DeAnna
Just A Face in The Crowd
Ouch! It hurts my ears just reading all of Cheese's diatribes! (nothing new, tho 
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Playoffs - Clippers @ Suns Game 2 Thread 5/10/2006- Yahoo -ESPN previews
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elindholm
edited for content
The best example was the game where everyone was complaining about Marion missing layups so I went and counted and he had missed 3 layups to Nash's 2 missed layups.
Didn't you say you were just going by the Yahoo play-by-play? That's notoriously inaccurate. I remember that game pretty well, and Marion had several point-blank misses. Whether the online loggers counted them as "layups" or not, I can't say, but they all should have been made.
It's the inability to finish at the rim that is bothering me the most. His overall numbers aren't down too much, but his FG% is terrible. He's basically proving that he can't be counted on to finish even a basic play, and that is hurting the Suns big-time. When the other team knows that they can get away with paying less than full attention to Marion, it has strategic ramifications across the entire game plan.
Didn't you say you were just going by the Yahoo play-by-play? That's notoriously inaccurate. I remember that game pretty well, and Marion had several point-blank misses. Whether the online loggers counted them as "layups" or not, I can't say, but they all should have been made.
It's the inability to finish at the rim that is bothering me the most. His overall numbers aren't down too much, but his FG% is terrible. He's basically proving that he can't be counted on to finish even a basic play, and that is hurting the Suns big-time. When the other team knows that they can get away with paying less than full attention to Marion, it has strategic ramifications across the entire game plan.
It was NBA.Com's play by play. It may have been inaccurate, who knows.
I just was interested in the actual comparison of numbers.
I just was interested in the actual comparison of numbers.
jibikao
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Let's assume that Marion plays SF on this team (his natural position for his size), do you think he can still produce 20/10? We are like the biggest mismatch in NBA due to our fast ball and speed. Marion takes FULL advantage of that. That's why he "shot" well during regular season. Most of his points are from fast breaks or easy dunks. The trouble is you just don't see these that much in playoffs (against good tall defense-oriented team).
Let's assume we have a lot less fast breaks and easy dunks, what else can Marion provide to justify his max. contract?
- He has very inconsistent outside shooting.
- He has almost no post-up game.
- He may be able to penetrate defense if he is determined to drive but can he finish strong? Those rainbow drops can be very inconsistent.
- He is one of the worst passers on the team.
Marion is probably the only one going after offensive rebounds but when you put a big guy on him (who actually sticks with him), Marion has no chance getting rebound (just like last night). I am not blaming Marion but what else can Marion do to bring more to the team when he is like the highest paid? He can't carry a team.
Last night is a bad example because the whole team sucked (starting with Marion). But this is not the first time we see Marion complaining about not getting respect. He got selected to all-star 2 times in a row and got player of the month. What else more does he want?
Yes, he IS supposed to produce 20/10 as a 6'7 if he wants to keep that max. contract. If not, I don't see the point of paying him that much. He is primarily a "role player". And trading Marion for KG is not dumping Marion. It's about upgrading the team.
Let's assume we have a lot less fast breaks and easy dunks, what else can Marion provide to justify his max. contract?
- He has very inconsistent outside shooting.
- He has almost no post-up game.
- He may be able to penetrate defense if he is determined to drive but can he finish strong? Those rainbow drops can be very inconsistent.
- He is one of the worst passers on the team.
Marion is probably the only one going after offensive rebounds but when you put a big guy on him (who actually sticks with him), Marion has no chance getting rebound (just like last night). I am not blaming Marion but what else can Marion do to bring more to the team when he is like the highest paid? He can't carry a team.
Last night is a bad example because the whole team sucked (starting with Marion). But this is not the first time we see Marion complaining about not getting respect. He got selected to all-star 2 times in a row and got player of the month. What else more does he want?
Yes, he IS supposed to produce 20/10 as a 6'7 if he wants to keep that max. contract. If not, I don't see the point of paying him that much. He is primarily a "role player". And trading Marion for KG is not dumping Marion. It's about upgrading the team.
I don't wonder if he hasn't been missing point blank shots all year and it just wasn't as magnified because it wasn't the playoffs.
How will Marion justify his max contract? I imagine he would point to this:
jibikao
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Chris_Sanders said:
What about playoff stats?
19 and 7jibikao said:
13 and 9
20 and 7
20 and 12
21 and 9
20 and 12
14 and 10
20 and 15
13 and 6
Quite interesting that game 2 in both series were his low points. I wonder if that trend will hold up. Outside of his FG%, his numbers are good. Like Eric said, he simply isn't finishing and needs to work at that. Dunks instead of layups. Don't settle for the 8' foot jumper if you can fly to the hole.
jibikao
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Chris_Sanders said:
Game 2 in round 1 is also one of the worst, as a team. I don't know why Marion doesn't want to dunk more. The last layup he missed before going to half time is the worst of all. He could easily dunk if he wanted to and we could have cut it down to 10pt which psychologically is a lot more acceptable than 14pt deficit. I don't blame Marion for last night's loss but he seems to kill the crowd with those misses.
Marion has to find his range for the remaining of the series. Clipper will not let him drive inside that easy.
myrondizzo
Hall of Famer
actually heard that over the past 2 seasons we are 1-4 in game 2's the only win was against memphis last year. dont know if it means anything except maybe they adjust to our running game and then we have make further adjustments. i was at the game and marion look really flat. but so did everyone else. you could see it in warmups the shots just werent falling. i wish i could have changed my prediction after watching warmups. jones was really off in warm ups my dad even said i hope he isnt this bad in the game (he was). i wish coach would have put grant out there on brand because we need someone with some hustle out there.Chris_Sanders said:
nowagimp
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Gaddabout said:
Even if his light is red, his defender will be roaming in the lane, clogging it for Diaw, Nash and Barbosa.
elindholm
edited for content
I don't wonder if he hasn't been missing point blank shots all year and it just wasn't as magnified because it wasn't the playoffs.
That's possible, but something has to explain why his FG% is ten points lower than it was in the regular season.
That's possible, but something has to explain why his FG% is ten points lower than it was in the regular season.
I'm glad Marion is a Sun and all, but I'm not sure how anybody can defend his game last night.
To me, stats can be grossly misleading. Who gives a crap if someone gets a meaningless loose ball rebound? And, how many times does Marion get his own rebound after missing a chippy?
Bottom line... I want to see Marion hustling his ass off on D (taking charges, changing shots, getting his hands in the passing lane, tipping the ball, etc). Tha's his game.
I never, ever want to see Marion attempt a 3-pointer from anywhere but the baseline.
And, I want him going strong to the hole. Enough of this finger roll crap, pansy crap.
Bottom line (part II): If Marion continues to play like he did last night (going through the motions)... the Clips will win the series.
If Marion plays like "regular-season" Marion... the Suns will win the series.
It's that simple. My money is on Marion returning to form.
To me, stats can be grossly misleading. Who gives a crap if someone gets a meaningless loose ball rebound? And, how many times does Marion get his own rebound after missing a chippy?
Bottom line... I want to see Marion hustling his ass off on D (taking charges, changing shots, getting his hands in the passing lane, tipping the ball, etc). Tha's his game.
I never, ever want to see Marion attempt a 3-pointer from anywhere but the baseline.
And, I want him going strong to the hole. Enough of this finger roll crap, pansy crap.
Bottom line (part II): If Marion continues to play like he did last night (going through the motions)... the Clips will win the series.
If Marion plays like "regular-season" Marion... the Suns will win the series.
It's that simple. My money is on Marion returning to form.
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sly fly said:
can I take that bet? Hell, either way I win! Gotta get something out of the Tortilla after all!
Come on Soft - SHOW UP AND MAKE ME EAT CROW!
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