Polarized Thinking Has Taken Over this Board and I'm Sick of It

[Stout]

Read my post again. I didn’t say “you” did, I said others did. But you never attacked those players as you have kyler 1, 2, 3 games into his professional career. So is it just the volume of people hailing him as the savior? Because I recall very similar experience on here with matty L and I don’t recall it “flipping you out” (I mean why do you care that much about what other people think of a dude they haven’t see play a snap of pro ball?).

Except I'm NOT attacking KM. I'm criticizing aspects of his play, yes, but also, with every post, saying it's early and that he has ample time to correct his mistakes and develop into what we want and need him to be. And he certainly has shown flashes of that along the way, especially early in the last game and in the 4th quarter almost comeback. Except some posters here take issue, because nobody's allowed to criticize him at all, apparently.

 

[BradMannTX]

You weren’t around in the early years. It’s been polarized like this before, it’s just been a long time. And I don’t think the entire board was ever polarized to this extent about a single player, which is nuts to me.

What I think the board lacks is a general sense of humor. Back in the dark ages we had battles on here but there was always humor attached. Then Section 11 left, and took the humor with him. Effin’ Section 11. All his fault.

So I looked back and my first post on this board was 2003. Almost got banned in 2008. I was on the previous board, too. Sorry, cannot remember the name.

It HAS been as bad or worse.

Jake Plummer comes to mind.

 

[PACardsFan]

Please tell me that you were joking in this post, because this is a freaking joke of a post. Talk about feeding the toxicity of the board--and then completely ignoring it when a poster points it out--and then doubling down by complaining about the toxicity this late in the week! I mean, wow!

You want to know what the problem is? It isn't that some posters want KM to fail or are just negative by nature. The problem is that some posters WILL NOT ADMIT ANY CRITICISM FOR KM. Period. Anything, the smallest negative, gets brushed under the rug and decried.

Well, he's a rookie, and he's playing like a rookie, which means he's making boneheaded plays. AND THAT'S OKAY. What I don't like, what I don't think is okay, is the continued idolization of KM.

The point is that 3 games into his rookie season, there is NO reason to criticize a kid that has showed more promise than 95% of Cardinal players EVER at this stage in their career. Why the hell do you care if some on this board want to support K1. Why does that offend you?? The mistakes he's made are very few and far between. No one on this board ever expected complete perfection, especially in year 1 with a team with limited talent. Those that are over the top in criticism sound petty.

 

[Outerlimits]

I haven't been here long of course, but I imagine actually seeing the team win a game would improve the mood.

Sure the offense is better than last year, but getting excited over mediocre offense that manages about 20 points a game shows how dire things currently are. Plus our inept defense that makes a young back up QB look like a multi year veteran.


I think Bickley was right in his brief article critical of Keim. If this team doesn't find a way to get a win soon, things could implode and look just as bleak as last year. With the end result of more people getting fired after the season.

 

[BW52]

The point is that 3 games into his rookie season, there is NO reason to criticize a kid that has showed more promise than 95% of Cardinal players EVER at this stage in their career. Why the hell do you care if some on this board want to support K1. Why does that offend you?? The mistakes he's made are very few and far between. No one on this board ever expected complete perfection, especially in year 1 with a team with limited talent. Those that are over the top in criticism sound petty.

Why do you care if someone sees issues with a rookie QB who was hyped to be the "transcendent" game changing never get sacked or throw interceptions and leap tall building with a single bound?Some didn`t buy the BS.Mistakes a few and far between? 16 sacks and 3 interceptions and going belly up late in Carolina game are the exact t5hings you KMfanboys said wouldn`t happen?So its not being petty bringing up issues with the boywonder QB...its reality .

 

[Solar7]

Oy still wailing about the summer. Dude let it go. Live in the present. We have a promising rookie QB. Something we haven’t had in a long time. Watch him (and hope he will) grow. And try to enjoy the little things until this three-games-removed-from-worst-team-the-league team is ready to compete for a playoff spot. He’s going to have growing pains. Expected. Hope he overcomes them.

That's where I am, and have been, but it's not going to keep me from criticizing when appropriate, and praising when appropriate. I'm going to remain skeptical until he proves me otherwise, because at this point he's been more or less what I thought he was going to be (and I know this book has a lot of chapters to still be written), a guy who will show flashes of brilliance and then inconsistency, because the talent around him will never be good enough for him to truly do much.

So, we'll see, I hope he kills it, but I'm still going to remain grated by the posters who want everything to be sunshine and rainbows when it's simply not.

 

[Solar7]

The point is that 3 games into his rookie season, there is NO reason to criticize a kid that has showed more promise than 95% of Cardinal players EVER at this stage in their career. Why the hell do you care if some on this board want to support K1. Why does that offend you?? The mistakes he's made are very few and far between. No one on this board ever expected complete perfection, especially in year 1 with a team with limited talent. Those that are over the top in criticism sound petty.

And those who are over the top in praise sound delusional. I find it completely unbelievable that you think these three games are more promise than 95% of Cardinals players EVER. That's when I get all snarky and want to debate, because it's like you're intentionally ignoring that he played 3 quarters of the worst football I've ever seen against the Lions (where I sat in the family section and heard Kyler get ROASTED by his teammate's friends and family), or the fact that he wasn't able to score a touchdown in his second.

I didn't watch anything but the 4th quarter of the Panthers game, so I won't speak to that. But still. He's somewhere in the 20s for the QB position, and that's not the production I was fed all offseason. That's the kind of production that is going to lose people their jobs, preach patience or not.

 

[cardpa]

After three games I would say Murray has been a tease. Plays well enough at times to give you hope and then boom, dashes it against the rocks. Some may not like the analogy but it's pretty much a good description of his play so far this season. The long term question is will he always be a tease or will he be better than that. Glimpses of excellence and then sequences of despair.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

After three games I would say Murray has been a tease. Plays well enough at times to give you hope and then boom, dashes it against the rocks. Some may not like the analogy but it's pretty much a good description of his play so far this season. The long term question is will he always be a tease or will he be better than that. Glimpses of excellence and then sequences of despair.

Assuming he hasn't peaked in his first 3 games than I suspect he will get better and more consistent.

 

[BW52]

And those who are over the top in praise sound delusional. I find it completely unbelievable that you think these three games are more promise than 95% of Cardinals players EVER. That's when I get all snarky and want to debate, because it's like you're intentionally ignoring that he played 3 quarters of the worst football I've ever seen against the Lions (where I sat in the family section and heard Kyler get ROASTED by his teammate's friends and family), or the fact that he wasn't able to score a touchdown in his second.

I didn't watch anything but the 4th quarter of the Panthers game, so I won't speak to that. But still. He's somewhere in the 20s for the QB position, and that's not the production I was fed all offseason. That's the kind of production that is going to lose people their jobs, preach patience or not.

Well said Solar.Bravo.

 

[Buckybird]

That's where I am, and have been, but it's not going to keep me from criticizing when appropriate, and praising when appropriate. I'm going to remain skeptical until he proves me otherwise, because at this point he's been more or less what I thought he was going to be (and I know this book has a lot of chapters to still be written), a guy who will show flashes of brilliance and then inconsistency, because the talent around him will never be good enough for him to truly do much.

So, we'll see, I hope he kills it, but I'm still going to remain grated by the posters who want everything to be sunshine and rainbows when it's simply not.

Good lord he’s a rookie starting NFL QB, that’s what they do. And no, not all of them “show flashes of brilliance” as you say. No doubt KM has in just 3 games. Sit back & enjoy the ride it’s gonna be awesome

 

[HoodieBets]

Good lord he’s a rookie starting NFL QB, that’s what they do. And no, not all of them “show flashes of brilliance” as you say. No doubt KM has in just 3 games. Sit back & enjoy the ride it’s gonna be awesome

So if his whole rookie year is like this just continuous flashes with periods of incompetence is that okay? What if he ends with the same amount of wins as rosen had with a better roster than last year? I guess the question is when does the newlywed phase end and he gets criticized like every other player on the field?


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[gimpy]

Like that already hasn't happened.

 

[Harry]

First my only problem is posts that attack posters instead of dealing with their post’s content. It’s okay if they disagree or are extreme either positive or negative if they have a basis for their position we can discuss it. Second I criticize much. I figure it’s easier to see what went right rhan wrong, so I try to explain why. So they blast me for being negative. I think I’m objective. Either way it’s a point of view. In the end this board is just a fun place to play, not real life. Try not to let it spill over to the rest of your world.

 

[blindseyed]

First my only problem is posts that attack posters instead of dealing with their post’s content. It’s okay if they disagree or are extreme either positive or negative if they have a basis for their position we can discuss it. Second I criticize much. I figure it’s easier to see what went right rhan wrong, so I try to explain why. So they blast me for being negative. I think I’m objective. Either way it’s a point of view. In the end this board is just a fun place to play, not real life. Try not to let it spill over to the rest of your world.

Well then I'm going to criticize your critique of your criticism because if you only criticized to criticize the criticizer why is the criticizing not criticized instead of criticizing.......wait...what are we talking about again?

 

[Stout]

The point is that 3 games into his rookie season, there is NO reason to criticize a kid that has showed more promise than 95% of Cardinal players EVER at this stage in their career. Why the hell do you care if some on this board want to support K1. Why does that offend you?? The mistakes he's made are very few and far between. No one on this board ever expected complete perfection, especially in year 1 with a team with limited talent. Those that are over the top in criticism sound petty.

And there it is. Thank you so much for completely making my point.

No reason to criticize a QB that has literally sacked himself? Again, proving my point. I don't at all hate KM, but will of course criticize his rookie mistakes. For you? He's the second coming.

 

[PACardsFan]

And there it is. Thank you so much for completely making my point.

No reason to criticize a QB that has literally sacked himself? Again, proving my point. I don't at all hate KM, but will of course criticize his rookie mistakes. For you? He's the second coming.

Just don't come crawling back wanting to kiss his a$$ down the road. You're OUT. Down the road, you can talk about the D, our running game, etc, etc. But, your comments regarding K1 will ring hollow. No room for fair weather fans.

 

[Stout]

Just don't come crawling back wanting to kiss his a$$ down the road. You're OUT. Down the road, you can talk about the D, our running game, etc, etc. But, your comments regarding K1 will ring hollow. No room for fair weather fans.

LOL I'm out? PA, I've been talking about how he's shown flashes and I'm encouraged by him. Contrary to your belief, he can make boneheaded rookie mistakes AND still have great potential, and people can believe BOTH. I just refuse to crown him as like the greatest ever, duh, already. Because he is CLEARLY not already better than 95% of Cards players ever.

Then again, you put him in the HoF in the offseason, so why am I arguing? Look, you can have these insanely high and totally unrealistic expectations for him. There's nothing wrong with that. Have fun! The problem is slinging mud at others because they don't 100 percent agree with you.

 

[Stout]

Just don't come crawling back wanting to kiss his a$$ down the road. You're OUT. Down the road, you can talk about the D, our running game, etc, etc. But, your comments regarding K1 will ring hollow. No room for fair weather fans.

Also, to those wondering why my lot are still arguing and just can't leave it be? This. This is why.

 

[PACardsFan]

LOL I'm out? PA, I've been talking about how he's shown flashes and I'm encouraged by him. Contrary to your belief, he can make boneheaded rookie mistakes AND still have great potential, and people can believe BOTH. I just refuse to crown him as like the greatest ever, duh, already. Because he is CLEARLY not already better than 95% of Cards players ever.

Then again, you put him in the HoF in the offseason, so why am I arguing? Look, you can have these insanely high and totally unrealistic expectations for him. There's nothing wrong with that. Have fun! The problem is slinging mud at others because they don't 100 percent agree with you.

I said that 3 games in, he was better than 95% of Cardinal players that I have seen. And I'll stand by that. Only OJ Anderson & Boldin showed similar potential 3 games into their careers. I never had him in the HOF during the offseason, because frankly, that's impossible. No rookie can be perfect, but K1 is as exciting a rookie Cardinal player as I have seen following this team for 55+ years. Especially at the QB position. If you can't embrace his potential, and stop bickering over small failures, then you have something personal that you dislike about him.

 

[PACardsFan]

Also, to those wondering why my lot are still arguing and just can't leave it be? This. This is why.

Exactly! Your lot?? So you admit that your group of malcontents only find miniscule issues to complain about because some on this board want to pour their heart & soul into supporting K1. That's what real fans do. If K1 doesn't have the career that is expected, your "lot" will embrace that in order to somehow get even with those of us that supported him wholeheartedly. That's just plain mean spirited & is counter productive on what is supposed to be a FAN forum.

 

[Stout]

Exactly! Your lot?? So you admit that your group of malcontents only find miniscule issues to complain about because some on this board want to pour their heart & soul into supporting K1. That's what real fans do. If K1 doesn't have the career that is expected, your "lot" will embrace that in order to somehow get even with those of us that supported him wholeheartedly. That's just plain mean spirited & is counter productive on what is supposed to be a FAN forum.

And there it is again. I refuse to pour my heart and soul into supporting KM, so I'm not a real fan. I'm not a blind freaking homer, so I'm not a real fan. What an absolute joke of a stance. If anyone says "if you're not X, you're not a real fan," then they're being judgmental and myopic.

I support KM just like I would any other player, and I'll come down on him for screwing up, just like I will on any other player. It just so happens you anointed him a HOFer before the season, so you and your "lot" very much set the agenda. I remember your lot trying to eviscerate me in the offseason for lack of blind homerism. Didn't work then, and it won't work now.

I said that 3 games in, he was better than 95% of Cardinal players that I have seen. And I'll stand by that. Only OJ Anderson & Boldin showed similar potential 3 games into their careers. I never had him in the HOF during the offseason, because frankly, that's impossible. No rookie can be perfect, but K1 is as exciting a rookie Cardinal player as I have seen following this team for 55+ years. Especially at the QB position. If you can't embrace his potential, and stop bickering over small failures, then you have something personal that you dislike about him.

Now that is an important distinction, a good filter for your argument. It's a reasonable opinion, IMO. If we could meet at this point and both root for the kid to do better as he develops, this would be a great board.

Now, you DID have him in the HOF during the offseason, because you claimed he was already better than many HOF players. That is de facto placing him in the Hall. Ludicrous, of course.

Your second bolded spot is at least a little bit of an admission that he hasn't been what you've been saying in these threads: perfect. Which is nothing more than reasonable, saying he isn't perfect.

Look, I have constantly embraced his potential. At every turn, on every thread. If I have to qualify my opinion one more time by saying that I see his potential and that he has room to improve I'll puke. Here ya go, for the last time: KM HAS THE POTENTIAL TO DEVELOP INTO A FRANCHISE QB. That's about as reasonable a statement as there can be.

 

[HoodieBets]

Just don't come crawling back wanting to kiss his a$$ down the road. You're OUT. Down the road, you can talk about the D, our running game, etc, etc. But, your comments regarding K1 will ring hollow. No room for fair weather fans.

Dude you are ridiculous. The second you question anyone on here’s fandom you just turn yourself into a clown. Who the hell would chose to be a fair weather cardinal fan? Also better than 95% of all time cardinals? He’s not even a top 5 QB for this franchise YET. You are doing the same thing you are calling everyone out about on the other side except they haven’t called you a fair weather fan and your out.


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[PACardsFan]

And there it is again. I refuse to pour my heart and soul into supporting KM, so I'm not a real fan. I'm not a blind freaking homer, so I'm not a real fan. What an absolute joke of a stance. If anyone says "if you're not X, you're not a real fan," then they're being judgmental and myopic.

I support KM just like I would any other player, and I'll come down on him for screwing up, just like I will on any other player. It just so happens you anointed him a HOFer before the season, so you and your "lot" very much set the agenda. I remember your lot trying to eviscerate me in the offseason for lack of blind homerism. Didn't work then, and it won't work now.



Now that is an important distinction, a good filter for your argument. It's a reasonable opinion, IMO. If we could meet at this point and both root for the kid to do better as he develops, this would be a great board.

Now, you DID have him in the HOF during the offseason, because you claimed he was already better than many HOF players. That is de facto placing him in the Hall. Ludicrous, of course.

Your second bolded spot is at least a little bit of an admission that he hasn't been what you've been saying in these threads: perfect. Which is nothing more than reasonable, saying he isn't perfect.

Look, I have constantly embraced his potential. At every turn, on every thread. If I have to qualify my opinion one more time by saying that I see his potential and that he has room to improve I'll puke. Here ya go, for the last time: KM HAS THE POTENTIAL TO DEVELOP INTO A FRANCHISE QB. That's about as reasonable a statement as there can be.

No one is perfect, so I’m sure I didn’t say that. I’ll emphasize what he does well. His detractors will emphasize his mistakes, even if his mistakes pale in comparison. That’s the difference right now between the Pro-Murray group and the other “lot”.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Exactly! Your lot?? So you admit that your group of malcontents only find miniscule issues to complain about because some on this board want to pour their heart & soul into supporting K1. That's what real fans do. If K1 doesn't have the career that is expected, your "lot" will embrace that in order to somehow get even with those of us that supported him wholeheartedly. That's just plain mean spirited & is counter productive on what is supposed to be a FAN forum.

I am not sure why this debate continues on either side.

"We will see...."

There. Done.

That is the only fact. For Murray, for Kingsbury, etc.

Any statement outside of that is opinion. I state mine and leave it be.

Someone gets butthurt from my opinion, and says I am not a fan? *yawn*

That happens EVERY YEAR.

If the same poster says it enough and that is ALL they say? Ignore.

I will root for the team and talk about them however I want. If people do not like it, I am sure I will sleep well.

Seriously, I blame politics. Some people, not all and not PACardsfan, these days will burn down thier house with everything they live for inside just to be "right" or even worse just to "piss someone else off".

Its football, it is not important.

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