PFT on Kliff

[Solar7]

The standard excuse for Kliff. Funny how a guy like Matt Rhule could turn out winning teams at Temple who certainly isn't a hot spot for top recruits and then win with a Baylor team in a similar situation. It's just that, an excuse. It's pretty well known Kliff didn't like spending time recruiting (see attached link) so the excuse of not being able to get good talent is his own fault. The bottom line is Kliff doesn't like to spend time on the areas of responsibility as a HC are they require. This is why he failed in college and it's why he will fail in the NFL if he doesn't take on the full responsibilities of the HC position.

https://wreckemred.com/2019/07/14/t...ff-kingsbury-admits-he-didnt-like-recruiting/

It's even worse in that he had Patrick Mahomes, likely the best young NFL QB to come out in a long time, and couldn't handle it. Why does he get a pass on recruiting for his defenses while recruiting just fine on the offensive side of the ball?

Well, I know the answer. It's because he's our coach, and many can see no wrong.

His weakness as a recruiter in College is irrelevant to his role in NFL and no one on this board knows how well he handles his present responsiblities.

We know well enough to watch him blow calls and insist he's always going to have to be the offensive playcaller/QB coach.

https://www.azcardinals.com/news/potential-coaching-changes-and-kliff-kingsbury-on-playcalling

I hold no grudge against KK for taking the best job he could get, but he's not good at managing the whole organization. He may well prove to be a good OC someday. I get the feeling that Kyler doesn't even like him that much.

We'll see, I want to be wrong.

 

[BritCard]

His weakness as a recruiter in College is irrelevant to his role in NFL and no one on this board knows how well he handles his present responsiblities.

It lends itself to the idea that Kliff likes to focus on doing the jobs he likes and not the jobs he is responsible for.

For example, he likes to coach the QB and has spent too much time with Kyler in training and not enough time with the team as other HC's would do. He focuses too much on the offense only and neglects ST's and D. So on and so forth.

 

[BritCard]

I get the feeling that Kyler doesn't even like him that much.

We'll see, I want to be wrong.

I don't think it's that he doesn't like him. I think he doesn't rate him as a HC.

I think Kyler wants to win and he sees a HC that isn't very good.

 

[QuebecCard]

It's even worse in that he had Patrick Mahomes, likely the best young NFL QB to come out in a long time, and couldn't handle it. Why does he get a pass on recruiting for his defenses while recruiting just fine on the offensive side of the ball?

Well, I know the answer. It's because he's our coach, and many can see no wrong.


We know well enough to watch him blow calls and insist he's always going to have to be the offensive playcaller/QB coach.

https://www.azcardinals.com/news/potential-coaching-changes-and-kliff-kingsbury-on-playcalling

I hold no grudge against KK for taking the best job he could get, but he's not good at managing the whole organization. He may well prove to be a good OC someday. I get the feeling that Kyler doesn't even like him that much.

We'll see, I want to be wrong.

Your last paragraph is primo B-S.

You have no idea as to KK's management style, interaction with subordinates or KM's likes and dislikes.

And spare us the "want to be wrong" , it rings hollow.

 

[QuebecCard]

It lends itself to the idea that Kliff likes to focus on doing the jobs he likes and not the jobs he is responsible for.

For example, he likes to coach the QB and has spent too much time with Kyler in training and not enough time with the team as other HC's would do. He focuses too much on the offense only and neglects ST's and D. So on and so forth.

I don't know how much H-C 'a' verses H-C 'b' spends on 'O', 'D' or ST's. I imagine it varies based on personal expertise and the needs of the moment.

I know that good management involves varying degrees of delegation and trust.

KK was hired to mentor and prepare an exceptional QB/athlete with relatively few College starts for the rigours of the NFL.

Year three is the tell tale.

 

[cardpa]

His weakness as a recruiter in College is irrelevant to his role in NFL and no one on this board knows how well he handles his present responsiblities.

Yes, he doesn't have to recruit in the NFL, that's Keim's job, however his history of not taking more interest in recruiting in college when he had to know that was a necessity to strengthen his program in college does give us a clue as to how he operates. His disinterest in focusing more time on an area that directly affected the ability of his team certainly lends to his overall ability to manage a team and give due diligence to every area required of a head coach. Its who he is. Until KK proves otherwise, he gives me no reason to believe he will be any different in the NFL.

 

[BritCard]

I don't know how much H-C 'a' verses H-C 'b' spends on 'O', 'D' or ST's. I imagine it varies based on personal expertise and the needs of the moment.

I know that good management involves varying degrees of delegation and trust.

KK was hired to mentor and prepare an exceptional QB/athlete with relatively few College starts for the rigours of the NFL.

Year three is the tell tale.

My impression of Kliff from all I've read about his TTU days and seen reported from him time with the Cards is that he works as hard as anyone...at the things he loves to do or fall into areas he loves to spend his time.

Take the recruiting side as it's been discussed here. Reports say he never put the effort in to do it well, but I bet he worked his butt off to recruit QB's and WR's he loved. Not so much 300lb DT's.

I may well be wrong, but that's what I see in Kliff. A guy that absolutely loves playing with QB's, drawing up plays, basically all the fun stuff and works incredibly hard at those things. And completely neglects all the things he considers mundane, which is everything not offense related. And that includes things like adequate game plans, scripted plays, and various other crucial aspects required to win consistently.

Which for me is the complete opposite of the role a HC should play. He should be delegating the QB coaching, even play design or adding new plays during the season. It's the game plans, scripts, situational football and overall strategy he should be working on.

But indeed, this year is the tell tale.

 

[Krangodnzr]

His weakness as a recruiter in College is irrelevant to his role in NFL and no one on this board knows how well he handles his present responsiblities.

Yep. He consistently had one of the best offenses in college football at EVERY stop he made.

His recruiting classes sucked.

 

[QuebecCard]

My impression of Kliff from all I've read about his TTU days and seen reported from him time with the Cards is that he works as hard as anyone...at the things he loves to do or fall into areas he loves to spend his time.

Take the recruiting side as it's been discussed here. Reports say he never put the effort in to do it well, but I bet he worked his butt off to recruit QB's and WR's he loved. Not so much 300lb DT's.

I may well be wrong, but that's what I see in Kliff. A guy that absolutely loves playing with QB's, drawing up plays, basically all the fun stuff and works incredibly hard at those things. And completely neglects all the things he considers mundane, which is everything not offense related. And that includes things like adequate game plans, scripted plays, and various other crucial aspects required to win consistently.

Which for me is the complete opposite of the role a HC should play. He should be delegating the QB coaching, even play design or adding new plays during the season. It's the game plans, scripts, situational football and overall strategy he should be working on.

But indeed, this year is the tell tale.

Don't disagree with the overall tenor but the "bold" is a bit too definitive for me.

 

[PACardsFan]

The whining on this board will never cease to amaze me. The season is right around the corner. It's rather simple what lies ahead. If we continue to improve & make the playoffs, then KK & SK will be extended. And there will no doubt be gnashing of teeth from certain members on this board. If we fail to improve or go backwards, then KK & SK will be replaced & we'll be back to square one. Wash, rinse, repeat. The entire history of this franchise in a nutshell. This constant coaching carousel is a Bidwill issue. I know because I've been watching it for 57 years.

 

[Stout]

The whining on this board will never cease to amaze me. The season is right around the corner. It's rather simple what lies ahead. If we continue to improve & make the playoffs, then KK & SK will be extended. And there will no doubt be gnashing of teeth from certain members on this board. If we fail to improve or go backwards, then KK & SK will be replaced & we'll be back to square one. Wash, rinse, repeat. The entire history of this franchise in a nutshell. This constant coaching carousel is a Bidwill issue. I know because I've been watching it for 57 years.

'Cause we've done so great in recent years that gives us such optimism. I mean, who should complain about how last year went?

 

[Zeno]

The whining on this board will never cease to amaze me. The season is right around the corner. It's rather simple what lies ahead. If we continue to improve & make the playoffs, then KK & SK will be extended. And there will no doubt be gnashing of teeth from certain members on this board. If we fail to improve or go backwards, then KK & SK will be replaced & we'll be back to square one. Wash, rinse, repeat. The entire history of this franchise in a nutshell. This constant coaching carousel is a Bidwill issue. I know because I've been watching it for 57 years.

The coaching carousel is partly because they never seem to pick the right coach (aside from Arians), who was fired as a coach in Arizona that went on to being a success as a head coach elsewhere? History doesn't show the team made poor decisions firing coaches, they just made poor decisions hiring them.

 

[Ronin]

https://sports.yahoo.com/ross-kliff-kingsburys-offense-had-232004591.html

 

[Billy Bob]

If I were a hopeless optimist for my entire time as a Cards fan, I'd have burned out looooooooooooong since--and I've only been a fan since the move to the desert. There's positivity and then there's reality. Pessimism with this team is normal; optimism is usually putting blinders on and plugging your ears while singing "lalalalalala" against the soul-crushing reality that the cards usually suck ***.

How many winning seasons have we had since the move to the desert?

I've watched them too, I have not missed a game yet, be it Live, Radio or TV. I just like to stay positive in the preseason rather than go to some dark side universe and preach the worst possible scenarios, it works for some but not me!

 

[ASUCHRIS]

The whining on this board will never cease to amaze me.

You want to know what's more annoying than the whining? The "all is good no matter what and if you say anything the least bit critical, you're whining" crew. The team hasn't made the playoffs in 5 years, and there are plenty of legitimate reasons for concern and things to discuss. IT'S A MESSAGE BOARD!!

If all you want is sunshine and rainbows, just tune into state TV! I'm sure guys like Jurecki will tell you about how great everything is, and you can live in your little bubble where everything Cards is always happy and positive.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You want to know what's more annoying than the whining? The "all is good no matter what and if you say anything the least bit critical, you're whining" crew. The team hasn't made the playoffs in 5 years, and there are plenty of legitimate reasons for concern and things to discuss. IT'S A MESSAGE BOARD!!

If all you want is sunshine and rainbows, just tune into state TV! I'm sure guys like Jurecki will tell you about how great everything is, and you can live in your little bubble where everything Cards is always happy and positive.

Shut your mouth Chris! You have no idea how good you have it with a GM who’s been around for 8 seasons, taking the team to the playoffs an amazing 2 times, winning 1 awe inspiring game and has only missed the playoffs 5 years in a row!

 

[Stout]

I've watched them too, I have not missed a game yet, be it Live, Radio or TV. I just like to stay positive in the preseason rather than go to some dark side universe and preach the worst possible scenarios, it works for some but not me!

Hey, when you're pessimistic, anything positive is absolute gravy

 

[Solar7]

Hey, when you're pessimistic, anything positive is absolute gravy

This. If I set reasonable expectations, then I can't help but be even happier when things go right. It's absolutely terrible to have sky high expectations and then flop hard, like 2016 and 2017.

 

[Garthshort]

Think it's fair to say that since KK has been here we're trending up. Maybe not as fast as some would like, but 'up' nevertheless.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

no one on this board knows how well he handles his present responsiblities.

"A lot of people are great at that, managing games, and that’s not my strong suit"

 

[BritCard]

Don't disagree with the overall tenor but the "bold" is a bit too definitive for me.

Maybe. Let's say shows a lack of interest then.

 

[PACardsFan]

The coaching carousel is partly because they never seem to pick the right coach (aside from Arians), who was fired as a coach in Arizona that went on to being a success as a head coach elsewhere? History doesn't show the team made poor decisions firing coaches, they just made poor decisions hiring them.

Arians wasn’t fired. He supposedly retired. When ownership continuously makes poor choices on who they hire, then the problem is still with ownership.

 

[PACardsFan]

'Cause we've done so great in recent years that gives us such optimism. I mean, who should complain about how last year went?

Worst team in Cardinal history in 2018. Improved to 5 wins in 2019, and then 8 wins last year. Last year’s team was nowhere near a finished product. Without Murray, that’s a 4 win team. Maybe 5. They’ve added talent & depth. I expect more progress this season. When the W’s start going in descending order, then I’ll be the first one in line calling for changes. Until then, I’m fine with steady progress.

 

[Stout]

Worst team in Cardinal history in 2018. Improved to 5 wins in 2019, and then 8 wins last year. Last year’s team was nowhere near a finished product. Without Murray, that’s a 4 win team. Maybe 5. They’ve added talent & depth. I expect more progress this season. When the W’s start going in descending order, then I’ll be the first one in line calling for changes. Until then, I’m fine with steady progress.

You are WAY too easy to please. The NFL isn't an "incremental progress" league. Teams routinely turn it around in one season; you're happy that we had a 2-game improvement over the "worst team in Cardinal history." That would have been better if last season would have seen much progress, but we really didn't. Same glaring mistakes, same bone-headed decisions, and, after two seasons, adding the #1 QB and arguably the best WR out there, we made it to .500. Whoopdy doo. Barely squeaking into the playoffs would be more incremental progress, and guess what? That puts us behind the 8-ball with KM's contract, and we'll have spent his first three years making incremental progress. NOT GOOD ENOUGH. Can we progress more than incrementally this season? It's possible. KK doesn't inspire confidence in me that he can manage that.

 

[AZCardsWin]

Well, he absolutely should be on the hot seat. It's been six years since he's had a winning season at any level of football and total he only has two, in 9 years of coaching. Any thought he's suddenly going to become a consistent winner is just optimism on overdrive.

Running the QB option (with a hurt KM) vs Rams on a 3rd and 18 and then punting the season away on 4th down will do that. KK has a A LOT to prove in 2021.