compelled to do what he did to her.

You keep trying to turn this into some kind of broad spectrum debate that somehow excuses this behavior. What do homosexual couples have to do with this isolated incident?

Are there cases of DV where maybe the whole story is not being told and maybe the woman or the homosexual partner who got beat is just as responsible? Sure, absolutely, anything is possible, but that's CLEARLY not what happened here, so if you "aren't defending Ray Rice" then why do you continue to beat that drum? At what point in that video do you feel his life was endangered or that this response was justified? IF she's drunk and hitting him, he should run away and get help. That's what I would tell a woman to do as well. It's not like I'm preaching to women, if you're getting beat, kill him! No, you should seek help. If she was hitting him there were a million other decisions that could have been made other than "I'm gonna hit her twice, till she quits moving, then I'm gonna drag her out of this elevator, drop her on her face, move her around with my feet a little like she's garbage and then eventually we'll make up cuz that's how we roll. Nope, not buying it.

And for the record my post was directed to the guy who is a big fan of domestic violence who in every one of these threads posts; "What happens in another mans house is none of my business." Which is the dumbest, most ignorant, sexist, etc. etc. etc. argument ever...

 

[SO91]

Apparently he is wrong;

A short time later, NFL commissioner Roger Goodell announced through a league spokesman he has indefinitely suspended Rice based on the new video evidence, which figured to scare off any team that might have contemplated signing him anyway.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/ravens/2014/09/08/baltimore-ravens-cut-ray-rice/15291729/

Maybe Shefter is wrong, or maybe The Commish doesn't give a damn and does what he wants. I would not be the least bit surprised if that happened. I can't stand that prick btw.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I don't think anyone was condoning or minimizing Ray's behavior, at anytime, on this board. I believe both Ray and his (now) Wife BOTH played a role in this situation. It seems pretty clear to me she either takes a slap at him or sticks a finger in his face before they get in the elevator. Once in the elevator, he gets in her face and slaps or pushes her. He stands on the opposite side of the elevator and she lunges at him (aggressively); he then delivers a blow which puts her out.

I do not condone the behavior of Ray Rice, but I don't find the Mrs behavior to be excused, coincidental, or unremarkable either. Did Ray take things too far? Absolutely. Conventional wisdom tells you that if he has been sufficient enough to pick-up the blitz from a ILB/OLB/DE in the NFL, he surely could have diffused/avoided/defended himself from a 120-150# female with much less effort than a left hook to the face.

But to minimize (or disregard/ignore) the role the Mrs played in this event is making excuses for her behavior; it's sexist. Had this been 2 men (not in a homosexual relationship), people would think nothing of it (most of you are going to the game this evening; take a look around and you will see what I am saying). If it were two women, people would laugh. If it was a woman completely unrelated to the man, and she was getting physically aggressive with him, the punch may raise some eyebrows, but I certainly believe people would say, "that crazy chic was trying to fight him!"

DV involves much more than one person controlling/dominating/abusing the other. It's the result of a dysfunction of 2 people. It takes "2-to-tango," but why is DV not looked at in similar regard? My wife is the sweetest lady you would ever meet, do anything for you, but she has her buttons. I know when to leave her alone or get off my butt/change my plans to help her with whatever self-imposed catastrophe she signed herself up for. Since I know how to keep her happy (at least most of the time I hope), I surely know what could set her off, trigger her, or cause her to explode on me. She possesses similar intel on me.

I'm a white guy in my late 30's. If I walked into a black neighborhood and started using racial slurs (not threatening anyone, just talking ish) and became very bold, intentional, and conspicuous in my intent (i.e.- walking up to a group of black men and calling them "this" or "that"), would anyone be surprised when I got my A beat? Stabbed? Shot? If I did get "victimized" during the course of my above actions, the (presumably black) person who did it would most likely get charged. However, mitigating factors would, and should, come into play. It should be notorious that Speedy went into a predominantly black neighborhood, using racial slurs, wearing a white shirt, red suspenders and laces, LOOKING to start a confrontation. And found it. Most certainly, if I had not choose to walk into this neighborhood, confront a black male, and start picking a fight using racial and demeaning language, I wouldn't be beat up/shot/stabbed/dead, and the black male seated on the left side of the courtroom in the defendants chair wouldn't have been charged. Bottom line: I would be ultimately responsible for the series of events.

In no way am I defending Ray Rice. His actions were wrong. However, the Mrs has some culpability here. I feel as though this point is clearly being lost.

The way you think is disgusting to me.

 

[Finito]

Everyone will agree this guy is a POS but what boggles my mind is the fact that his fiance married him afterward and is now claiming it was her fault he knocked her ass out. She must really love the lifestyle$$$.

I have a hard time holding it against him when the girl his then fiance and now his wife has forgiven him so who am I to hold it against him. Now would I have done that no. Doesn't work for me but it might for him so who knows but bottom line she OK with it.

Let's be realistic anyone here not gonna go to a cardinal game if Washington got reinstated tomorrow? Or if he made the game saving tackle in the super bowl? Exactly

 

[crisper57]

By saying that, aren't you saying her decision-making ability is on par with ours? I have a hard time believing that. At best, she is blinded by money. At worst, she fears leaving her abuser. We have the luxury of making our own judgments free of these outside influences.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Azlen]

I have a hard time holding it against him when the girl his then fiance and now his wife has forgiven him so who am I to hold it against him. Now would I have done that no. Doesn't work for me but it might for him so who knows but bottom line she OK with it.

Let's be realistic anyone here not gonna go to a cardinal game if Washington got reinstated tomorrow? Or if he made the game saving tackle in the super bowl? Exactly

There are sadly plenty of abuse victims who go back to their abusers. That doesn't give the abusers one bit of justification.

 

[don7031]

"I woke up this morning feeling like I had a horrible nightmare, feeling like I'm mourning the death of the my closest friend. But to have to accept the fact that it's reality is a nightmare in itself. No one knows the pain that the media & unwanted options from the public have caused my family. To make us relive a moment in our lives that we regret everyday is horrible thing. To take something away from the man I love that he has worked his ass off for all his life just to gain ratings is a horrific. THIS IS OUR LIFE! What don't you all get. If your intentions were to hurt us, embarrass us, make us feel alone, take all happiness away, you've succeeded on so many levels. Just know we will continue to grow & show the world what real love is! Ravensnation we love you!" - Janay Rice

http://7online.com/sports/ap-longer-ray-rice-assault-video-features-obscenities-spitting/300621/

Apparently the police have a longer better quality video with sound of the fight between Janay and her then fiance Ray.

The hypocrites and the ignorant have drowned out the voice of the reason. We have a few seconds of the Rice's at their worst and people are filling in the blanks with whatever suits them.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

How many video cameras were in that elevator?

 

[Cardiac]

I haven't read any of the posts in this thread because I'm pretty sure I've heard it all before. What Rice did was horrible and without defense.

What confuses me is why all of a sudden people have gotten so enraged with the release of this last video. What did everyone think happened in that elevator when the 1st video was released of Rice dragging her out of the elevator???

I'm hearing on the radio that the video of Rice hitting his now wife has been released and it's SHOCKING. Well it wasn't to me because I figured he punched her and knocked her out. What would have shocked me was if he had hit her several times or grabbed her by the hair and slammed her head into a wall or.......

Point is that the video revealed what I always thought happened and why I thought Rice should have been suspended for a year or banned altogether. I guess people need a visual to truly get an understanding of what happened???

Is this really the first time the NFL or Ravens saw this video? Even if so, once again how did we think she became unconscious????

 

[Southpaw]

My take;

Our society, and many others, has a penchant for violence and acceptance of violence against women by men and institutions. It is basically ignored. Now this event has become the cause celebre and poster child for public outrage. Since the inquiring public pays so much attention to celebrities, including athletes, this event is the focal point for all discussion. It ain't personal Ray and Janay. It is long overdue that the public gives the societal problem the attention it deserves. There won't be any "pink outs" for this one, but hopefully the attention will be ramped up.

 

[Rivercard]

I guess people need a visual to truly get an understanding of what happened???

The video made the crime real. It made it personal in a way, like we were there. Video image of violence gets ingrained in the mind in a way it can't without visual evidence. Like when we hear about genocide happening we know it's ugly, but when we actually see video of lifeless bodies stacked in a ditch it becomes more revolting.

 

[82CardsGrad]

The video made the crime real. It made it personal in a way, like we were there. Video image of violence gets ingrained in the mind in a way it can't without visual evidence. Like when we hear about genocide happening we know it's ugly, but when we actually see video of lifeless bodies stacked in a ditch it becomes more revolting.

True... Though, I'm not buying the spin from Goodell and the Ravens. They initially saw this video and still issued their pathetic suspension. Now, the video is made public and the outcry pours in and oooops... we really need to release him from the team and suspend him indefinitely.

What a joke...

 

[AzStevenCal]

True... Though, I'm not buying the spin from Goodell and the Ravens. They initially saw this video and still issued their pathetic suspension. Now, the video is made public and the outcry pours in and oooops... we really need to release him from the team and suspend him indefinitely.

What a joke...

That's not spin, you're flat out calling them liars. The NFL said that no one involved saw that video prior to yesterday. But maybe you're right. Maybe they are all liars. If so, I'm sure that information will leak out.

Steve

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

That's not spin, you're flat out calling them liars. The NFL said that no one involved saw that video prior to yesterday. But maybe you're right. Maybe they are all liars. If so, I'm sure that information will leak out.

Steve

I feel like Harbaugh was lying through his teeth when he said "It was something we saw for the first time today, all of us."

Not saying I know for fact he is lying.. But just the way he said it... sounded rehearsed.
I also think he just barely caught himself before he said "I have nothing but respect for Ray".. he paused for a sec.. thought it through, and said "I have nothing but ...hope and goodwill for Ray and Janay"

Maybe it's just me... But then again I think both Harbaugh's are full of crap and deceit.

 

[82CardsGrad]

That's not spin, you're flat out calling them liars. The NFL said that no one involved saw that video prior to yesterday. But maybe you're right. Maybe they are all liars. If so, I'm sure that information will leak out.

Steve

Uh... yea. I'm calling them liars. ESPN had a guy on last night who used to head security for a NFL team (I was half out of it after getting back from the game...), and he thought it was laughable that both the Ravens and the NFL claim to not have seen the video.
But, lets just say I'm wrong and they aren't fibbing, they still KNEW that Rice had knocked out his lady. The video only showed what we already knew. So now, just because the rest of the country is p.o.'d about it, they collectively take additional action? I mean, did Rice knock her out again for a second time??

What a joke...

 

[FArting]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...ends-ray-rice-criticizes-media-instagram-post

She is defending him, slams media

 

[SO91]

I haven't read any of the posts in this thread because I'm pretty sure I've heard it all before. What Rice did was horrible and without defense.

What confuses me is why all of a sudden people have gotten so enraged with the release of this last video. What did everyone think happened in that elevator when the 1st video was released of Rice dragging her out of the elevator???

I'm hearing on the radio that the video of Rice hitting his now wife has been released and it's SHOCKING. Well it wasn't to me because I figured he punched her and knocked her out. What would have shocked me was if he had hit her several times or grabbed her by the hair and slammed her head into a wall or.......

Point is that the video revealed what I always thought happened and why I thought Rice should have been suspended for a year or banned altogether. I guess people need a visual to truly get an understanding of what happened???

Is this really the first time the NFL or Ravens saw this video? Even if so, once again how did we think she became unconscious????

I'm not sure if you mean people on this board, or people in general, but there was outrage when it was first reported in February, and outrage again with 2 game suspension. Outrage over the latest video is simply an extension of the previous reaction, IMO. As for the video is concerned, there is a huge difference in hearing about something, and actually seeing it play out. A more extreme example would be reading about a beheading, and actually seeing, and hearing a person get beheaded. You know it's terrible, and you know the outcome, but the video produces a vastly different reaction.

 

[SO91]

Uh... yea. I'm calling them liars. ESPN had a guy on last night who used to head security for a NFL team (I was half out of it after getting back from the game...), and he thought it was laughable that both the Ravens and the NFL claim to not have seen the video.
But, lets just say I'm wrong and they aren't fibbing, they still KNEW that Rice had knocked out his lady. The video only showed what we already knew. So now, just because the rest of the country is p.o.'d about it, they collectively take additional action? I mean, did Rice knock her out again for a second time??

What a joke...

This. The NFL is the wealthiest and most powerful league in the US, and I'm to believe they couldn't get the video, but somehow TMZ could? Please.

 

[82CardsGrad]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...ends-ray-rice-criticizes-media-instagram-post

She is defending him, slams media

Good for her and heck, for all we know Ray has done the necessary things to deal with the issue in terms of counseling and so on...
It's completely inexcusable and it will haunt him forever. But that doesn't mean it's unforgiveable.
FWIW, I think the punishment being levied now is what should've happened initially... But, I can't help but feel the awkward twinge of irony when I contrast this to other NFL players who have done much worse, including killing people while driving drunk, and have been allowed to play...

 

[Cardiac]

My take;

Our society, and many others, has a penchant for violence and acceptance of violence against women by men and institutions. It is basically ignored. Now this event has become the cause celebre and poster child for public outrage. Since the inquiring public pays so much attention to celebrities, including athletes, this event is the focal point for all discussion. It ain't personal Ray and Janay. It is long overdue that the public gives the societal problem the attention it deserves. There won't be any "pink outs" for this one, but hopefully the attention will be ramped up.

This I fully agree with.

The video made the crime real. It made it personal in a way, like we were there. Video image of violence gets ingrained in the mind in a way it can't without visual evidence. Like when we hear about genocide happening we know it's ugly, but when we actually see video of lifeless bodies stacked in a ditch it becomes more revolting.

No doubt a picture is worth a thousand words and involving the visual does impact the mind more. I just find it kinda crazy that his teammates stand behind ( literally ) him during his meeting with the press at the start of training camp and now are distancing themselves from him.

I remember bounty gate and many said WHF?, Robinson, would never work again in the NFL. He's the DC for the Rams now and nothing has been said about it.

Vick went to jail for his horrific crimes against animals and again many said he would never play in the NFL again.

Now this with Rice and many say he will never play in the NFL again. He has been showing his age and may not get another shot but it wouldn't surprise me if a team gives him a chance next year. Rice will have to do ALL the right things to show he is once again a true human being but if he does why shouldn't he get another shot?

 

[desertdawg]

The video made the crime real. It made it personal in a way, like we were there. Video image of violence gets ingrained in the mind in a way it can't without visual evidence. Like when we hear about genocide happening we know it's ugly, but when we actually see video of lifeless bodies stacked in a ditch it becomes more revolting.

But what did people honestly think happened? Were we under the assumption that he affectionately and delicately put her in a loving sleeper hold while whispering "Go to sleep now sweetheart?

I think they got married as a way to try and save his football career, and I now think the marriage is doomed so he might be splitting that bank account in half, with no other money coming in now and I really really hope so. If she signed a prenup than he must have hit her more often, talking brain damage. I was very upset with the 2 game suspension to begin with, and it has nothing to do with D-Wash or the sweet maryjane.

Further, I just found this juicy little tid bit on the guy, sitting there on youtube but it hasn't gone viral...yet. It shows this guy has actually trained in boxing, he uses it as part of his cross training. So the guy used that set of skills on a female (left hook to the temple is text book knock out), one he said he cares about and loves, honeybaby, some people just don't know what love is. That blow was full of hate and technical skill, but here's a link to the youtube joint.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcCtBY-w06M

 

[crisper57]

Cards just signed Chris Rainey, a guy with 2 DV incidents, to their practice squad. So disappointed.

 

[Dback Jon]

Cards just signed Chris Rainey, a guy with 2 DV incidents, to their practice squad. Do disappointed.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...eelers-cut-over-domestic-violence-allegation/


Ugh

 

[Brian]

I haven't read any of the posts in this thread because I'm pretty sure I've heard it all before. What Rice did was horrible and without defense.

What confuses me is why all of a sudden people have gotten so enraged with the release of this last video. What did everyone think happened in that elevator when the 1st video was released of Rice dragging her out of the elevator???

I'm hearing on the radio that the video of Rice hitting his now wife has been released and it's SHOCKING. Well it wasn't to me because I figured he punched her and knocked her out. What would have shocked me was if he had hit her several times or grabbed her by the hair and slammed her head into a wall or.......

Point is that the video revealed what I always thought happened and why I thought Rice should have been suspended for a year or banned altogether. I guess people need a visual to truly get an understanding of what happened???

Is this really the first time the NFL or Ravens saw this video? Even if so, once again how did we think she became unconscious????

Speaking for myself only, I don't think the bolded is fair or accurate. I wasn't "shocked". I knew he knocked her out. Seeing it didn't shock me. I think the outrage is that from the beginning she had come to his defense stating that she was the aggressor and was all over him and left him no choice. This video proves that "story" is completely false. He was the aggressor and from what I can see she did nothing other than verbally assault him. This blows up both of their accounts of that night.

Anyway, I sure will be glad when this is no longer "news" that the NFL network and ESPN is leading off with every hour. Like Farve's 20 retirements I'm sick of it already.

Football season is here and the Cards are 1-0.

 

[crisper57]

Who wants to organize a boycott? Anyone? Anyone?

Let's be better than Raven fans!!!

Anyone?

Bueller?